A song i am working on

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hessmetal

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Hello all! i have been working on this song in my head for a few weeks now and finally decided to get something recorded.

this is definately just kind of a rough thing right now (hence all the humming, you'll see) but i think i like the structure and melody. just wanted to see what you guys think.

a little info first. on this recording, it is just me, but there will be a female vocal harmony over the entire thing probably. we have worked some out, just havent had time to record it yet and her voice is very pretty and soft so when we practice it, it sounds awesome. i dont have the lyrics finished yet or even really a title, so there is some wandering humming, i tend to do that when recording demos..

i posted this here because im more interested in the songwriting aspect of it and not so much the recording at this stage, but here are the recording specs just for the hell of it.

guitar. one guitar with an sm57 at 12 fret aimed at about the 17th fret, and a *ehmm* behringer b-1 directly over the bridge. a little compression on both and a scoop at about 100k (capo 7 so theres some weird midrangy stuff)

vocals. sm57 and kind of heavy compression as i am singing a little soft on this one.

im not really the biggest fan of my voice but it is what it is i guess, please be honest though! :)

so here it is.
http://www.lightningmp3.com/live/file.php?id=16597
 
The structure and the melody sounds fine to me. There is a whimsy about this piece that you should make the most of. You have a pleasant voice that has a touch of McCartney about it, and that's the impression I get from the song as a whole . . . around about White Album era.

It's a bit difficult to get a sense of the track as a whole, because so much is under construction, but there is a danger of it being a bit bland and unexciting unless you take steps to add dynamic contrasts. I expect you've got these in mind already.

Lyrically . . . it looks like it's heading to be a pleasant love song . . . and here is another area where you have to steer clear of the rocky reefs of cliche. For example, the line "tell me something to calm me down" dips its toes into this treacherous water, but "tell me you'll always be around" plunges headfirst in.You're at a stage of development with this song where you have the chance to examine the lyrics critically to see whether there are places where you can impose your own words (rather than what everybody else in the whole world has said).

I won't be too critical with the recording, because I know it's only in 'draft' stage, but there are some things to watch out for:

1 Watch the popping on the 'B's and'P's. See, for example, the 'B' in "Right before you leave", the first line of the song. Solutions are: learning not to pop these consonants, using a pop filter, and not singing directly into the mike.

2 There is a boominess in the guitar, centred around a D note. Have a play with EQ at about 160hz or about 320hz . . . I'm not sure which octave it is. You've used two mikes, and I think you've mixed these together to form the single track. It's worth trying keeping these tracks as separate tracks, panning one a bit left and one a bit right. This will make the guitar sound fuller.

3 There appears to be some high tinkly stuff at the beginning which is really nice. I couldn't figure what you were doing here, but it's worth developing.

Finally, don't apologise for your gear ("*ehmm* behringer b-1"). We all work with what we've got. Some are more fortunate in being able to afford higher-end gear, but a lot of us (including me) make do with what we can scrape together.

I am excited in anticipaation of the final version . . . I'm curious to know how it will end up. So keep working on it!
 
thanks gecko zzed for your thoughts!!!

first, i completely agree with the "lyrically bland" aspect. its been kind of a struggle finding my own completely original idea. yes i suppose it is going to turn out into a sort of love song, but i would like to add a bit of sarcasm or something to take some of the seriousness away so its not so uncomfortable as its been done. and im kind of new to the side of the fence where im in control of the writing. in my "band" (its just me and her and its kind of folky, she has done most of the lyrics) but im getting old and would rather just dive in and see what i got. ive always been more on the production side of things and have just been curious and anxious to kind of find my voice as a songwriter.

i will keep working on ideas that might not be so predicted!:)

as for dynamics, i do have lots of ideas to bring in but not sure if it will seem overdone, kind of was thinking of keeping it as simple as possible, but maybe vocally or a small slide guitar later in the track or something.

as for the popping, i just did not even use a pop filter because well, i just forgot. got caught up in getting a melody recorded, all my "technique" went right out the window. lol.

guitar. i did record the 2 tracks separate and hard panned drummers perspective. will try to rerecord when we get the song finished, but its a bit tough to play so we'll see how that goes.

anyway, thank you so much for your quick response and very helpful words!! and especially for the mcartney reference!! the way i figure, its just time to stop worrying about wether its good or not and just do it. its the only way to really know i suppose.

i will keep working!!:D
 
Sounds like a nice basis to a song!

The sort of acoustic music i'm into - sounds quite Elliott Smith like to me.

I really like the fast pace picked guitar part. The melody is good, but get's a bit repertitive; although I think that by adding a female harmony it will def make this more interesting melodically.

I didn't listen to the lyrics too thoroughly, but I think you wanna stay clear of the traditional love song unless that's what you're going for. Like Gecko said- maybe try and explore some of the lyrical themes that he suggested.

I look forward to hearing the finished copy! Good luck!
 
yeah you guys are totally right about the love song thing. being amateur at writing lyrics, its been hard for me to write something other than all the cliches known to man, so i am working on that.

i think we may be recording saturday together, so im looking forward to adding the female voice!

till then, vigorous lyric writing!

thanks again!
 
Here is a tip . . .

Start by writing the words that 'command' themselves to be written, i.e. the ones that first spring to your mind, whether or not they are cliches. And even just 'dum de dum dum dum' if that's all there is at the moment. They will help develop the form of the song, and set the overall flavour.

Once you've got this scaffolding in place, you can be more critical of the words, and start figuring out whether what you've written has been written before, and if so, can you find alternatives.
 
Hi hessmetal,

I thought it was great. I'm most envious of your voice - I thought Paul McC with a touch of Radiohead's Thom Yorke. The music seemed to be shaping up well too, at its current stage.

The lyric thing is quite a twister. It really seems to depend on who you want to reach. For some audiences, a predictable love song with a string of cliches goes down a treat. The simpler and more obvious the better. For other markets the opposite is true, you can cobble together the most obscure nonsense, and if you've got the right sound, look and clothes for the job then the fans think you're the deepest thing on the planet. :cool:

One way to tackle it is to write whatever comes naturally. Spill it out until you've got something to work with and then go through with your blue cliche pencil and change them - even if it's only just enough to get away with it. Familiar images, situations and words do work - people connect quickly with them. You just need balance the fresh with the familiar. The market for easy to understand Lerv songs will never dry up. Ever.

It's also worth thinking about what actually sticks in your head when you hear a song. In my experience it's rarely a whole set of lyrics. I can barely remember my own lyrics, let all those of a popular song. There's usually a key phrase, a chorus or snatch here and there that sticks. Lyrics hooks as well as musical hooks, as it were. So if you can arrange to stick something cool and memorable in your lyrics, often right on top of your musical hooks, then you can get away with a fair bit of fluff in between.

I think of it as arranging the meaty bits in the right spots and adding the chopped lettuce and coloured salad veg neatly around the edges. You don't need to be able to count every mushroom and slice of tomato, but the steak needs to really sizzle. Unless you have a singer with excellent diction and an attentive audience it's actually quite hard to tell a detailed story in a song and get it all across, no matter what its literary merits on the page.

Instead, there's a sort of lyric voodoo that's as intriguingly slippery as the one for music. The most atrocious tosh, or seemingly bland stuff can sometimes be turned into much loved and much sung snatches of lyrics that define a whole song - or even become part of the image of a whole band.

Even what we think of as 'good stuff' can look fairly ordinary on the page. For example - WE WILL ROCK YOU! Four obvious looking words that just effortlessly created a whole soundscape and scene in my head. :D BYE BYE MISS AMERICAN PIE (and what exactly does that mean anyway) , but millions of people's faces still light up a little when they hear it, and they can then sing ... well.. usually only two or three more fairly obscure but curiously evocative phrases about levies and chevies that are nevertheless a perfect fit for the music behind them. And millions of old fogeys like me instantly get taken on trip back in time...

Looking forward to hearing it as it grows.

Cheers,

Chris
 
It is true that cliches have an important part to play in songwriting, because they provide that highly desirable link between the familiar and the novel. And they make particularly good titles and hooks.

Within this forum, though, we have little context in which to evaluate a set of lyrics. We don't know much about motivation, intended audience or any of the factors determining the final shape of a song.

Because of that absence of context, when I look at lyrics, I take a very subjective approach, and there are characteristics that I value considerably, such as skills in wordcraft, and originality of images, themes and expressions. Those characteristics don't necessarily result in a great song or a commercial (or even artistic) success, but they demonstrate to me (even if no-one else) that the writer is paying close attention to his or her craft, and is thinking hard about his or her work.

So even though I acknowledge the value of cliches, I would much rather that writers come up with phrases that become purloined by others . . . i.e. they create their own future cliches. Someone long ago had to be the first one to use "I can't live without you" in a song.
 
to cliche or not to cliche. haha.

thank you guys so much for your advice! has been extremely helpful! its always nice to have outside opinions and shared knowledge!! and i think the very subjective approach is great! its like no strings attached gods honest truth and that to me is very very necessary.

as for lyrics, i guess its just something i keep telling myself will just happen and they'll be great,but in reality, it really does take deep thought and a good approach to writing.

as for the song, i think i have a good idea on where i want it to go, and as soon as i finish it, i will post!!

kind of wish i had a cello to record.. or learn to play, then record.. :)
 
hessmetal said:
kind of wish i had a cello to record.. or learn to play, then record.. :)
Click to expand...

Coincidence! I was thinking the same thing yesterday. A friend owns the local music shop and has an inexpensive student cello that I could get quite cheaply.... temptation...temptation....:rolleyes:

There are several alternatives for you though. One is to get somebody else to do a cello track for you (one of the great things about the net is that you can share input like that). Another is to fake it yourself. I have a relatively cheap arranger keyboard that does a passable imitation of a number of instruments (although some others are terrible). I could also use the keyboard to make a midi of a cello track and then use a virtual instrument voice in, for instance, Cubase. I have a good cello sound for that - legitimately downloaded free from somebody who had sampled a competent cellist. You probably wouldn't want to try writing a cello concerto that way, but for colouring up a backing track it seems OK. Instead of using the keyboard to generate the midi I could also write it using standard notation in something like Finale.

But that cello does look nice, and you can't fake all the dynamics with software (At least I can't. Experts would probably disagree.). I wouldn't have even considered getting something like that (decades of study required, right??) if I hadn't seen my young friend Dan (the music shop owner's son) take it up. He's a guitar playing rocker. The very sight of him anywhere near a cello was startling and unexpected. :eek: Then he bought it for himself! Within days he had learned a few basic notes.... just enough to be able to play a simple bass line. And then Roy turned up with a mandolin so we had two rhythm guitars, a lead mandolin, and a cello playing as the bass.... and it was not only a lot of fun, it sounded great too. :cool:

Cheers,

Chris
 
First off, the music is very good. Especially for a rough cut.
Second, I know just what you mean about the whole love song thing. I was writing a song that had started as one but then took a quite different turn. It's probably one of my most favored songs by friends and family. Plus it got me a following in the Netherlands (that still cracks me up).
Check it out.
www.myspace.com/formantshift then click on Dead (if the name doesnt give you a hint).
I've written so many love songs that I could put out about 5 CDs worth but that's not the way I am trying to go with my music.

But once again, the music was great for a rough draft. Can't wait to hear the final cut.
 
I definitely like it. At this stage it's very nice and i wish i could write tunes like that myself!
 
Very nice tune. The music fits the lyrics and vice versa. You're on to something good here...
 
Thanks everyone!!

i really appreciate all the replies! i got a little sidetracked for the past couple days.

not sure if everyone works like me, but im constantly working on about 5 songs at a time, this one was just one i thought might be a little more promising, so still havent finished it yet, but i do have quite a bit more done on it!

thinking more about the lyrics, when i wrote the music i did have a kind of mind set on what it would be about and im still (yes still) trying to refine that, but it has been a much more enjoyable experience with all the help of you guys!! im still new to the boards, but am starting to really feel at home!!

anyways, i promise the second i get it finished, i will post!!

just on a side note, ive been really concentrating on lyric writing lately and something that has helped me is writing about something not so deep or whatever and maybe something a little more fun..or morbid. or something.

i found this song idea generator

http://www.heuristicsinc.com/sfgen.shtml

and just for practice, began just writing about some pretty random stuff. kind of eliminates the stress of writing about personal or revealing things and actually gets kind of humorous.

anyway, hope to have "kiss me on the cheek" finished this week sometime!
 
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