Setting Gain for recording vocals

[BLP]

http://www.presonus.com/products/Detail.aspx?ProductId=4

I use a firebox to record.


I have always kept the gain high

it says the microphone input has 45 db of variable gain (+14 db - +55 db)


Is there an average gain you want to keep it at while recording vocals?


the mic itself has a +10 db boost powered on, and the "mixer" program has a +15db input level boost powered on.


with that said, on the actual firebox mic input gain what should I have it set around 2?



Also. Is it better to turn the gain up and down when recording someone who sings low volume then really high or tell them they need to learn mic control

 

[Jim Lad]

To set the gain, play/sing as loud as you can and pull back on the trim until there is no clipping.
You should average around -12dB for vocals and should not be introducing any hiss.
I'll stand back now.

 

[Massive Master]

I'd go considerably lower than "no clipping" -- Considerably lower.

 

[bstarstudios]

just my .02 cents. i agree with the below clipping, also on the high/low singer issue id say don't adjust the gain knob while recording if you need certain parts up later try automatization. (i may be wrong but thats what i do)

 

[Jim Lad]

We're basically all agreed.
MM chooses to go much lower than I do, the idea being that you can always add volume but you can't repair inherent damage.

 

[d.bop]

^^^ what they said.


...except i tend to track more towards -18dBFS


Record in 24-bit and keep the gain knob down (well not ALL the way down..) You can always bring it up later

 

[Farview]

BLP, you are lokking at this backwards. There is no set amount of gain you want to apply to the mic to make it work correctly. The amount of gain you need is how ever much is necessary to get the signal level coming out of the mic up to the recording level you need/want.

If you are trying to record mouse farts from across the room, you will need a lot more gain than if you are recording some guy screaming into the mic an inch away.

What I do is have the vocalist hit and hold a note relatively loud in the style that he will be singing the song. I then set the level to my desired recording level. My interface is set to -15dbfs = 0dbVU, so that is about where I tend to set it.

 

[BLP]

BLP, you are lokking at this backwards. There is no set amount of gain you want to apply to the mic to make it work correctly. The amount of gain you need is how ever much is necessary to get the signal level coming out of the mic up to the recording level you need/want.

If you are trying to record mouse farts from across the room, you will need a lot more gain than if you are recording some guy screaming into the mic an inch away.

What I do is have the vocalist hit and hold a note relatively loud in the style that he will be singing the song. I then set the level to my desired recording level. My interface is set to -15dbfs = 0dbVU, so that is about where I tend to set it.

Yes, I usualy do a test vocal then set the gain accordingly. But i didn't just want to move the knob up and down without knowing what I'm doing. That is something I'm trying to get away from. I've came along way from wildy throwing fx on everything to having more an understanding what they do.

I know there isn't a set amount but I was just wondering everybodys average setting when tracking vocals


When people speak like -15dbfs= OdbVU i have no idea WHAT it is but I have an idea of WHAT it sounds like.

 

[marshall409]

www.tweakheadz.com

read read read.

its all much simpler than it appears, dont be scared.

the number one rule is if it sounds good, youre doing it right.

the only thing that alarms me is that boost on the software program, id avoid that. you need to get the signal up to the proper level before it hits the computer, which as mentioned before, should be somewhere in the -24 to -6 dBfs range, to stay well away from the dread 0 on the meter in your software. NEVER push the meters on the software into the red.

Hope this helps,

Adam

 

[Farview]

When people speak like -15dbfs= OdbVU i have no idea WHAT it is but I have an idea of WHAT it sounds like.

Every set of converters has a nominal input level designed into it. Most of the time this is line level. (it can be +4 or -10 line level, you have to read the manual)

A line level signal coming into the converters is going to produce what level signal in the computer? On better equipment, it tells you in the manual that, for instance, a line level signal will produce a -15dbfs signal in the digital realm. So now you know your conversion rate, you can decide the signal level that you want to record at.

Since line level on the analog side is 0dbVU and 0dbVU is -15dbfs on the digital side, I make my average levels sit around -15dbfs.

 

[BLP]

www.tweakheadz.com

read read read.

its all much simpler than it appears, dont be scared.

the number one rule is if it sounds good, youre doing it right.

the only thing that alarms me is that boost on the software program, id avoid that. you need to get the signal up to the proper level before it hits the computer, which as mentioned before, should be somewhere in the -24 to -6 dBfs range, to stay well away from the dread 0 on the meter in your software. NEVER push the meters on the software into the red.

Hope this helps,

Adam

Interesting. I will read. I'm glad that's the number one rule because that is what I usually do lol.

Why does a boost on program mixer for interface alarm you? JW

 

[Farview]

Why does a boost on program mixer for interface alarm you? JW

Becuase the meters read the signal AFTER the the gain change. So now you have no idea what signal you are feeding the converters.

And, it is pointless. Boosting or cutting in software while you are recording doesn't accomplish anything that you can't do in the mix when it is appropriate. The level at which the converters are hit is the important part of level control while you are recording.

 

[BLP]

Wow. Thanks.



Never looked at it like that!

 

[Farview]

Worst case scenario, you could be clipping the converters and turning the signal down in the software. The meter will read below clipping, but you are only turning down a signal that is already clipped. In that case, it's too late and you are completely screwed.

 

[LI_Slim]

Speaking as a recording amateur who has made the mistake more than twice, I agree with leaving extra head room. But if you go too low you're going to bring unwanted noise up later on.


As for the singer, his/her problem could be a combination of lack of vocal control and poor mic technique (you need to back off the mic when you sing really loud -- seems obvious, but...). But if you can't fix the singer's technique how about recording with a little (actual) compression?