EQ'N Vocals

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This is the program and EQ I'm using but this is a picture from the actual site.


If you look at "PICTURE A" there is 3 bands, that go from 3, 2, 1 from top to bottom. The left side is "band gain" the right side is "band frequency"

In "PICTURE B" it shows same settings but adds Q1 Q2 Q3 controls.


The question I have, is there certain gains and frequencies to avoid or stay in range with when using the EQ or is it strictly set by ear?
 
BLP said:
ms16_popup.png


This is the program and EQ I'm using but this is a picture from the actual site.


If you look at "PICTURE A" there is 3 bands, that go from 3, 2, 1 from top to bottom. The left side is "band gain" the right side is "band frequency"

In "PICTURE B" it shows same settings but adds Q1 Q2 Q3 controls.


The question I have, is there certain gains and frequencies to avoid or stay in range with when using the EQ or is it strictly set by ear?
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No magic formulas. All by ear and hope your monitors aren't selling you a bill of goods.
 
RRuskin said:
No magic formulas. All by ear and hope your monitors aren't selling you a bill of goods.
Click to expand...

+1 Audio mixing is so undefined, which is why I love it. Do what sounds good in the mix. As Ruskin said, hope your monitors are set up correctly.
 
yup its by ear but there are certain ranges of frequencies that you can look at for problems to increase or cut gains

in general

100-250Hz helps the vocals sound more upfront
250-800HZ is generally where the muddiness occurs
1-6kHz gives the vocals more presence
6-8kHz can add clarity, its also a common area for sibilance so careful of any gains here
8-12kHz can add brightness

(all imho of course)

Use your ears, try to make sure your listening environment is as good as you can make it, and if possible try different mics if your not happy with your sound
 
I do use eq, but I'm of the mind that if the vocals don't sound pretty damn good before you eq then there was something wrong with the recording.

Whenever I use eq I find it makes the sound smaller, less pure, less like real life... so I avoid it, always end up using some, but aim not to.

When you eq it makes the harmonics not line up is what I think I'm hearing.
 
I don't know about that EQ curve, it looks pretty extreme IMO. You shouldn't have to EQ a vocal too much if you're using the right mic, just maybe a slight boost or cut,
 
When EQing anything there are three steps

1. Listen to what you have and what it sounds like
2. Imagine what you want it to sound like
3. Figure out the difference and set the controls on the EQ accordingly.

The settings on the EQ are always the difference between what you have and what you want it to be. So even if you are trying to get a vocal to sound like another vocal, the settings won't necessarily be the same because your raw vocal track and the other one might not have sounded the same to begin with.
 
dintymoore said:
I do use eq, but I'm of the mind that if the vocals don't sound pretty damn good before you eq then there was something wrong with the recording.

Whenever I use eq I find it makes the sound smaller, less pure, less like real life... so I avoid it, always end up using some, but aim not to.

When you eq it makes the harmonics not line up is what I think I'm hearing.
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I agree....

There are times when you might EQ a given vocal for effect...but often if you try to "fix" a vocal too much during the mixing...it gets weird sounding...it can lose the natural sound of the original voice.

The mic and the preamp are your best tools for getting the right vocal...maybe a touch of compression if the dynamics are all over the place. If you are having to EQ a lot at the tracking stage...then the mic and pre probably are not right for that vocal.
 
miroslav said:
There are times when you might EQ a given vocal for effect...but often if you try to "fix" a vocal too much during the mixing...it gets weird sounding...it can lose the natural sound of the original voice.
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I don't mix vocal music much, but in my somewhat limited experience, you REALLY have to be careful when mixing vocals. Almost no one knows what a bass guitar or a kick drum or an electric guitar sounds like in a room, so you can afford to be pretty heavy handed because the concept of "normal" is really dictated by how people hear an instrument in recorded music. However people hear the human voice unprocessed every single day of their lives. Tweak it too much, and it begins to sound unnatural. The concept of "normal" is very strictly defined, so if you stray too far away from it with a vocal, it has to be for effect because the human ear won't buy it as a "real" voice.
 
DrewPeterson7 said:
I don't mix vocal music much, but in my somewhat limited experience, you REALLY have to be careful when mixing vocals.
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I on the other hand don't do a lot of instrumental mixes...but when I have, I found them to be much more liberating in what you can pull off with a mix.
When vocals actually mean something to you in a mix (lyrics and melody)...and you want them to be the center of attention so that they sound good and are clearly understood...the rest of the mix must make way for them while still holding its own.

It can be a tough balancing act....

And let’s face it…in one way or another, the “vocals” ARE usually what most of the listeners will focus on. Yeah…sometimes there’s a guitar riff or a opening bass line or drum roll that might act as interesting ear candy and make the song more identifiable…but it’s the vocals that grab the most attention even though we all know that the whole mix is equally important…but that’s our thing, we that are involved with recording…and not for the general public to really consider consciously in most cases. They instead focus on the vocals most times.
 
I don't know if this has been mentioned, but always remember your ears are part of the listening process!

If you spend too long adjusting vocals in one go, you really will most likely get great results in your mind, but then the next day they will sound completely wrong. Get your foundation adjustments correct, give your ears time to forget the mix, then go back and see what else you can do!
 
My suggestion is to A/B the vocal track with a professional CD.Something where there are vox with no music. Have a scratch track, sing the exact same thing as the CD, then go back and forth listening to each and messing with the EQ to get as close a match as you can.

A common problem is a poor track to begin with. A $60 MXL 990 picks up 20-20,000 Hz and so does a $3500 Nuemann. Yet there are very drastic and obvious differences between the two.

Get the best mic you can afford. It's OK to get a used one. Then you will have more to work with.

Hope that helps.
 
vocals are something I think I usually get right. I've never had much problem EQ'ing them and I always use the same, easy method. Once I've recorded the track (I use a condenser and record completely flat) I sort out the compression. To EQ, I usually roll on a bit of 10k shelving until the vocals have the right amount of top end cripness. For the midrange I turn the cut/boost up full and slowly turn the sweep until it's sounding really harsh and sibilant (usually around 2-3K) then roll it off until it sounds smooth and right. I then either leave the low end flat or roll on a tiny bit at around 80-125Hz depending on the sound I'm after. That method always leaves me with good results. Hopefuly it may be of some use to you.
 
Million ways to skin a cat...

I'm a fan of relatively narrow cuts of muddy or harsh frequencies. I almost always roll off below 100Hz, shelf down the lows to get the vocal sitting with the mix balance (rather than boosting highs), skewer out some ~220-250Hz to remove proximity effect, something in the 5-700Hz range to gain some clarity, a bump from 1k-2.5kHz depending on tone, and then some top end sculpting depending on what tone the recording chain imparted. This might be before or after compression. Or both.
 
Eric Peterson said:
Million ways to skin a cat...

I'm a fan of relatively narrow cuts of muddy or harsh frequencies. I almost always roll off below 100Hz, shelf down the lows to get the vocal sitting with the mix balance (rather than boosting highs), skewer out some ~220-250Hz to remove proximity effect, something in the 5-700Hz range to gain some clarity, a bump from 1k-2.5kHz depending on tone, and then some top end sculpting depending on what tone the recording chain imparted. This might be before or after compression. Or both.
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Thanks for the advice. Here is where I start having trouble.

What is "roll off" , "shelf down" and how do you "skewer out" 220-250hz. Where at exactly? And "a bump from 1k-2.5kHZ "


This way of talking when getting mixing advice is foreign to me right now and I'm still trying to figure it out
 
You need to start reading this. http://www.tweakheadz.com/guide.htm

There is no point asking questions that you can't understand the answer to.

He wasn't using technical terms (for the most part), but boosting and cutting different frequency ranges is what EQ does. Shelves and roll offs (cut filters) are a couple of types of EQ tools.
 
Farview said:
You need to start reading this. http://www.tweakheadz.com/guide.htm

There is no point asking questions that you can't understand the answer to.

He wasn't using technical terms (for the most part), but boosting and cutting different frequency ranges is what EQ does. Shelves and roll offs (cut filters) are a couple of types of EQ tools.
Click to expand...

Why would I need to read all that in the link? I'm having trouble with EQ and frequency mainly. I just move fades till it sounds good right now. I'm trying to understand technically what I am doing.
 
Almost everything you will need to know about audio is in that guide. Even some stuff that you don't know you need to know.
 
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