Need advice on Mixers, Interfaces, Midi Controllers and Mics. Help where ya can guys.

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So, I recently bought a 2011 Mac Mini with Lion OS X (upgraded its RAM to 8gb) and installed Logic Pro 9. I've been working my way around Logic with nothing more than a mouse and keyboard and would now like to purchase some hardware to achieve 3 things, for the moment:

1. To record vocals
2. To record electric and acoustic guitar
3. To control software instruments properly

Here lies the dilemma; I've been looking at USB audio interfaces, USB mixers, USB midi controllers and USB microphones and I dont know what to buy because I'm not sure which overlap in terms of their function and which are better than others. I'm willing to spend around £100 on each.

AUDIO INTERFACE
Which of the following (similarly priced) USB audio interfaces would be the best in terms of ease of use (drivers etc), quality and minimal latency?:

Focusrite Scarlett 2i2
Presonus AudioBox
Tascam US-200
ESI U46 XL
M-Audio Fast Track Pro
Focusrite Saffire 6

MIXER
Also, I have been looking at the Behringer X1204 USB Xenyx Mixer. Am I right in thinking that if I bought this USB mixer there would be no need to buy any of the aforementioned audio interfaces? What confuses me is, if the mixer and the audio interfaces are around the same price and they effectively do the same thing; (are able to record guitars and vocals), why do most of the audio interfaces above have a mere 4 inputs and the mixer has 12! I don't want to scrimp on quality at all so if its a quality thing then please let me know.

Would the Behringer mixer allow me control up to 12 channels in logic? So, as a track is playing I could record the automation via physically moving the individual sliders to change the levels of individual channels?

Could I also, when the time comes, record several different instruments at the same time onto individual channels using this mixer?

MIDI CONTROLLER
Which would be the best purchase out these controllers?

Alesis QX49
M-Audio Oxygen 49
Behringer U-Control UMX 490

MICS
I was looking at the Yeti USB Microphone as an all round good entry level mic to record acoustic guitar and vocals, but would it be a waste to buy a USB mic (with all its bells and whistles) when I will buy one of the audio interfaces and/or the mixer which will both accept XLR connections? If so, could someone point me in the direction of a quality mic which will pick up details in pretty chilled vocals and acoustic guitar for around the same price point.


I realise this is quite a question heavy post but I've been trawling the internet from videos to forums not really getting the comparisons or answers I've been looking for. If anyone has had experience with any of the gear mentioned or knows that some brands can be consistently trusted please respond to what you can. Thanks a lot. KXD
 
Some quick answers. No to a USB mic. You can only use 1 audio device at a time, so you only want 1 usb device into your computer. I suggest this is an interface. Some mixers will allow multi-channel, but most only feed one stereo pair to your computer (mains out) so you can't actually multi track with most mixers. Check this carefully. If you need more inputs, look at interfaces with more channels. You can get 8 and even up to 12 inputs on an interface that will allow each channel to a track in your DAW.
 
What Washburn says.

1 USB mike - No.
2 Mixer - No.
3 Interface - yes
4 Midi controller - yes.

Mixers: there are (broadly) three ranges:
1 A standard mixer that will combine a number of input channels into L & R outputs which then have to go through an interface (or a sound card) into your computer.
2 Mixer with USB (e.g. Xenyx). This mixer combines a number of channels into L & R which go via USB into the computer, and you can get output from the computer (again via USB) into the mixer.
3 Mixer with inbuilt multitrack interface (e.g. Presonus StudioLive, A&H Zed R16). This will feed a number of separate tracks into your computer via firewire or USB, and is probably what you have in mind. But they are expensive.

If you are just starting out, then look firstly for a multi-track interface.
 
Hi,

Another +1 to the posts above.

A mixer is the last thing that we need. It's a bit sad, because all those juicy looking knobs and sliders are the first things that catch your eye in studio pics. But for home recording you simply don't need them. You and I are unlikely to need to pre-mix input before it goes into the computer and you can mix your tracks perfectly well with a mouse. If I've got it right, that's called mixing 'in the box'.

What you do need is a good audio interface to get a reasonable signal into your computer. Typically this will have some knobs to adjust how much pre-amplification the signal gets on the way in. Some things need that boost, others don't. It will also have as many inputs as you need - plus some spare for those instruments or bits of gear you haven't bought yet... ;)

As a newbie myself, my list looks like this:

  • 1. A decent audio interface (got that... :))
    2. A decent DAW (got that too...)
    3. Experience. (This is the most important really, but you need 1 and 2 to practice on)
    4. Some reasonable powered monitors to hear it all (got them now....)
    5. A midi keyboard (Tick that too)
    6. A mic. Mostly I play straight down the wire, but I do attempt to sing, so some sort of long suffering microphone is needed (another box ticked)

The experience really is the biggest deal. I have reasonable gear now but acquiring the knowledge of how to get the best from it, and developing the ears to really understand the subtle differences, are my major goals for the next year or two (well, forever really, but especially for the early stages).


I have an M-Audio Axiom 49 and have been very happy with it so far. The keyboard width is not too space greedy, yet still gives a reasonable span of octaves (you can access the rest when you need them). It also has a selection of knobs, sliders and pads that you can assign to control aspects of the DAW, play as drum pads, or whatever. I tried assigning the sliders to my DAW and they certainly worked but, to be honest, they were relatively crude and it was more like a bit of fun to test it out than some kind of essential function.

Best of luck with your choice and the learning.

Chris
 
KXD said:
Also, I have been looking at the Behringer X1204 USB Xenyx Mixer. Am I right in thinking that if I bought this USB mixer there would be no need to buy any of the aforementioned audio interfaces? What confuses me is, if the mixer and the audio interfaces are around the same price and they effectively do the same thing; (are able to record guitars and vocals), why do most of the audio interfaces above have a mere 4 inputs and the mixer has 12! I don't want to scrimp on quality at all so if its a quality thing then please let me know.
Click to expand...

Hi again,

I'd guess that this is a very common point of confusion and that it's not unusual for newcomers to buy a mixer when they really need an audio interface.

They actually don't "effectively do the same thing". Here's my take on it, and I hope somebody will jump in and correct me if I'm still not quite there . :)

  • Audio Interface:

    This is the one we all need. It's the gateway between our instruments and the computer. Typically, they allow multiple tracks to be delivered - separately - to the DAW (recording software program). 'Separately' is the key point there - we want to be able to hook up more than one thing - i.e. guitar, bass, keyboard, mic(s) etc and send the signal to individual tracks on the DAW. Some have very limited inputs (so that you can use something like one guitar and one vocal mic, for instance) while others have many more. You can still do multi-track recording with the more basic ones but you have to unplug and do the tracks one or two at a time.

    Mixer:

    Now I could get into trouble here.... but mixing can be done in a variety of ways.

    What 'mixing' usually refers to is the business of adjusting and then blending all those individual tracks. That could be as simple as adjusting relative volumes or it can involve an almost endless amount of manipulations. Eventually though you blend them all together as a finished track for a CD or whatever.

    The mixing process can be done 'in the box' - i.e. using all the controls in the DAW - or 'out of the box' using a hardware mixer. Now I'm really getting on shaky ground here because I don't know what the audio advantages are of using a dedicated external mixer are, but my guess is that they are minimal unless you have a pretty decent mixer and a good swag of knowledge. I'm not intending going there yet anyway. If you have a reasonable DAW then you don't need an external mixer at all. In fact buying a crappy mixer might even ensure worse results.

    Control Surface:

    A device to allow you to operate the controls in your DAW with external knobs, buttons and sliders instead of using a mouse or regular computer keyboard. May look like a 'proper' mixer and does help you to mix - but uses the DAW on the computer rather than its own electronics

As you can see, there's plenty of room for confusion, and some devices overlap the functions.

For instance, my friend has a Digidesign 003 in his studio that looks like this:

Digidesign-003-Fig-1.gif



It's an audio interface with multiple inputs and it’s also usable as a control surface. He can assign all those knobs and sliders to work the DAW. Interestingly, he usually doesn’t but prefers to do most things with a mouse, and only occasionally going to the board. It’s a personal preference thing.

It’s also described in the blurbs as a ‘mixer’ but how it specifically does it all is still outside my knowledge.

I hope that’s useful (and reasonably accurate... :o )

Here's a more detailed explanation from somebody who does know Choosing a Mixer by Tweakz

Chris
 
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All i can really talk about is the usb midi keyboards you're talking about. I have a M-Audio oxygen 25. It was the first thing i got after getting Reason 5, (swiftly followed by a little Reloop Play DJ interface for the audio). It does a good job of being a cheap keyboard. The 49 key one has the faders too, so theres your mixing type interface with it. I chose the Oxygen for two reasons, one was because it was cheap and i wanted to start making some music without investing alot of money to start incase i didnt really enjoy it all. Turns out i love it!!!!. And the second was because it was integrated well by the software im using. No need to worry about getting it set up, just told Reason what the keyboard is and i was away making sounds.

But, if the Alesis is supported by Logic or you're happy to get it all integrated properly i'd go with that as it has a sepated power supply and a midi in/out interface with it. The oxygen just has usb and sustain pedal sockets, and the behringer has no faders and midi out only.

I hope this helps :)
 
M-Audio Axiom 49: 1st Gen or 2nd Gen whilst using Logic

Hakea said:
I have an M-Audio Axiom 49 and have been very happy with it so far. The keyboard width is not too space greedy, yet still gives a reasonable span of octaves (you can access the rest when you need them). It also has a selection of knobs, sliders and pads that you can assign to control aspects of the DAW, play as drum pads, or whatever. I tried assigning the sliders to my DAW and they certainly worked but, to be honest, they were relatively crude and it was more like a bit of fun to test it out than some kind of essential function.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot to everyone for their input, some very useful information. Looks like I wont be needing a mixer but I am interested in using the saved money on a half decent controller like the M-Audio Axiom 49.

Which generation of the model do you have? Could you talk a bit about assigning/mapping it to your DAW? Was it simple? I am torn between buying a 1st gen or 2nd gen.

The main difference (apart from price and layout) being that the 1st gen uses Enigma which you have to manually map knobs etc to DAW whilst the 2nd gen uses Directlink which auto-maps apparently. I do use Logic though would that be compatible with Directlink? And does anyone know how good Directlink is? Worth spending extra on the 2nd gen for ease of use with Logic?

Thanks guys
 
KXD said:
Which generation of the model do you have? Could you talk a bit about assigning/mapping it to your DAW? Was it simple? I am torn between buying a 1st gen or 2nd gen.

The main difference (apart from price and layout) being that the 1st gen uses Enigma which you have to manually map knobs etc to DAW whilst the 2nd gen uses Directlink which auto-maps apparently. I do use Logic though would that be compatible with Directlink? And does anyone know how good Directlink is? Worth spending extra on the 2nd gen for ease of use with Logic?

Thanks guys
Click to expand...

I have the earlier model Axiom 49. It wasn't all that easy to find the Enigma software as it doesn't seem to be offered on the M-Audio site any more. I did find it eventually but it was only simple if you know a bit about midi already. The older Axiom was reputedly awkward to set up with Pro Tools, but I did get it working with the sliders operating track volumes and the knobs doing the panning. To be honest it didn't work all that well. The later version is supposed to work comfortably using Directlink, just by choosing a preset.

I'm not sure how well it works with Logic, but it should be OK. The M-Audio site seems to claim that it does, but check it out and see if it gives any details. I really bought mine to use it for playing midi instruments. Mapping it to the DAW was a bit of a novelty, but I wasn't tempted to keep it hooked up for that. So I can't really give any info on whether it would suit your preferences or not.
 
New equipment

Hey guys, thanks for the info Hakea. Just a quick update if anyone's interested, managed to pick up an Akai MPK 49 and a Cakewalk UA-25 EX interface for £250/$380! I think that's a pretty solid deal. Struggling a bit on setting up the interface with Logic though. Anyone got any tips?
 
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