How far do you get with amp modelers.

[Steenamaroo]

Anyone having any success?

I have the behringer v-amp pro. It was free; I think that's why most people have behringer gear.

Seriously though, I've found it quite useful for lead guitar and for rhythm that isn't prominent, but what if you wanna do a RATM or Soundgarden style song?

I recorded some rough guitar tracks down yesterday and they just sound flat and lifeless.
Part of me thinks I can layer up and make it work, but another part things a guitar track should have balls from the get go.

Would anyone here rely on modelers?

I don't have a good amp because I'm not really a guitarist. I just dabble, but I'm starting to feel like sometimes there's just no substitute.

Any tips?

EDIT:
I currently use the modeler directly, but I've thought about maybe feeding it into an old active monitor or something like that so I can mic it.
Likely to be terrible?

 

[kcearl]

I have loads of modellers and software, as well as a couple of amps, and although im no guitarist or tone snob, you can get good sounds out of most. It just takes a bit of setting up.

With the v-amp pro youre actually dealing with technology thats quite a few years older than other modelers, but it does have its good point imo and can be made to sound good.

Its weak points are its fx and its cab sims...its strong point is its JCM 800 model and a couple of others. If you can match it up with some modern software cab sims and theyre fx, like amplitube 3 (a vintage marshall 2x12 with a tube mic), add a tube saturation plug at the beginning of the chain, and you get a great sounding tone...its meatier and less fizzy than a lot of the software. I spdif it and use good cables and it sounds as good as anything else there.

I also you Peaveys revavlers cabs as i can host my own cab IRs, I have quite a few, when matched with the numetal head in the vamp pro i can get some rocking tones (it also works well with orange cabs)

I like the JC 120...but it is a little flat, so i match it woth the jazz cab in GR5 and mic my monitors, routing them back in my preamp and it sounds great

If you dont have a cab sim then voxengo has a free program to host impulses. These IRs can be found free only or bought from recabinet.

You can also get a free version of amplitube...just bypass the amp heads and experiment with the cabs..lthe stomp boxes are miles better than the fx in the vamp, so just disable them

Its an older piece of kit, but it has its strong points (the JCM) and with a little work it can sound great

Lemme know if I can send you some IRs to get you started...im out of town for a week but i should be online

 

[Lt. Bob]

interestingly I gigged with my V-Amp2 all summer when my Rocktron, which I prefer, started glitching out.
The V-Amp2 is far better sounding than the POD which it was contemporary with.

And it sounded ...... well ...... meh. It was acceptable and you can get a decent clean out of it ..... distortion sounds are more problematic.
Do you have ANY guitar amps?
I'd use one of them, even just a small practice amp, before I'd use a monitor. The 2-way of a monitor is gonna be problematic to mic for one thing ..... and that tweeter is something that's not on guitar amps either.

I think one problem you're having is that since you aren't a guitarist AND you don't have a good amp ..... you don't totally know the small details of the sound you're trying to get.
It's hard to dial in a sound on a modeler if you don't know how to get that sound with the real amp the modeler replaces.

And yeah, I could record with a modeler and mostly do. It's just easy.

But that VAmp is not a POS.
As kcearl said it's kinda old.
I have like 5 modelers from that era and the V-Amp sounds as good or better than any of them ..... WAY better than a POD 2.0 and WAY better than a couple of Digitechs I have from then.
The newer modelers go to 24bit and they are far superior but you ought to be able to get passable sounds outta that thing.
Not great sounds but passable.

And micing it thru a small guitar amp might work better ....... try it and see.

 

[Chili]

99% of my electric stuff goes through a modeller. It takes some tweaking to get what you want, but it's doable, just like a real amp.

I wouldn't think of micing a monitor speaker. If the modeller isn't giving you what you want going DI, then you should find another one.

I have an old Digitech modeller and I'm thinking of getting a new one for the higher bit resolution.

Ah, just realized, I might use mine slightly different than most other people. Although I don't go through an amp and speaker, I do plug into the DI of a mic pre. I don't use the USB to port the signal to the computer. I do that more for convenience than sound quality.

 

[kcearl]

interestingly I gigged with my V-Amp2 all summer when my Rocktron, which I prefer, started glitching out.
The V-Amp2 is far better sounding than the POD which it was contemporary with.

And it sounded ...... well ...... meh. It was acceptable and you can get a decent clean out of it ..... distortion sounds are more problematic.
Do you have ANY guitar amps?
I'd use one of them, even just a small practice amp, before I'd use a monitor. The 2-way of a monitor is gonna be problematic to mic for one thing ..... and that tweeter is something that's not on guitar amps either.

I think one problem you're having is that since you aren't a guitarist AND you don't have a good amp ..... you don't totally know the small details of the sound you're trying to get.
It's hard to dial in a sound on a modeler if you don't know how to get that sound with the real amp the modeler replaces.

And yeah, I could record with a modeler and mostly do. It's just easy.

But that VAmp is not a POS.
As kcearl said it's kinda old.
I have like 5 modelers from that era and the V-Amp sounds as good or better than any of them ..... WAY better than a POD 2.0 and WAY better than a couple of Digitechs I have from then.
The newer modelers go to 24bit and they are far superior but you ought to be able to get passable sounds outta that thing.
Not great sounds but passable.

And micing it thru a small guitar amp might work better ....... try it and see.

Yup, i have the pod 2 and a zoom from that period and theyre awful in comparision....i still prefer the marshall in the v amp over any sim, even the very latest...its just so beefy, doesnt sound digital to me at all...thats worth te price of the vamp on its own

Once i get my own place again im just going to set it up for that one sim through a marshall cabinet

 

[Steenamaroo]

Thanks for all the replies.

I do feel like I can get on just fine with a real guitar amp.
I'm no expert all the same, but I know what's what in that sense.

Maybe I need to get to know the v-amp pro better. I don't see any brandname settings.
You mentioned the marhsall in your vamp, KC. Maybe you have a different model?
Here's mine.

I never though of pairing it up with software cab emulators though.
I do have the limited version of eleven. I think it has a few cab options there so I'll go play.

Cheers guys.

 

[Lt. Bob]

Yup, i have the pod 2 and a zoom from that period and theyre awful in comparision....

oh man ...... I had a Zoom 505 ..... OMG!!! ....... I'm pretty good at tweaking a modeler but that thing was unusable. I eneded up throwing it in the garbage as I would not want to inflict it on anyone.
Alesis Nano-verb too!

 

[Steenamaroo]

oh man ...... I had a Zoom 505 ..... OMG!!! ....... I'm pretty good at tweaking a modeler but that thing was unusable. I eneded up throwing it in the garbage as I would not want to inflict it on anyone.
Alesis Nano-verb too!

No way! So did I.

Forgot to answer you, Bob. I have no guitar amps.

I almost scored a Mesa combo for nought, but nothing's been said about it in a while.

 

[kcearl]

Thanks for all the replies.

I do feel like I can get on just fine with a real guitar amp.
I'm no expert all the same, but I know what's what in that sense.

Maybe I need to get to know the v-amp pro better. I don't see any brandname settings.
You mentioned the marhsall in your vamp, KC. Maybe you have a different model?
Here's mine.

I never though of pairing it up with software cab emulators though.
I do have the limited version of eleven. I think it has a few cab options there so I'll go play.

Cheers guys.

In the vamps manual theres a list of real names

Eg.

Brit Hi Gain = JCM 800... match that with a vintage 4 x 12 cab
Classic clean = JC 120...match that with a jp 2 x 12 jazz cab

 

[Steenamaroo]

In the vamps manual theres a list of real names

Eg Brit Hi Gain = JCM 800... match that with a vintage 4 x 12 cab
Classic clean = JC 120...match that with a jp 2 x 12 jazz cab

I never thought I'd be on the receiving end of RTFM, but it seems about right here! lol.

Cheers KC.

 

[kcearl]

No way! So did I.

Forgot to answer you, Bob. I have no guitar amps.

I almost scored a Mesa combo for nought, but nothing's been said about it in a while.

A Vox valvetronix is a good modelling amp...the vox models on it are good...but it has two boutique models that are excellent...the rest not so great, but theyre covered in the v amp (marshalls)

 

[kcearl]

I never thought I'd be on the receiving end of RTFM, but it seems about right here! lol.

Cheers KC.

When you see the real names for some reason it seems easier and more fun to tweak it...must be psychological

 

[Lt. Bob]

A Vox valvetronix is a good modelling amp...the vox models on it are good...but it has two boutique models that are excellent...the rest not so great, but theyre covered in the v amp (marshalls)

Vox has a new pedal out called the Stomplab that is basically the models from their Valvetronics amps in a pedal form for 70 bucks!
Something like 100 effects/amps in a small baterry powered pedal.

I may want one to just keep in the truck for emergencies.

 

[Steenamaroo]

When you see the real names for some reason it seems easier and more fun to tweak it...must be psychological

They should definitely have put an LCD screen on there!

This has helped a lot. Thanks everyone.

 

[kcearl]

Vox has a new pedal out called the Stomplab that is basically the models from their Valvetronics amps in a pedal form for 70 bucks!
Something like 100 effects/amps in a small baterry powered pedal.

I may want one to just keep in the truck for emergencies.

What?? Man im having that

The good thing with the amp is that it actually has a decent tone...i have a line 6 spider and it sounds digital...the vox boutique sounds damn close to a tube amp through its own speaker

They should definitely have put an LCD screen on there!

This has helped a lot. Thanks everyone.

No worries, like i said gimme a yell if you fancy dabbling in the world of impulse responses...theres a whole word of tweakers out there

Funny for not recording much guitar I meddle with it every day...one day these tones will be needed and Ill be ready!!

 

[Steenamaroo]

No worries, like i said gimme a yell if you fancy dabbling in the world of impulse responses...theres a whole word of tweakers out there

Funny for not recording much guitar I meddle with it every day...one day these tones will be needed and Ill be ready!!

I'll shine a guitar shaped lamp into the sky man.

Really though, much appreciated.

 

[Lt. Bob]

What?? Man im having that

Vox StompLab 1G Modeling Guitar Effects Pedal from Same Day Music at SHOP.COM

 

[Xdrummer]

I've used modelers a lot. I live in a condo and while I've done a lot to add treament, density, etc - I can't crank a Marshall at midnight (I do a lot of my recording at night - since the day job kind of limits my tracking time during the day).

The drum kit and keyboards are my primary axes - but I've played guitar for several years and have actually spent more time in search of the Holy Grail of tone - over trying to develop killing chops - so while I'm not a guitar slinger - I do appreciate good guitar tone.

I currenly use a Vox Tone Lab (pedal board sim)- and a VoxAD30VT (an amp combo sim - which has an attenuation control, so I can get a fat sound without having to crank the amp). I've also used a POD 2.0 (which can do some tones well) and a Johnson J-Station. I'll often use either a Seymour Duncan Twin Tube pedal of a Mesa V1 Bottle Rocket to act as a tube pre going into whatever sim I use. Most of my bass tones are direct through a Sans Amp Bass Driver.

I do have a few decent low watt combos (Peavey Studio Pro, Epiphone Valve Jr. etc.) which I do like to use when I can - since nothing beats moving air. But I feel I can get very believabe sounds using sims.

Certainly when I track an outside guitar player - I get a lot of push back (seems every guitarist wants to push a tube amp to 11) - but when I get them to at least try to use the sims - I manage to win over all but the most purist of tone snobs.

 

[Steenamaroo]

Thanks again to everyone.
I half expected this thread to be a list of people saying "modelers suck - Buy an amp".
The fact that it isn't is encouragement enough.

I'll spend the time and get to know the unit, but I confess, my ebay watch list is full of blackstar ht-1s at the minute.

 

[Farview]

I've never used the vamp but my experience with other sims leads me to believe that it probably suffers from the same failings in the distorted sounds...too much gain, they get fizzy ...back it off a bit and it gets spitty instead of crunchy .

My solution for that is a comp sustainer pedal (real or virtual) because it will even out the dynamics of your playing enough to be able to set the gain in the insanely small crunch zone.