Is there any way to retrofit a time grid onto an existing recording?

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catfrmoutrspace

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Hi

I've done a few demo recordings and I'm looking to stretch them on to a time grid so a studio can use them more easily. If there is a visual interface I could time stretch the track where it slows down and squeeze it slower where it speeds up. If I can see the recorded wave form I could even drag the correct notes on to the time grid and leave the software to do the correct time-stretching. Make sense?

Is there any software that can do this? It would save me so much time to not have to record the demos again. They are just to use as in-ear when I record the real songs in a studio.

Thanks!
 
I would think all you do is import the file to your DAW, and select 'grid view'? Am I missing something here?
 
I know Cubase can do this (AudioWarp). Surely other DAW's do as well.
 
mjbphotos said:
I would think all you do is import the file to your DAW, and select 'grid view'? Am I missing something here?
Click to expand...

Right...it's simple to go to grid view...but I think he wants to stretch/squeeze the audio to fit something...???
Not sure why he would want to do that or need to do that unless the audio is off-tempo?
I think he's basically talking about quantizing things...which isn't really about stretching/squeezing that actual audio.
 
Loading the wave into a DAW will give you the grid that you want.

There are two ways of dealing with it:

1 Adjusting the tempo within the daw to line up with the beats in the audio file, or

2 Stretching and shrinking the audio file to line up with the gridlines.

Most DAWs will allow you to do both; some easier than others.

For example, in Reaper, holding down the Alt key while clicking and dragging the end of a WAV will stretch (or shrink) it, while preserving pitch.
 
You could try beat mapping too. It's more tedious because you'll have to line the transients of the wave files to the 1st beat of each bar, but if it was never recorded to a click, it will be more accurate than finding the closest bpm grid, because the standard grid won't account for timing drifts.
 
gecko zzed said:
For example, in Reaper, holding down the Alt key while clicking and dragging the end of a WAV will stretch (or shrink) it, while preserving pitch.
Click to expand...

Is that just a visual stretch to make fit the grid...or is the audio stretched?
Not sure how it would stretch and not change pitch/sound of the audio?
Maybe in minute amounts....
How/with what does it fill in the "blanks"...the extra space on the time-line that is created by the stretch?
 
miroslav said:
Is that just a visual stretch to make fit the grid...or is the audio stretched?
Not sure how it would stretch and not change pitch/sound of the audio?
Maybe in minute amounts....
How/with what does it fill in the "blanks"...the extra space on the time-line that is created by the stretch?
Click to expand...

No . . . the audio is stretched. Reaper can stretch without changing pitch.

If you have an audio beat that lines up with, say, bar 1, and another that lines up with bar 3, but the one at bar 2 is off, you can split the wave at the beat that shuold line up. In Reaper you can select both halves of the split wave, and Alt drag so that the beat lines up with bar 2, stretching one half and shrinking the other . . . no gaps!

With small stretches you can get away with minimal audio degradation, but long stretches have audible (and unpleasant) effects.

I expect that the OP is working with stuff that was, say, recorded originally on tape (at best) or without a click (worse), or perhaps even both (dangerous). The trick will be selecting a tempo in the DAW that is as close as possible to the original tempo to minimise the amount of manipulation.
 
Oh...I can see how that would work for beats...but how does it stretch long notes, passages...don't they get distorted in their melodic structure (not audio distortion)....?
 
Yeah, in the original post, he stated needing to change tempo of the recording by stretching. I assume that means he wants to align the tracks to a grid. Not create a tempo map to his recordings.
 
miroslav said:
Oh...I can see how that would work for beats...but how does it stretch long notes, passages...don't they get distorted in their melodic structure (not audio distortion)....?
Click to expand...

Sure . . . if you stretch them far enough. For example, a singer's vibrato gets lengthened (if you stretch the wave). How perceptible it is depends on the amount of stretching.

But in the sort of repair work being done here, the OP should not have to go to such extreme lengths.

For example, a song may have been recorded on tape at 120 bpm. The vagaries of some tape players may result in variable speed, i.e. 120 bpm + or - 1% (or similar). Pulling this into line with a digital 120 bpm does not involve big stretches or shrinkages.

On the other hand, if the original recording did not use a click (whether on tape or in a machine), there can be substantial tempo changes. Speeding up is very common. I've experienced variations of 20 bpm and more.

From memory, though, the OP intends to use the tempo-normalised track as a basis for redoing stuff, which means that quality issues are not as big a concern.
 
he must be talking about quantizing....

where you literally can squeeze or stretch audio to a certain degree without getting weird noises.

Quantizing Audio in Logic 9 - YouTube

the easiest thing to screw up during quantizing is the symbols can get to sound weird if they are warped too much... and also it can mess with phasing

but its very helpful....

usually a must do for the people i record because i want to make sure their downbeats and off beats or perfectly on grid... but dont over quantize because you still want it tou sound human.

then again... Kings of Leon doesnt even record with a click track... hmmmm
 
gecko zzed said:
Sure . . . if you stretch them far enough.
Click to expand...

Ahh...so it's like anything else then, if you over use it, you'll hear it. I thought maybe someone came out with some new app that could do stuff like that without any degradation (which I didn't think would be possible when overdoing it on long notes and certain phrases).
So it's like pitch-correction then, you have to find the limits for a given note/sound.

I'm sure for beats it's much more reliable and with less artifacts.
I chop up beats and move them around all the time...but I've never had need to stretch/squeeze audio, though that's probably due to me always using a click track and keeping tight with the rhythm. Less to fix later on.
 
miroslav said:
Ahh...so it's like anything else then, if you over use it, you'll hear it. I thought maybe someone came out with some new app that could do stuff like that without any degradation (which I didn't think would be possible when overdoing it on long notes and certain phrases).
So it's like pitch-correction then, you have to find the limits for a given note/sound.

I'm sure for beats it's much more reliable and with less artifacts.
I chop up beats and move them around all the time...but I've never had need to stretch/squeeze audio, though that's probably due to me always using a click track and keeping tight with the rhythm. Less to fix later on.
Click to expand...

I've found it depends on the DAW as well. Pro Tools has quite an impressive audio and pitch stretch algorithm where as cubase isn't quite as impressive. Have not messed with it with reaper (honestly I have not done anything more than record and mix a little in reaper so not even sure how to edit properly inside of the daw).
 
you may not like em... but they arent horrible lol... they are one of the only good rock bands of this day in age... or are you a nickleback fan?
 
Bisson820 said:
you may not like em... but they arent horrible lol... they are one of the only good rock bands of this day in age... or are you a nickleback fan?
Click to expand...

Fine I hate that band. Pretty sweet comeback with the Nickleback bro. :laughings:
 
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