Dual Rectifier modelers shoot out. need help!

[johnny shnizz]

hope this is the right forum to post this in. still a little new here so bare with me i´m in the process of making a bigger amp modeling comparison demo on the Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier. so far i have 6 modelers for it - mostly software, though. i would like to get my hands on the Axe-FX model, the Helix model and the real tube amp. if anybody has any of these three and is capable of reamping, feel free to contact me and i´ll send you the DI´s and some info and specifics. it´s just two 20 seconds rhythm tracks to reamp. the style leans towards djent / modern metal. you´ll appear in the credits. thanks.

 

[Guitargodgt]

Yeah I can reamp a real DR for you. If possible use Vintage 30 cabinets in your comparison on the software end.

I also might have software you don't, but IDK what you are looking for.

There is a small possibility I can help you out on the axe fx end as well.

 

[johnny shnizz]

awesome. forgot to mention, i wouldn´t need a reamp with full cab/mic configuartion. i would provide an impulse response that i use on all the samples so the focus can really be on the amp sound. it´s a really good IR, so don´t worry if you also have a tube screamer available that´d be awesome. if not i guess the TSE 808 on the DI´s should suffice, or if you have a better emulation of it. i used the screamer model on all samples as well and it´s kind of important to the general tone in this demo. if that´s possible for you and you´re still interested, here´s my e-mail for better communication:

just drop me an empty mail with "dual rec shoot out" as topic or something so i know. then i´ll give you all the details and tracks to help you out.

 

[Guitargodgt]

Sent you an email

 

[Steenamaroo]

awesome. forgot to mention, i wouldn´t need a reamp with full cab/mic configuartion. i would provide an impulse response that i use on all the samples so the focus can really be on the amp sound. it´s a really good IR, so don´t worry if you also have a tube screamer available that´d be awesome. if not i guess the TSE 808 on the DI´s should suffice, or if you have a better emulation of it. i used the screamer model on all samples as well and it´s kind of important to the general tone in this demo. if that´s possible for you and you´re still interested, here´s my e-mail for better communication:

just drop me an empty mail with "dual rec shoot out" as topic or something so i know. then i´ll give you all the details and tracks to help you out.

I removed your email address so you don't get picked up by crawlers and get buried in spam. Hope you don't mind.

 

[ashcat_lt]

...it´s kind of important to the general tone in this demo.

Then it should be included in "the DIs" so that it's exactly the same every time. You said you want to focus on the amp sims themselves, and relying on somebody else to dial in the exact same settings on possibly some other device is not the way to get there.

 

[andrushkiwt]

is this for your own benefit, a website, or some other place where you might share the files/results? I use Lecto Lepou (Dual Recto -free) through Recab's Oversize (MB 4x12 - $39.99, i think). I'd be curious to see if there's another company/vst that I could use.

 

[Greg_L]

Why are you using a Tube Screamer if this is an "amp shootout"? Let the amps, or amp sims, be what they are.

If this is for general informational purposes, then overdriving the front end makes each tone a liar.

 

[ashcat_lt]

Why are you using a Tube Screamer if this is an "amp shootout"? Let the amps, or amp sims, be what they are.

If this is for general informational purposes, then overdriving the front end makes each tone a liar.

This is pretty much the default tone for most of the kids who call themselves metal nowadays. TS into a Mesa or 5150, done. It makes sense in this context because it's the way the intended audience would actually use the things.

 

[Greg_L]

This is pretty much the default tone for most of the kids who call themselves metal nowadays. TS into a Mesa or 5150, done. It makes sense in this context because it's the way the intended audience would actually use the things.

Got it. My apologies. I missed the part that said "djent/modern metal". My brain selectively skips over words like that.

 

[miroslav]

Some day they'll find a new tone to play with....then all the metal guitars will sound different...but still the same.

 

[Greg_L]

Some day they'll find a new tone to play with....then all the metal guitars will sound different...but still the same.

What's weird is a Dual Rec is already capable of obscene amounts of gain. Like, stupid amounts of face-melting, fingerless gloves, hot-topic mallcore metal distortion. And they add a tube screamer on top of that? Yikes.

 

[ashcat_lt]

Part of it is the mid boost action of the TS. It can't be all that drastic with low gain settings, but it cuts a little highs so things don't get quite so fizzy and a but of the lows so things don't get so fuzzy and the low end is "tighter" and a bit more dynamic. It works for what they seem to want to do.

 

[johnny shnizz]

why put the tube screamer in front of the amp? because on drop Ab no amp can really provide the necessary mid range focus on its own for what i´m doing. the TS is not for extra distortion, it acts as a kind of pre-EQ to get that focus. i´ve tried it with many different modelers and the outcome was always the same. and i turn the distortion on the Dual Rec way down so it stays focused and doesn´t mush up.

why use the tube screamer from the respective modelers instead of the same one on all? because it´s not just about the Dual Rec modeling, but also the modelers themselves which includes distortion pedals. i mean when people buy some modeling software they would most likely also use the distortion pedals that come with it. but on the other hand the cab sims are easy to exchange for other third party IR´s, so that is what i also do for the demo. using the same IR on the different samples will put them in the same general tonal balance so you can compare the modeling much better. that´s why this IR will also have to be put on the real amp.

what do i do this for? i just thought it would be interesting to test out different Dual Rec modelers side by side on a low tuned djent tone. so i guess you could say it´s personal interest. i do stuff like that from time to time and upload the demos/reviews/test to my youtube channel. this demo will also be uploaded.

why do i go for djent? because it´s more of a challenge. i find for low tunings making rhythm tones defined and tight and not totally muddy is more difficult. and so far all the modelers i´ve tested would do just fine on any other metal tone but with a really low tuning there are quite the differences. some are tight and defined and do well, others are more mushy and don´t do so well.

hope this clears up any irritation or misunderstanding.

 

[Greg_L]

Lol. Fair enough. Have you ever tried an actual Dual Rec?

 

[ashcat_lt]

It would be interesting to see how the SansAmp GT2's "Calif" setting stands up next to these more sophisticated digital models. You can't remove the "cab sim" from that one, though.

 

[johnny shnizz]

Lol. Fair enough. Have you ever tried an actual Dual Rec?

sadly no. where i live i don´t really have any opportunities to try out any real amps. and even less do i have the money to buy or rent it.

 

[wtfuhz]

Lol. Fair enough. Have you ever tried an actual Dual Rec?

I've had a few dual recs come through and every revision sounds pretty different, the worse of which for tightness in my opinion was revision G. Way too much loose low end flub. Real mushy tone. Revision F and earlier were the shit though. Sims never really came close to any of these sounds tbh

 

[Greg_L]

I've had a few dual recs come through and every revision sounds pretty different, the worse of which for tightness in my opinion was revision G. Way too much loose low end flub. Real mushy tone. Revision F and earlier were the shit though. Sims never really came close to any of these sounds tbh

I agree. I'm not sure about revisions and stuff, but some Dual Recs sound killer, and some sound like horseshit. I always attributed it to the kind of guy that would normally use a Dual Rec. They're typically not the sharpest knives in the drawer.

But knowing that they use no negative feedback circuit and have artificial "presence", I can see why they'd be loose, flubby, and need a tube screamer out front to tighten them up.

Maybe these modern metal guys need a new amp trend.

 

[JDOD]

I've tried a Dual Rec once. Wasn't quite the tone I was looking for (and I don't have the space for it anyway) but it did sound great. Click onto the gain channel and its just instant Metallica.

I've tried a handful of Dual Rec sims and they all sound shit and they all sound the same. I've not tried the really top end sims like Axe FX, Positive Grid and Helix or anything though.