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ecs113
New member
I have a MCA SP1 that I want to use for micing a guitar cab. Has anyone heard of -10dB Pad mods for mics? Should I just forget about it and buy an inexpensive large diaphragm mic w/ pad?
Slackmaster2K
Gone
I don't have any experience with that mic...but why do you think you need a -10db pad? And are you sure that a LD condensor is what you want to be mic'ing your guitar cab with (it's all very application dependent)?
The SP1 has a fairly high SPL rating at 137. You'll probably be ok unless the gain structure of your preamp isn't keen on high input, in which case a pre with a pad would probably be in order. But once you start really cranking an amp up that loud, maybe a simple dynamic would be better suited...something like the good ol' SM57.
Here's a question for the pro's that I've always wondered... does a pad on a mic change the mic's SPL, or does it simply decrease the output level? (i'm guessing the latter)
Slackmaster 2000
The SP1 has a fairly high SPL rating at 137. You'll probably be ok unless the gain structure of your preamp isn't keen on high input, in which case a pre with a pad would probably be in order. But once you start really cranking an amp up that loud, maybe a simple dynamic would be better suited...something like the good ol' SM57.
Here's a question for the pro's that I've always wondered... does a pad on a mic change the mic's SPL, or does it simply decrease the output level? (i'm guessing the latter)
Slackmaster 2000
Gidge
Lapdance Test Dummy
in the words of OJ, "ill take a stab at that"......
the pad when only decrease the output of the mic, and wont protect the diaphragm at all......
the pad when only decrease the output of the mic, and wont protect the diaphragm at all......
Gidge
Lapdance Test Dummy
https://homerecording.com/bbs/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34062&highlight=pad+SPL
Ill steal a little bit of Ed's intellectual property here......
"While the low roll off is covered quite well here already (although, I don't neccesarily agree that it is needed in every case some suggest is should be used in, nor do I think it always makes a difference in certain applications....as Bruce like to say, YMMV) I think one thing needs to be clarified about the -10dB switch.
It WILL not "protect" the mic from high SPL on the diaphram! That diaphram is going to move no matter what! Switching that switch on or off will do NOTHING to stop that!!! The only "protection" you can provide your microphones diaphram is to either move the mic farther away from the sound source, or to lower the level of the sound source. Luckily, most microphones can handle quite high SPL's, usually well over 110dB. I can tell you this, if the source you are micing is more than 110dB, you WON'T want to be the guy having to go and move that mic!!! But generally, most things do not get that loud. Maybe the snare drum of a very heavy handed drummer, but I find this to be rare.
It is used to lower the mics output sensitivity, attenuating the output of the mic so that the preamp may work in a more effective level of attenuation. It does nothing more and nothing less. If the microphone is outputting too much voltage, the mic preamp will have to attenuated that much more. With heavy attenuation, mic preamps start to behave quite strange. So, by lowering the output of the mic so that the mic preamp doesn't have to attenuate as much helps keep the preamp working in a range where it has better control over the amplification (preamps DO have a "sweet spot" in terms of attenuation. It is never in the extremes). I am sure that skippy can shed some more technical light on this subject. I just learned long ago (through a LOT of trial and mostly ERROR that you don't want to have the mic preamp attenuating too much if you want better control over levels. This applies to recording as well as live sound by the way....)
Just a little clarification.....Knowledge is good!
Ed
"
GOTTA LOVE THAT SEARCH ENGINE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Ill steal a little bit of Ed's intellectual property here......
"While the low roll off is covered quite well here already (although, I don't neccesarily agree that it is needed in every case some suggest is should be used in, nor do I think it always makes a difference in certain applications....as Bruce like to say, YMMV) I think one thing needs to be clarified about the -10dB switch.
It WILL not "protect" the mic from high SPL on the diaphram! That diaphram is going to move no matter what! Switching that switch on or off will do NOTHING to stop that!!! The only "protection" you can provide your microphones diaphram is to either move the mic farther away from the sound source, or to lower the level of the sound source. Luckily, most microphones can handle quite high SPL's, usually well over 110dB. I can tell you this, if the source you are micing is more than 110dB, you WON'T want to be the guy having to go and move that mic!!! But generally, most things do not get that loud. Maybe the snare drum of a very heavy handed drummer, but I find this to be rare.
It is used to lower the mics output sensitivity, attenuating the output of the mic so that the preamp may work in a more effective level of attenuation. It does nothing more and nothing less. If the microphone is outputting too much voltage, the mic preamp will have to attenuated that much more. With heavy attenuation, mic preamps start to behave quite strange. So, by lowering the output of the mic so that the mic preamp doesn't have to attenuate as much helps keep the preamp working in a range where it has better control over the amplification (preamps DO have a "sweet spot" in terms of attenuation. It is never in the extremes). I am sure that skippy can shed some more technical light on this subject. I just learned long ago (through a LOT of trial and mostly ERROR that you don't want to have the mic preamp attenuating too much if you want better control over levels. This applies to recording as well as live sound by the way....)
Just a little clarification.....Knowledge is good!
Ed
"
GOTTA LOVE THAT SEARCH ENGINE!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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ecs113
New member
Ok....
Ok, so anyway, I wanted to use a large diaphragm mic on the cab because I wanted to try something different.
The problem is that the levels are too hot for my preamp, thus the question about the -10dB pad. I cannot close mic the cab, and end up getting room sound. No biggie - just a question....
Ok, so anyway, I wanted to use a large diaphragm mic on the cab because I wanted to try something different.
The problem is that the levels are too hot for my preamp, thus the question about the -10dB pad. I cannot close mic the cab, and end up getting room sound. No biggie - just a question....
Slackmaster2K
Gone
Yeah, a mic with a pad or a preamp with a pad would be in order.
It's kind of a weird reason to buy a mic though, since mic selection is so varied and important. It might be more worthwhile to find a preamp that will work well...or maybe some kind of inline pad.
What preamp are you using?
Slackmaster 2000
It's kind of a weird reason to buy a mic though, since mic selection is so varied and important. It might be more worthwhile to find a preamp that will work well...or maybe some kind of inline pad.
What preamp are you using?
Slackmaster 2000
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ecs113
New member
Decisions decisions
hahahaha do you REALLY want to know? Behringer T1953, gain cranked down. Also, I am short on mics, could always use another large diaphragm mic for other things anyway.
I think I may just settle with my EV Cobalt 4 closemiced on the cab, but I still need to buy a general purpose mic to have around. I have
1 - MCA SP1
1 - EV CO4
"1" - Realistic Small Diaphragm Condenser "mic"
1 - Nady SP1 (came free with a mic cable)
I read an article where Tom Petty's engineer/producer(?) puts a LD mic off center from the speaker to pick up lower frequencies.
Thanks
Slackmaster2K said:
hahahaha do you REALLY want to know? Behringer T1953, gain cranked down. Also, I am short on mics, could always use another large diaphragm mic for other things anyway.
I think I may just settle with my EV Cobalt 4 closemiced on the cab, but I still need to buy a general purpose mic to have around. I have
1 - MCA SP1
1 - EV CO4
"1" - Realistic Small Diaphragm Condenser "mic"
1 - Nady SP1 (came free with a mic cable)
I read an article where Tom Petty's engineer/producer(?) puts a LD mic off center from the speaker to pick up lower frequencies.
Thanks
Gidge
Lapdance Test Dummy
a Sennheiser MD421 might be better suited for that.....
someone in "Behind The Glass" (the name eludes me at the moment) uses a sm57 and a 421 up close, both off axis and then a LD a bit further off for room sound......
general purpose mic to have around?....sm57!!!!
then you can say you have a mic that is used everyday in pro studios all around the world.....
someone in "Behind The Glass" (the name eludes me at the moment) uses a sm57 and a 421 up close, both off axis and then a LD a bit further off for room sound......
general purpose mic to have around?....sm57!!!!
then you can say you have a mic that is used everyday in pro studios all around the world.....
cordura21
New member
Ethan Winer's excellent website has a project for building a pad:
http://ethanwiner.com/gadgets.html
Check the rest of the site, it's very good. Cheers, Andrés
http://ethanwiner.com/gadgets.html
Check the rest of the site, it's very good. Cheers, Andrés
J
JesusFreak
New member
Hey Guys,
I have a question that I hope goes along with this thread....the point was raised up about high SPL's damaging the diaphram...this is obviously not something that I want to do...I was planning on using the Octava MK-319 as overheads for drums...I have no idea what the db's of the cymbols and stuff are so am I in danger of damaging my mics doing this?? If not...great!! But if so, how far away from the cymbols should I have these?? Sorry if it's not related...
God Bless!
I have a question that I hope goes along with this thread....the point was raised up about high SPL's damaging the diaphram...this is obviously not something that I want to do...I was planning on using the Octava MK-319 as overheads for drums...I have no idea what the db's of the cymbols and stuff are so am I in danger of damaging my mics doing this?? If not...great!! But if so, how far away from the cymbols should I have these?? Sorry if it's not related...
God Bless!
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ebeam
New member
You can buy a variable in-line pad. Fletcher from Mercenary Audio raves about the one from Shure, but I've never been able to find it. Maybe they don't make it any more. I did find one at markertek:
http://www.markertek.com/MTStore/product.CFM?BaseItem=HK-112+1/1
http://www.markertek.com/MTStore/product.CFM?BaseItem=HK-112+1/1
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ecs113
New member
Thanks
Thanks all, I appreciate the input. I decided to go with a used Oktava 219 for $50. Nothing like gambling with poor Russian quality control...
Thanks all, I appreciate the input. I decided to go with a used Oktava 219 for $50. Nothing like gambling with poor Russian quality control...
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ecs113
New member
Oh yeah
Oh yeah, I am going to keep those switchcraft units in mind, they could be very useful.
Oh yeah, I am going to keep those switchcraft units in mind, they could be very useful.
cordura21
New member
isn't a variable pad...sort of like... a volume control?