Recording Good Guitar Tones

  • Thread starter Thread starter mattacaa
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Guitar plugged into a amp modeller (I use Line 6 M13) and plug that straight into the mixer/recorder, thus doing away with a microphone and all that phaffing around. There is nothing to be achieved these days by placing a mic in front of an amp when amp mods are so good.
 
The Uninvited said:
Guitar plugged into a amp modeller (I use Line 6 M13) and plug that straight into the mixer/recorder, thus doing away with a microphone and all that phaffing around. There is nothing to be achieved these days by placing a mic in front of an amp when amp mods are so good.
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^^^^^ Worst post of 2014. ^^^^^
 
Not a big fan of Line 6 stuff - more a Boss pedal fan. But I still prefer to mic my amp.
 
Greg_L said:
^^^^^ Worst post of 2014. ^^^^^
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+1

---------- Update ----------

The Uninvited said:
Guitar plugged into a amp modeller (I use Line 6 M13) and plug that straight into the mixer/recorder, thus doing away with a microphone and all that phaffing around. There is nothing to be achieved these days by placing a mic in front of an amp when amp mods are so good.
Click to expand...

:facepalm:
 
I'm just now getting the hang of putting a mike in front of an amplifier. Even my feeble attempts at miking a 30W Roland Cube (which I suppose is a modeler) sound better (clearer, more distinct, can hear individual strings in a cord) than most things I've done in any in the box. The advantage is that if you hear the tone well in the room, you can get a good tone on your track. Doesn't take hours of fiddling around to tweak the sound as good as it can get. It's just there. The disadvantage is, you can't come back to it later and tweak...
I've got a lot to learn on this yet, and maybe learning to re-amp will get rid of the disadvantage.
I suppose, depending on what genre of music you're working with, that in the box can work for you. But dismissing miking a great guitar through a great amp is not going to work for me either...go walk through a bit of The New Tone Thread, and you'll see what I mean.
 
BroKen_H said:
I'm just now getting the hang of putting a mike in front of an amplifier. Even my feeble attempts at miking a 30W Roland Cube (which I suppose is a modeler) sound better (clearer, more distinct, can hear individual strings in a cord) than most things I've done in any in the box. The advantage is that if you hear the tone well in the room, you can get a good tone on your track. Doesn't take hours of fiddling around to tweak the sound as good as it can get. It's just there. The disadvantage is, you can't come back to it later and tweak...
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I'm more-or-less in the same boat, miking the amp does sound better than even taking the DI off the amp. But I'm starting to use my Radial PZ-Pre box to split the signal, send the guitar DI direct to my interface + the miked amp signal at the same time so I can tweak the DI (or add to the amped sound) if needed.
 
I'll play devil's advocate with the "Worst Post of 2014" regarding amp sims vs miking a real cab. Both offer great pros and some cons.

When to mike a cab:
-You have a great amp, nice cab, and have dialed in exactly the sound you want
-You have the ability to turn up the volume significantly (in terms of disrupting neighbors, family, etc)
-You're in a regularly performing, well rehearsed band who knows their songs and their sound

When to DI and use amp sims:
-You only have practice amps and/or achieve most of your sound from pedals (particularly distortion)
-You can't turn up the volume loud enough to get the amp to its sweet spot
-You're a songwriter who writes and records as one continuous process*

*To me, this is the important one. Many home recorders are solo musicians who use the recording process to flesh out song drafts and ideas. This continuous process does not lend itself to miking an amp, where you're stuck with a sound that might not fit the song that eventually develops. My father (musical partner) added: if you nail the perfect performance but recorded a concrete sound that no longer suits the song, you're screwed.

There are times that I have miked an amp but many more that I have DIed in order to have flexible options as the song develops thru the process. Of my many guitars, I have a customer Steinberger that I use for much of the DI work, because it has virtually no character of its own. That guitar takes on the tone of whichever amp it is running through without imparting any of its own quality. It's a perfect combination with amp sims.
 
Dark Terror is the high gain version of the Orange terror correct ? I would start by rolling the gain way down and bring the volume up till you really hear those power tubes breaking up. Then slowly roll the gain up. You need way less then you think. Once you get a good tone, do it again. I like to pan hard L and R and put some harmony parts on one of the guitars.
 
Brian Miller said:
Many home recorders are solo musicians who use the recording process to flesh out song drafts and ideas. This continuous process does not lend itself to miking an amp, where you're stuck with a sound that might not fit the song that eventually develops.
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Baloney. I get what you're saying, but it's not a real problem. It's a fake new-world problem that has come to life because of the never ending flexibility of modern DAW recording and modelers. It may seem like a huge technological advantage, but having 50 fake amps and 100 fake cabs at your disposalit isn't a good thing. All it does is allow people to overthink and overcook their mixes. Fucking commit to something. It's very refreshing.
 
Brian Miller said:
When to DI and use amp sims:
-You only have practice amps and/or achieve most of your sound from pedals (particularly distortion)
-You can't turn up the volume loud enough to get the amp to its sweet spot
-You're a songwriter who writes and records as one continuous process*

*To me, this is the important one. Many home recorders are solo musicians who use the recording process to flesh out song drafts and ideas. This continuous process does not lend itself to miking an amp, where you're stuck with a sound that might not fit the song that eventually develops. My father (musical partner) added: if you nail the perfect performance but recorded a concrete sound that no longer suits the song, you're screwed.
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There's always reamping if you get into the habit of tracking a DI along your mic signal.
Not that I'm fond of reamping.

Thing is with modellers, at least in my opinion, that you'll never get any convincing tones out of it unless you have a decent idea how a mic'ed cab sounds.
So, I would always recommend to learn the 'real deal' first, before fiddling with stuff that is supposed to re-model the old school recording situation.
And practice amps and half decent pedals get a long way, if you mess with them. I'm all for cranking big tube power amps if the circumstances allow, but with experience you can get pretty usable guitar tones out of substandard gear. It surely will take more efforts than using great guitar gear, and I would not cut any too guitar centred tracks with cheap trannies, though.
 
b00n said:
Thing is with modellers, at least in my opinion, that you'll never get any convincing tones out of it unless you have a decent idea how a mic'ed cab sounds.
So, I would always recommend to learn the 'real deal' first, before fiddling with stuff that is supposed to re-model the old school recording situation.
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I agree with this. I spent years playing out live, and was originally in school for audio engineering. So I may take my background for granted when I use amp mods without realizing the knowledge I'm applying to get them to sound good. Goodness knows I've heard a ton of awful, trashing, very digital amp sounds from others.
 
Since I'm guessing dark terror = high gain brootz:

These videos should help. Do away with the LDC, not needed for high gain tones. I will also say you will probably need more mids than you think if your cab has t75s in it, they are not as honky as the vintage 30s that the cab in these videos are.



And yeah, wanted to post part 2 of his series but the forum made that not happen.
 
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