2014 Daw Build.

  • Thread starter Thread starter ShanPeyton
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That helps somewhat yes. And i sort of assumed that much i just didn't get right down to the nitty gritty. 0's and 1's if you will. But it does help and it is reassuring. I am looking more into the quality "accessories" as well. 7200 RPM hard drives will be no contest and i am strongly considering putting my OS and programs on a SSD. the nice thing about that website i mentioned is that they do source their parts for you for the best price of all the online retailers, newegg, amazon and tigerdirect seem to be the most common names that they use. They also have a feature to notify you of price drops of the peripherals you need from the retailers of your choice. One trend i have noticed so far is that RAM, SSD's and HDD's are prone to the biggest price drops. I got an email notification as i usually do and Amazon had 4 mushkin's SSD i think it may have been 480GB's clearing out for 75% off. Huge savings if you aren't in a hurry.

Anyways, more and more great food for thought. I love it.


I am also really surprised no one has come out with like a Death Star themed case? It almost seems like a no brainer.
 
I hope this adds to the discussion since I've been contemplating building my own desktop for the last year. I currently use my Mac Book Pro with an i7 2 gig quad core. I upgraded to 16 gigs of ram and a 512 gig Samsung 840 Pro SSD. The SSD was the biggest improvement on performance (even beating out adding another 12 gigs of RAM). I don't use virtual instruments though. It's all classical and jazz. So I use some nice reverbs which use the most amount of resources for me.

I would build a "Hackintosh." Google it and you'll find complete builds for a great machine. You can spend $1200 building your own machine and be better than a $3000 Mac Pro. The upside to this is that you can run Mac OS and Windows without additional software.

You don't have to spent $1200, there are many builds that are less expensive, but will still outperform any Mac store bought.

Just so you have some background, I use Reaper as my DAW now. I also own Logic and Sonar. They all have their strengths, but Reaper is a solid piece of software. I have never had it crash on me. Logic and Sonar (and many other DAWs I've used on other peoples machines) crash on me. I use RME UFX as my main converter and a MOTU Traveller for "unimportant" recordings. (not trying to trash the MOTU, it's an OK converter, just a little sterile sounding going through the pre's.)

I hope that helps.
 
I built a Hackintosh (my system triple booted OS X, Win7 and Ubuntu Studio), then later wiped it and stuck to Windows.

If you're going to run Reaper, isn't Windows a better option for compatibility with more plugins, VSTis, etc?
 
@PDP said:
Windows[/URL] did you go with?
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I set up using a small solid state drive to install my Windows 7 OS,

next I installed 7500rpm 500g for my audio drive and

another 7500rpm 500g for softrware sythn data, each with its own fan.

After that its a lot of following directions loading data. Same for the Sweetwater PC Optimization, which I think is free, just go through it and make shure everything ii set as close as you can get it to theirs.
 
ShanPeyton said:
I think i need to build a DAW.
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Here is a few ideas from someone who has built several systems.

1) For the money I go with AMD. It's hard to beat the cost/performance on a 6 - 8 core AMD processor.
2) There are a lot of motherboards out there but I've had really good luck with ASUS.
3) Get at least 8 g of memory.
4) Get a good power supply from a reputable company. I like Corsair.
5) If available use the on board video. The performance will be fine.
6) Don't forget the case. The Cooler Master HAF 912 is a great mid size tower; lots of room and easy to work on.
7) Get an SSD for your boot drive. Also install the DAW software and your VST's on it.
7) While I love WD drives the Seagates lately have been much faster. Get a 2 - 3 TB for work and then use USB drives for backup. Someone said they had problems with larger drives (2 tb and up) and recommended using smaller drives. I haven't had that problem and don't know of anyone who has.
 
DM60 said:
I think that range should get you a nice rig, but depending on the software and determine if you want Firewire or PCI. I like PCI, but it is getting harder to really find mid-priced gear in PCI. Only issue I have read with Firewire (1394 is another name for it) is to get a Firewire PCI card that has the Texas Instrument Chip in it.
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I think your a little confused. Firewire and PCI and 2 totally different technologies used for different things. Firewire is used for external interfacing while PCI is a bus used for internal expansion. Comparing the 2 makes no sense at all. In any case I would not recommend firewire for a PC based system. For the money USB 3.0 is a far better solution.
 
No Question.... MAc out performs PC for digital recording.. it also out prices it. I am using an old PC running Studio 1 from presonus. It is doing everything I want it to do, recording up to 30 tracks... and does result in s alittle latency... however there is a workaround that simply lets you move the track into time really easily.

My entire studio.. including the building, all sound proofing, the technology, the keyboards (not the guitars) and the desk, cost me... less than £100. Just took time and keeping my eyes open for good deals. You can spend as much as you like... but all the gear in the world will still leave you with a recording that is naff if you don't have the skill to use it. Buy cheap... learn to use the basic setup to the best of it's ability... and then you will be in a better position to decide what you want to do to improve your setup.
 
ShofB said:
I think your a little confused. Firewire and PCI and 2 totally different technologies used for different things. Firewire is used for external interfacing while PCI is a bus used for internal expansion. Comparing the 2 makes no sense at all. In any case I would not recommend firewire for a PC based system. For the money USB 3.0 is a far better solution.
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This is such a stupid comment, all I will say is, this is a stupid comment.
 
ShofB said:
Yeah, like saying it's getting hard to find PCI hardware. Idiot.
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Well, he said "mid-priced" gear for PCI and that makes it subjective. What would one consider mid-priced?? Looking through Sweetwater online, the cheapest PCI interface I saw was about $500 for a stereo converter. So, low end for PCI gear is mid-price for USB gear. "Mid-price" PCI stuff is pretty expensive for most home recordists.
 
Everything that I tried to point out yesterday (couldn't get the site to take my posts) was covered by Shof8's original post. With two exceptions: Get GOOD memory Kingston Beast or the like. There IS a difference between high end chips and run of the mill. When recording everything should be about stability. SSDs are stable. High end memory is stable. ASUS mb's are stable.
Get QUIET fans. They usually only run $10 extra and the difference in the room noise levels will be well worth the extra. Water coolers (although in theory quieter) are usually NOT stable. I've tried three different brands at three different price points and all had problems and one was actually louder than fans. Spend a little extra on a good case with 2 120mm fans or more, upgrade to the low db units and you'll have a fairly good system. There's a program called SpeedFan that I use to control fan speeds to keep things quieter during recording. Just have to watch CPU temps while you choke your fans,..:D
 
Hey guys. I am back. I have questions about the motherboard. Someone mentioned that the motherboard is more of a bottlenck these days then say the ram or cpu. Can anyone elaborate on this? What i should be looking for or what ever? Things to watch out for etc? I have an online build at pcpartspicker.com that i am feeling pretty good about i'll post it up after a little more research an answers about the motherboards.
 
Bus speed. Watch the specs and make sure the bus speed is up. If you run a superfast hard drive and video through an old 800 MHz bus, you've gained nothing. And by the way, when people say that ASUS is good motherboard, it's true. But on your budget, you're not likely to be looking at ROG Rampage (about $600-700). So weigh the differences by specs. Do some research.

Also, there are many buses Front End Bus, Back End Bus, Memory Bus, etc. so be sure what you're seeing. Best to go to manufacturer's websites and find a good MB, then go looking through Amazon, NewEgg, Tiger, etc. for best prices.
 
I didn't read the entire thread so forgive me if I sound redundant. I just wanted to put my two cents in on the OP initial post. I've been building high end gamming computers since 2003.
1. You can never have too much processing power. Don't think of it as overkill, think of it as scalability. Ive built everyone of my PCs around AMD processors, they are just as powerfull as their Intel counter parts at a fraction of the cost. For all those Intel fans I'm not down playing Intel's great product but when your building a PC on a budget AMD is worth it's weight in gold IMHO.
2. Every one knows this by now but don't skimp on the memory. It often gets overlooked when building a PC. When I first started building computers to have a Gig of ram was awesome! Not so much anymore. As computer architecture and software including Operating Systems become more sophisticated they become resource hogs real fast. So don't make the mistake of having your lack of memory become a bottleneck.
 
I am currently in almost the same situation you are in now, my exceptions are: I am currently new to home recording but have played with fruity loops for several years.

Same for me, I believe you should consider these as your priorities...
1. reliability: Have components that last, have a reputation but more importantly a warranty
2. quiet: if you are recording anywhere near your computer, it needs to be adequately silent (unless you are recording in seperate room)
3. performance: which is a duh, a new computer should obviously be optimized to improve performance with your DAW, VST plugins, connectivity of additional hardware, and resolve any recording issues: (latency problems, etc.)

Here are my considerations that i believe are the same for you and that others have also addressed
1. connectivity: PCI is soon to be phased out because PCIe can transfer larger amounts of data (correct me if im wront). there are PCIe cards you can buy for sound cards, firewire, usb, and other various ports. Other Midi instruments generaly connect either through usb, or another usb connected MIDI controller (I think...)
2. upgrades and expansion: the great thing about building your own PC is that you are not as limited to upgrading components as you would a prebuild PC.

Lastly here are the basic components of the PC i am speculating and my primary concerns/ considerations with them. (also Quality is not always the same as Price)

1.Motherboard: This is the heart of everything that your PC has to offer: 1. the number of PCI, PCIe, usb, slots is determined here. 2. The amount of data that can be transferred: i.e. Front side bus, etc. 2. You can pretty much add, or upgrade any other part to your PC without issues, but you can't just swap out another Motherboard with the same parts without having to reinstall or even replace things. The socket of your Processor is determined here which is why you need to consider future upgrades if that is your plan.
2. Processor: AMD and Intel use different sockets, so choose as that will be the future of your build. Get what suits your need, I would recommend and i5 or i7 if you are gonna do any other intensive video, photo editing things. (for the crazy number: those that are 3xxx are the 3rd gen. processors and any 4xxx are the newest Haswell. Haswell procesors also have differents sockets and special power demands to consider!)
3. Operating system: Windows needs to be 64 bit period, every program for 32bit will work so dont worry. you can "Hackintosh" but I have no input on that whatsoever.
4. Power supply: This will keep you system from dying, literally. DO NOT SKIMP HERE! warranty, reliability are my everything.
5. Harddrives: SSD for your Operating System and installation of programs. look into Drivers and other things as SSD's don't always simply plug and play like most HDD's and that will save you some serious headaches. I also want to do some SSD caching for my harddrives but im still looking into that. HDD for storage, higher rpms the better.
6. Memory: this will also bottleneck the performance of your system. other than that, I cant say much as I am still researching.
7. case: should be silent for the recording purposes, or look cool if that what you want
8. Everything else: GPU (graphics card), sound cards, etc. are all your personal preference for the most part.
Quality is most important i feel for 1,2,4,6 of those i said. look everywhere else before cutting costs here i say
use this info at your discretion. anyone else who can comment on my reply please do so cause im also trying to learn. I cant post my build but this is on pcpartpicker...

CPU: Intel Core i7-4770 3.4GHz Quad-Core Processor ($294.99 @ NCIX US)
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-L9i 57.5 CFM CPU Cooler ($40.80 @ Newegg)
Motherboard: Asus Z87-PRO ATX LGA1150 Motherboard ($172.99 @ NCIX US)
Memory: Corsair Vengeance Pro 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1600 Memory ($76.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Samsung 840 EVO 120GB 2.5" Solid State Disk ($99.92 @ OutletPC)
Storage: Western Digital Caviar Black 500GB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive (Purchased For $0.00)
Case: Fractal Design Define R4 (Black Pearl) ATX Mid Tower Case ($109.99 @ NCIX US)
Power Supply: SeaSonic 760W 80+ Platinum Certified Fully-Modular ATX Power Supply ($174.98 @ SuperBiiz)
Operating System: Microsoft Windows 8.1 Pro - OEM (64-bit) ($137.97 @ OutletPC)
Total: $1108.63
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-01-12 03:31 EST-0500)
 
I'll jump into here with this:

I built a system last year...Waited and waited for the i5, i7 prices to drop I chose to go with an i5 chip that was on sale and fortunately that was good decision because it's never been that price again. AMD is a good company but I trusted Intel,

i-5 3750K unlocked cpu quad core 3.4ghz
Xigmatek Loki II cpu cooler
ASRock Z77 Pro 4 mb - took a chance on them after using Giga & MSI and have to say ASRock rocks !
16 gb ram Corsair
XFX Fanless Video card I needed multiple monitors so i went with this card to keep the load off the cpu.and reduce fan noise in case
Lacie Firewire pci card TI chipset for interfacing the Focusrite units I have.
120 gb SSD: system drive and DAW software
2 - 500 gb 7200 rpm drives for samples and final mixdowns etc... this config will change though
650 watt Corsair psu A pretty quiet unit
DVD read write drive
Cubase 5 for now with various plugins, Wavelab 6, and other related software.
WINDOWS 7 home prem
all in a Rackmount case with heavily modified venting and drive bays

This system was built for under $750 but I watched sales like a hawk Newegg and MicroCenter were the suppliers

Had bought the rackmount case off Ebay a while ago in anticipation, it gave me some headaches when fitting the MB into it .
But I have a full shop at my disposal so it was nice to be able to 'custom retrofit' and devise a nice cooling fan airflow scheme.
So be cautious if your looking at rackmount cases and make sure your MB will fit and mount up properly

Now to chime in with cali_afroman's reply

HEAT is one factor to consider. When choosing a cooling scheme i went with Xigmatek cpu fan and one 120mm case fan which is working well.
throw away any stock pu cooler that is packaged with them they are noisy will fail sooner than later and will not provide good cooling when the unit is running for long hours. Airflow thru your case is something that should be addressed

Ram: more is better and the prices are lower then they've ever been.

An SSD system drive is a great thing no noise no heat = a happy machine and a happy user.
I have not used them for the heavy writing that project storage and rendering drives see so the debate is still ongoing for that.
You will read alot of info about read write events on SSDs and their limit on them advice : research and ask.

As for the MAC vs Windows well that is a personal choice and i won't get into that whirlpool argument here.

I am using Firewire pci card since i have Focusrite Saffire gear i have absolutely zero issues with firewire.
Safeguard yourself by getting a firewire card with the texas Instrument chipset in it.
If you go USB then consider keeping other USB peripherals at a minimum as they will contest for transfer lanes within the mb
There are few USB 3.0 interfaces out there right now and with Thunderbolt format on the horizon we may not see many more.
A good research on that is worthy Google these topics there s alot of info out there

You wont need a soundcard if you are using an outboard interface and most MB's have onboard audio ( but this is not sufficient for DAW work)

I researched and also looked at what the 3- 5 DAW build companies were using It was a painstaking process
But I wanted to be sure of my choices in order to futureproof my machine to have years of use without any problems.
Above all else keep asking questions here and elseware so you can get a good across the board idea of what you want
 
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Chili said:
Well, he said "mid-priced" gear for PCI and that makes it subjective. What would one consider mid-priced?? Looking through Sweetwater online, the cheapest PCI interface I saw was about $500 for a stereo converter. So, low end for PCI gear is mid-price for USB gear. "Mid-price" PCI stuff is pretty expensive for most home recordists.
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On the low end, I use a M-Audio 192 PCI for about $99. Not sure what the other one cost. That is why I said PCI. By anyone's standard, that is pretty cheap.
 
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