very basic questions about recording in to PC and sharing files

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rdb3

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I need help getting started w/ multitrack recording right into a PC. I don’t know how to start.

Any good sites for this? I got good results on cassette w/ a Tascam 424, but have heard how 2 people (or more can assemble multi track tunes from different locations.

I am guessing how it works is:

Everyone has the same software (has to be PC in my case)

One person records one or two tracks, saves/ emails the file (wav?mp3? other?) to the other person.

Remote person opens that file in the same program and the 1 or 2 tracks populate into their program as the separate tracks that they still are.

They add their part(s), send it back, and so forth.

Then when done, is (somehow) mixed to stereo.

Questions are:
What is a good PC program?

Do both parties have to use the same program?

Do these programs give you X number of tracks to record into and then a feature to let you mix it to stereo. I do have a program called Sony Sound Forge which I have used for putting records and tapes into digital files.

You can(?) record the instrument (guitar, bass, keyboard, etc.) direct into sound card… meaning you have to have a 1/4” output jack from your instrument reduced down to 1/8” input jack (also known as mini-plug) to go right into sound card input on the back of your PC.

These are some of the questions I have to even get started. Thanks for any advice or references to online resources.
RB
Making his way out of the cassette era.
 
Welcome to the forums. First things first, read these threads: HERE and HERE

If you do some reading before BUYING ANYTHING you will save yourself a lot of heartache and money!

To answer your questions quickly, you've got the basic idea on collaborating. By using WAV files or other non-lossy formats (FLAC for example), you do nto need the same software to do this type of thing. Reaper is an excellent DAW that only costs $60 to register. There are others.

When you have done the reading pointed to above, come back and ask some more questions.
 
Thanks and I missed that sticky about basics. Will absorb all of this before putting out more questions.
 
You're on the right track.

You don't use your computer's sound card,
what you use is called an interface, they can be had affordably
and typically sit outside your computer,
where you plug your instruments into it and it
converts the analogue to digital, via usb,
and back to analogue when
you want to monitor your work.

You save the music as files in your computer and can work
with them in various ways.

A good basic book like Home Recording for Musicians for Dummies
is a very sound beginning investment tio get an overview or what is involved.

Stick around and show us what you come up with for your studio!
 
To answer a couple of your other questions - the standard format for uncompressed audio files is .wav. All DAW software will operate on these files, so NO, you don't need the same software, depending upon what you're doing and how you want to work. If one person is in charge of the mix, then they can do that in their DAW with files supplied by the others. If you're having multiple mixers, then having the same software and being able to exchange mix parameters would be useful.

And people generally use something like Dropbox to transfer files and listen to mixes etc. Think clould, not email.

Good luck
 
rdb3 said:
Questions are:
What is a good PC program?
Click to expand...

Cubase, Sonar, Reaper (not expensive, very good) and dare I say Protools.

Do both parties have to use the same program?
Click to expand...

Nope. As suggested, you can share the wav files and each DAW program will be able to import it. Be sure to be cognizant of starting points so the wav files will line up. Also, I personally use 320kbps mp3 for passing around tracks from collaborators. Downloads are a lot quicker.
Do these programs give you X number of tracks to record into and then a feature to let you mix it to stereo. I do have a program called Sony Sound Forge which I have used for putting records and tapes into digital files.
Click to expand...

Yes, most will have unlimited tracks. Most audio interfaces will come with a lite version of a popular DAW program such as Cubase, Ableton Live, or Sonar. They might have track limitations, but usually nothing that is really limiting (like 64 tracks instead of unlimited). I believe Sound Forge is good for mastering your album after you get all your songs recorded and mixed. Not sure if it's good for recording and mixing.

You can(?) record the instrument (guitar, bass, keyboard, etc.) direct into sound card… meaning you have to have a 1/4” output jack from your instrument reduced down to 1/8” input jack (also known as mini-plug) to go right into sound card input on the back of your PC.
Click to expand...

As someone else said, you really don't want to use your soundcard. There are audio interfaces that are specifically designed for what you want to do. Ihave always recommended that most home recordists only need a 2-channel interface unless they are recording acoustic drums and need more mic inputs. A 2 channel interface makes your shopping experience easier and cheaper. Try Here.
 
minor progress made - getting active again

Well, back to the scene after 2 months away.Spent some time learning this site, making settings, etc. Read basics that are posted.
*****
I have done this much. Replaced my cheap, part of the motherboard sound card with a way better one. Could hear the diff just playing songs on YouTube etc.

Next round of questions/affirmations or corrections sought. Some of this is just getting conceptual understanding of it.

I take it that there are these hi-end free standing DAW that are used in place of your sound card. In either case you need an interface.

Since I am amateur and not looking for hi-end results, I can just use one of these interfaces with my soundcard? I got an Alesis Guitar Link and also a Behringer. One's a cable, other more of a box.

Both come w/ CD w ASIO drivers, which must be essential, but also this Guitar Rig or similar software that must be about getting guitar/amp/stompbox sounds (this is not actual recording software??) So I really don't have to install this second group of things. Want to keep it as simple as possible.

so the path is
guitar to interface, interface to sound card, sound card to recording software?

Reaper seemed pretty complex at least for my needs right now.

Found another, MixPad -- is this real multi track software so I can maybe put down 2 things, send it to another person who opens my file into MixPad, adds a part or two, and sends it back for review, or maybe one more part?

then, once you are recording, you have two options -- not unlike a studio-- you can hear the precorded parts and your part going on, either over speakers or thru headphones?

Thanks everyone.
 
What exactly did you replace the onboard sound card with?


rdb3 said:
so the path is
guitar to interface, interface to sound card, sound card to recording software?
Click to expand...

Terminology is getting mixed up here, but here are the basics.
DAW usually refers to software. Logic, cubase, mixcraft, Protools...they're all daws.

Soundcard is technically an interface, but usually means cheap/crappy soundblaster etc.
You can get decent PCI sound cards (maudio delta) but they're not very common.

Interface usually means something that would completely replace any onboard sound, or any pci soundcards.
Presonus firestudio mobile, tascam us***, maudio fast track etc are all budget interfaces.

That alesis guitarlink there is an interface with usb connection. I don't know how good or bad it is, but there you go.
 
Questions and update:

Is MixPad good enough for amateur fun doing online collaborations?

I have finally been able to get sound into it w/ my Alesis usb cord. Installed something called ASIO that seems to have taken hold and this is the default.

WTF is this latency thing? I am just doing little 2 part acoustic guitar things to practice and learn the program... but when you play it back the 2nd part is off, like it gets recorded a tiny bit later. I thought in The Modern World stuff like this would not happen.

So it seems you have to adjust some buffer/slider thing. I mean do you have to keep fooling with it until you get them in sync.

I am just happy I am getting 2 parts to play back at all but they aren't in sync.
 
What did you replace the internal sound card with and are you using the ASIO drivers that came with it?

A bit of background: basic sound devices use a type of standard driver known as MME. This is standard on Windows and is designed more for things like simple video and audio playback and low quality Skype phone calls etc. It achieves reliability by having a pretty big buffer size so, if the drivers are interrupted by other things happening in the computer the process is still stable because of the buffer.

For serious home studio purposes, ASIO is fairly essential. ASIO was developed for recording purposes and uses a very stripped down set of drivers working with smaller buffer sizes and less latency. However, you do have to play with settings to use the lowest latency possible and still have a stable system. For example, I know some people who use a very low latency setting when tracking (to improve timing) and raise this when mixing so they can cope with more real time effects.

It's also worth optimising your computer for audio--there are lots of help sites there specific to whatever form of Windows you have.

Finally, you mention have guitar simulator software that you use--if possible, save this for the mix because all such things add extra latency as the process your sound.

I can't comment on Mixpad as I've never tried it--but you might want to experiment with Reaper--free to try and dirt cheap to buy.
 
Dang, a reply from Australia...

Replies are:
the original sound card was a junky part-of-the motherboard thing, but replaced it was a Creative Audigy which was well thought of. Heard a major improvement in playback sound.
No ASIO came with it.

ASIO came with a Alesis guitar to USB cord I bought. Installed that, but did not install the guitar/amp simulator software since I would not need it. Bout all I need is reverb and delay which MixPad has. But good to know that this kind of stuff adds to latency.

Reaper seems to be well thought of ... going to try it and compare to MixPad.

I had a Behringer guitar to USB link, but returned it because the software would not install. I didn't know at the time that I really didn't need the software. It was just extras -- like emulator stuff. But maybe it would be better to have because it has a headphone jack, line/mic level switch and volume control for headphones.

One thing I did learn about latency today was that once you have your setting that offsets the latency, that's pretty much it. I thought it had to be set for each recording.

So I am making slow progress in the The Modern World. Will report back in a while.
 
Whoever told you a Creative Audigy is "well thought of" ripped you off. It may be well thought of for gamers but it's next to useless for any form of semi-serious music recording.

There are dozens of better options: M Audio, Presonus, Tascam, Focusrite, E-MU, Alesis, MOTU, RME and a bunch of others all make good interfaces for recording and all of them will have proper ASIO drivers. They'll also have good mic pre amps and microphone inputs on XLR which can provide phantom power for condenser mics.

You're right about the latency being fairly stable--but, if you start to add effects it'll vary each time you add another one.
 
Hi RB, seems to me that you already have quite a bit of analogue audio "junk" about the place? If so I am going to go down a rather different track to usual ('sright, NOT an NI Ka6!) and suggest you frisbie that Creative(not) card and fit an M-Audio 2496 in its place.

Next get a small mixer, two mics and some line in is fine and good one is the Behringer Xenyx 802 but there are excellent offerings from Soundcraft, Mackie, Yamaha and others. Your past experience with tape and instruments will I am sure tell you what cables to buy to link the mixer to the soundcard and back.

The only blot on this landscape is electric guitar. They generally don't sound good going into the line input of a mixer but the fix is fairly easy, a pedal. Anything by Boss works as a high Z to low Z buffer even when it is "off" (not so those daft so called "true" bypass jobs!) the GE-7 eq is great for the purpose.

The 2496 card will give you the lowest latency of ANYTHING short of a $500 RME.

For software do try the free forever Samplitude Silver. You might like it so much you will splash out on the £149 Sam Producer!

Dave.
 
still getting messed around

Well seems like the jury is in on the Audigy card... it sounded at least for playback so much better than what was there before that I figured it was ok.

I gotta some kind of results before I go shellin' out any more dough on a sound card. So far I have not been able to produce a single multi track recording.

However, it has been suggested above that the Audigy sound card IS the cause of latency. At the risk of sounding dumb, I didn't even know that much. I didn't even know there was such a thing as latency until I played back a short 2 part guitar thing and it was slightly out of sync.

Still if latency can be offset I will at least learn how to do it.

Finally figured out how to get sound into MixPad, then had just started to figure out how to fix the latency prob and understand this ASIO thing. Is ASIO essentnial to making recordings?

Then for some reason, the input signal into Mix Pad just dissapeared.. went away and I can't get it back. I had made no changes to anything/any setings ! So am back where I was 2 weeks ago.

Where it stands now is:

I had a behringer UCG 102 guitar link. and for some reason the software simply would not install. So I returned it, not knowing that the software wasn't needed...it was just FX and stuff.

Then got this Alesis cable and was starting to get results in to MixPad as mentioned above.

But since the Behringer unit has headphone output. mic/line switch and volume control I got another one and will try it.

Also, seems like everybody is big on Reaper so have just downloaded it and will experiment.

When I can sucessfully make a multitrack recording, send it to someone for other parts, get it back, mix to stereo, make mp3 then will get another sound card. right now actual sound quality isn't a big deal... just learning the process is --and has been pretty hard to figure out thus far altho I have made progress.

Actually the only analog stuff I have is a Tascam 424 mark 3, and one EV mike.
 
With the Behringer thingy, you need to install the DRIVER (Click Here). Figure out which operating system you have and choose the correct download. If it doesn't install, you need to figure out why.

Don't worry about your audigy soundcard, it shouldn't be a part of your set up. If it's there, that's fine you probably won't use it for recording.

The ASIO driver allows your hardware and software to talk with each other. If its written correctly it should determine latency for you and the DAW should see that value and ues it automatically. I wonder about Behringer drivers, I also wonder if MixPad can do latency compensation. I believe Reaper can because a lot of people here use it and no one complains (or even thinks) about latency.

If you can't get your behringer driver to work, try ASIO4ALL (same link as above).

Getting your hardware and software to play nicely together is always the first step and sometimes it ain't easy. (Try Cubase lol), but once you get it going you'll find that it's the easiest hurdle to jump. :laughings:

good luck and have fun!! :)
 
thanks to all

well, going to get out this behringer tonite. It came w/ a CD. I can just install basic drivers? I don't want that Modern World guitar&amp modeling scene.

Will see how I do Reaper... and report in later.

Bob B
 
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