youtube jam session recordings

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ben F
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Ben F

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Hey All,
I'm new to this forum and to recording, so go easy on me. I'm looking to make some youtube videos and would like the sound quality to be better than my android. My fundamental question is: What type of microphone is best for picking up a jam session consisting of one acoustic guitar and 3 singers? I would like to be able to just set up one mic and have it pick us up with some quality intact. Thank you for taking time to read and answer. And feel free to get wordy.
 
You're gonna need more than a microphone.

Do you have an interface with phantom power and DAW software?

Also, what's your budget for the project? $100 $500 $2000?


Acoustic guitar and 3 singers, depending upon the type of genre and level of competence, I'd be getting a second mic on the guitar, or at least a line in from the pickup. It has a pickup yeah?
 
No I havent bought anything yet. Thought I'd do my research first. So you're saying with the phantom power, I should use condenser mics? If I get multiple mics should I get dynamics and not worry about phantom power? I'm on a pretty tight budget, so lets just assume the cheapest. Thanks for the reply Armistice.
 
Also, its a nylon acoustic. No pick-up or electronics. Style is folk/blues with some pop.
 
So, the thing to do is use your Android device and critically listen to the balance of voices vs. guitar. My concern would be that with a nylon string guitar and three voices, depending upon what they're singing, and how hard, that you'd be struggling to hear the guitar....

Seriously, to try to capture this sort of ensemble with any clarity, you're probably looking at a condenser mic and you'd need to do a fair bit of playing around with positioning to work out exactly where to get the balance correct, hence my comment about a second mic on the guitar, or using the pickup... but no pickup.

Honestly, I have no idea at the low end of the budget what to suggest... a multi-pattern LDC and budget interface would probably give you acceptable quality, but I don't have any recommendations for you. Keep reading through the stickies up top and do a bit of searching of the forum and bump this to the top and you'll get some answers.

Good luck kiddo...
 
I would look into one of these:

Tascam DR-05 Palm Sized Recorder

Less than $100. Capable of stereo recording to uncompressed .wav files. Records to SD card. Plugs into computer via USB to transfer files. Huge step up from the android in terms of sound quality.

Basically you mount it on a camera tripod and have one of your guys sweep the room with it while the other guys play until you find the sweet spot. Put an X on the floor with a piece of tape and you are done.

For those of you who think I'm smoking something funny for recommending this - people sneak stuff like this into live venues here in DC for bootlegs, and the result can be shockingly good.
 
So a multi-pattern LDC is gonna be my best bet for picking up the singers and maybe a dynamic for guitar. It is a nylon, but I use a lot of percussive flamenco techniques (rasgueado, etc.) so its higher end albeit thin. I have nails so anything arpeggiated snaps a bit more.

Chuck, thats not a bad idea. It would keep it simple and gorilla for a beginner like myself. Great suggestion.

Thanks for the help brothers.
 
Hi Ben - no matter which way you go - I have a couple more thoughts...

For this type of ensemble playing/singing I think you would be served well by doing a natural stereo (preferably) capture. I would not venture into individual instrument or vocal micing based on your stated goals.

Percussive flamenco guitar cuts through with no problem, and I highly doubt it will need additional mics on it. I wouldn't use a pickup for flamenco guitar (because it doesn't sound natural to me) and I wouldn't use a dynamic - as they don't typically have the high end response or clarity required for this application - If there's one thing you don't want - it's a *dull* recording of this type of guitar.

If the portable recorder route is not appealing to you I would look at a pair of small diaphragm condensors arranged in an X/Y config (you can google that topic), and a decent two channel audio interface with pre-s. It's not set it and forget it, you will have to learn more, you will need more equipment (read spend more) - but you could also potentially have a blast, learn alot in the process and end up with some equipment that will serve you beyond the youtube demo phase.

If you really want to open up the wallet (around $500) - There is also a microphone that I really like that doesn't seem to get much play in the forums - the Rode NT4. It's actually a pair of small diaphram condensors in a single package and pre-arranged in an X/Y configuration. Since it's in a single package you only need one stand, and since it's pre-configured you don't need to mess with X/Y setup.

This is a recording I did with the Rode NT4, a Focusrite Saffire interface and a laptop. It's a stereo recording of approximately 15 boys aged 7 to 11 arranged in clusters in a church. You can hear the music director poking out - she was standing behind the group in the middle singing softly and conducting.

Huron Carol

Disclaimers

1. the piano is digital and recorded direct and was not captured with the microphones
2. I added compression using a VST plugin
3. I added reverb using the true stereo 'Church' preset on the SIR2 Vst plugin
 
Thats a great recording Chuck! That mic is exactly what I'm looking for. Its way out of my price range, but I definately have a long term goal to buy that now. Thanks! Did you pan the boys or was that an effect from the stereo and positioning?

I read the reviews on the Tascam Dr-05 and am very much considering it and maybe downloading an open source like audacity. This is more my price range and know-how.

How would the Tascam compare with the Rode? I mean, half that quality? Would it perform better in an open hall type setting or like a smaller bathroom type deal?

Ok I'm off to do my x/y research. Thank you so much for your time and knowledge brother. I feel like Ihave a good starting point now. I know what it is I dont know. Lol
 
Ben F said:
Thats a great recording Chuck! That mic is exactly what I'm looking for. Its way out of my price range, but I definately have a long term goal to buy that now. Thanks! Did you pan the boys or was that an effect from the stereo and positioning?

I read the reviews on the Tascam Dr-05 and am very much considering it and maybe downloading an open source like audacity. This is more my price range and know-how.

How would the Tascam compare with the Rode? I mean, half that quality? Would it perform better in an open hall type setting or like a smaller bathroom type deal?

Ok I'm off to do my x/y research. Thank you so much for your time and knowledge brother. I feel like Ihave a good starting point now. I know what it is I dont know. Lol
Click to expand...

Hi Ben - more important than the actual equipment, I was suggesting that a stereo X/Y might be a good way to go for a natural ensemble in the style you described. The Rode is convienient as it is all in one package and easy to set up, but you pay a price for that. You could probably spend less by looking at an adapter like this Beyerdynamic MAV802 Mic Holder for Stereo XY or ORTF Set-up | Full Compass and two SDC mics.

As far as the Tascam unit, or any of the like - Zoom, etc. - the quality can be really good. You can do some youtube searches for bootlegs, live recordings done with the various units. Guys who record live shows with this stuff routinely tag their videos with equipment names. I can't rightly say if it will be 50% or whatever quality of the rode. The beauty is that it's small, inexpensive and easy to set up. If you don't like it after spending an afternoon with different placements just send it back :-). Live stereo recordings work best in a larger open room in my opinion. I wouldn't personally record anything in a bathroom :-)

As to the recording of the boys - earlier in the day I recorded them as a whole to a single stereo .wav file. After an hour or so attention spans started to wander. I ended up having to split them into three groups. I recorded each of the three groups to individual stereo .wav tracks. In the mix I panned the first group 75% left, the second group up the middle and the third group 75% right. I don't know how in the world mixing three stereo tracks ever worked out- but if you listen carefully you will clearly hear the three clusters, and within each cluster you can identify different boyss positions.
 
I would probably save money with those stands and two SDC mics, but then I'm looking at cables , an interface, and some sort of phantom power. I feel like the Tascam gives me the ability to improve and manipulate our sound right away for a good price. It sucks to have to forfeit the flexability of two mics though.

How would two dynamic mics do in xy and ortf? Would it be worth the price cut?
 
Ben F said:
I would probably save money with those stands and two SDC mics, but then I'm looking at cables , an interface, and some sort of phantom power. I feel like the Tascam gives me the ability to improve and manipulate our sound right away for a good price. It sucks to have to forfeit the flexability of two mics though.

How would two dynamic mics do in xy and ortf? Would it be worth the price cut?
Click to expand...

I've never heard of or tried dynamics in X/Y so I don't know - doubt it would work, but who knows. I still stand by the tascam or something like it - so easy to try and return if it doesn't work out :-)
 
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