+4dBu Vs -10dBV What To Use With Duet 2 + SM7B?? Help!

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So after hours of reading and basically everyone saying completely different things about the topic I still want to know what Analog level setting to use on my Duet2.

Common sense says to just use the Mic setting since I am just recording vocals and commentaries, but someone told me that I needed to have it set on -10dBV instead. My eyes hurt from reading so many different discussions about this without finding a clear answer.

If anyone knows anything about this or has any info about it all please let me know because I want to make sure i'm using my equipment to it's full potential.

Thanks in advance!!!

another quick thing to ask...

Is it safe to turn the preamp for the mic all the way up to 75?
It seems like it starts to get a lot of static after 70, but the size of the wav lengths are so small when recorded I can barely see them unless zoomed way way in.
 
The +4dBu/-10dBV choice only applies to your line level inputs and outputs. FYI, there are basically two different "line levels". Unbalanced domestic gear (stuff with phono/RCA plugs or maybe quarter inch TS) tends to be referenced to -10dBV. Professional, balanced gear is referenced around +4dBu. Which to use? It depends what you're connecting to your interface. However, when using the Mic input, none of the above comes into play.

On your other question, it's safe to turn up your mic gain all the way but, as you've already discovered, pushing the pre amp in the Duet that hard results in extra noise. The SM7B is a VERY low output microphone and, to work well, needs a pre amp that can give a LOT of noise free gain. Your Duet would be fine for most "normal" mics but the SM7B needs special handling--just one of the reasons I dislike the SM7B (and RE20 for that matter).
 
So the best thing to do would be to get a better pre-amp?
Are there any reasonably priced that would make a noticeable difference?
Or would I be better off selling the mic and getting a new one thats better suited for the duet 2"
Which of these 2 choices do you think would give better results for the cheapest price?

Thanks!!
 
Me? I'd change the mic--but the SM7B isn't a favourite of mine. However, there are lots of fans here who are bound to leap to its defence! The thing is, unless you spend a fair bit of money on a pre amp, you may still have the same problem.
 
When I end up recording something quiet through an SM7b, sometimes I chain a couple mic preamps together. The first one at nominal boost and the second one (in your case the Duet) would actually set the recording level. This is the easiest way to get noise free gain. There are also in-line amps that are meant for ribbon mics that just give a straight 20db of boost. They run off of phantom power, should be pretty inexpensive and will get the mic level up to something the Duet will be able to work with.

When you say "the waveforms are very small", that scares me a bit, because what they look like on the screen is besides the point. (plus there is a zoom control that can make them look bigger or smaller without actually changing the level) You should be going for an average level around -18dbfs. This is generally somewhere about half way up the meter.

Set the recording levels so that a sustained note sits about half way up the meter and the peaks don't go over 0dbfs. With some instruments, the peaks won't go much higher than the sustained notes. With other instruments, like drums, there is no sustain so you want to just make sure they peak somewhere around -6dbfs or so. It is not necessary to get the recording levels absolutely perfect, they just need to be somewhere in the ballpark and not clip.
 
After posting on 4 different forums this is the best info yet! thanks

1 more question... Does it matter which in line amp I get?
There are some for $30 and some for hundreds.
One that I found is the Cloud Microphones Cloudlifter CL-1
I'm kinda low on money right now and $150 will be hard to spend.
Is there going to be a huge difference between this one and say a cheap $30-$40 one?

I do commentaries and I don't have a very loud voice so I think this should help me out a lot.
Thanks and let me know!
I really do appreciate the help a lot!

Farview said:
When I end up recording something quiet through an SM7b, sometimes I chain a couple mic preamps together. The first one at nominal boost and the second one (in your case the Duet) would actually set the recording level. This is the easiest way to get noise free gain. There are also in-line amps that are meant for ribbon mics that just give a straight 20db of boost. They run off of phantom power, should be pretty inexpensive and will get the mic level up to something the Duet will be able to work with.
Click to expand...
 
I'm afraid it probably WILL matter.

Just as the microphone pre amp built into your Duet 2 adds noise along with gain, so a cheap amp is likely to do the same.

The trouble is, even spending a lot of money isn't a guarantee of quality either. Even some of the expensive ones are more concerned with sounding "warm" (or whatever) than with the clean gain. Unless there's a very detailed spec to check, this is probably a time for personal recommendations. (And, on that note, I bow out because all my mics have an output high enough not to need this sort of treatment.)
 
Well I think I'm going to go with the cloud lifter.
It seems like every place I read about it, someone mentions its perfect for the SM7B.
Also read a bunch of reviews from people who got it and they were all positive.
I also just watched a youtube video a guy had the same setup as me the duet with the SM7B and he did tests to show the difference in quality.
With using the Cloudlifter his voice was incredibly louder and the background noise stayed the exact same.
Just need to save up some money now.

I'm normally scared to buy music equipment used because the stuff is fragile but I think I might try ebay or something.

I'll let you know the results when I get it!

And thanks for the info, all the other music forums I posted to gave me garbage answers.
Thanks!
 
I've had a look at the spec for the Cloudlifter and it says it can add 25dB of clean gain. This should let you turn the Duet down by a similar amount and into its clean range--so it sounds to me like it should do the job for you (based entirely on specs, not personal experience of course!).

I'd suggest that you read Farview's note above about setting levels. To get the best out of you system, you'll want to be relying on the meters in your DAW to set levels, not just how loud it sounds. It'll all go towards making your commentaries sound more professional.

Good luck with your purchase!
 
I have no experience with the cloudlifter, but I have only heard positive things about it. This should be a really good setup for voiceover work.
 
Cloud lifter does indeed get good rep, but what concerns me is that your apogee has 75db of gain, apparently.

I don't have a preamp that comes near that, as far as I know, and I never have any problems getting a healthy level out of my sm7b.
I'm a complete dynamic mic nut, so if anyone was gonna have issues with gain, it's probably me! lol.


Maybe it's been mentioned, I only scanned, but are you recording a very quiet source?
I love the sm7b, but if you're recording very quiet speech or something, it may not be the mic for you.

Anyways, as covered, +4db and -10db only applies to line level outputs and inputs.
Think of them as two different volume levels. You just set the to be the same on a preamp and line input.
If there's no switch on the preamp, you find out which standard it uses by reading the spec, and set your interface to match.
 
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