Art for art's sake - acoustic guitar design...

  • Thread starter Thread starter Armistice
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Armistice

Armistice

Son of Yoda
Just been into the city music store - apart from the usual suspects, they seem to have bought in a batch of Baden acoustics and Larrivee acoustics...

They're not cheap.

The Baden "dreadnoughts" are an interesting shape indeed, but there are some others that are a curvier shape and they look nice - high gloss finish. Didn't play them but sure they're a good guit...

But.... no pickguard and no fret marker dots...

Sorry, but I need both of those... especially the marker dots in dingy performing environments.. the ones down the side of the neck are fine, but I like to see bigger ones on the neck too, because I play all over the damn thing up to the 14th fret and they're handy to have...

Sorry, no sale..

Larrivee.. again, great looking, probably great sounding, but tiny little fret marker dots, so ruled out again...

Why?

Too much emphasis on looks and not enough on usability, or is it just me that sees these two things as essential to a professional acoustic guitar?


http://www.badenguitars.com/index/bg.htm in case you haven't seen them... don't like that "dreadnought" shape one little bit...
 
I can see why you might want fret markers but a pickguard is non essential kit as far as I'm concerned.
 
I don't install fret inlay unless asked. Very few people actually yse them even if they believe they do. Side dots are essential for most. If you are continually using the fret markers as reference you could be causing damage to your wrist, neck and shoulders. Seriously.
 
muttley600 said:
I don't install fret inlay unless asked. Very few people actually yse them even if they believe they do. Side dots are essential for most. If you are continually using the fret markers as reference you could be causing damage to your wrist, neck and shoulders. Seriously.
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Huge +1

I mean, I guess if fretboard dots are a huge deal to you, then these are probably not the right guitars for you. But, I've played my share of guitars over the years that either had no inlays, or only an offset double dot at the 12th or something, and while initially I thought that might be a problem after a couple minutes I realized two things; one, that after a bit more than a decade of playing my hands just know where to go when I want to play something, and two, when I DO look, I mostly look at the side dots. Most guys I know who have tried to play something with an unconventional inlay back me up on this.

That said, personally I'd never write off a guitar without picking it up and playing it. If it plays well and sounds great, then looks are pretty secondary, IMO.
 
Chevelle's guitarist/singer bought a roll of glow in the dark tape and put small strips of it on the back of the neck right at each fret marker. Not only does it show where the frets are, but they're also easy to see even in very dark situations.
 
TelePaul said:
I can see why you might want fret markers but a pickguard is non essential kit as far as I'm concerned.
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How so TP?

I mean sure, if you only play fingerstyle, then yes I can see that they might be surplus to requirements, but playing strummed and fingerstyle in live situations, then a pickguard is required to stop me occasionally hitting the wood with the pick and, over time, destroying it. The reason they're there in the first place.

And KoP - I've thought of similar but I can't see that it wouldn't prove a huge hindrance to moving up and down the fretboard, and that even placing small patches over the marker dots, I would probably knock them with my thumb, which tends to position itself there...

Mutt - I'll get back to you on that - perhaps I don't use them, but I know I have a guitar with less visible side markers in dim light and I'm basically forced to look over at the fretboard. I do when playing lead high up, think that I look at the fret markers not the side markers however.
 
And another argument in favour of fret markers...

They help me work out WTF my band mate, who is very musically untrained but a very good songwriter, is playing when introducing new songs...

The man doesn't really know his chord names.

Of course, they're on his guitar, not mine. If he ever buys one without fret markers, we're fucked! :D
 
My classical came with no fretboard markers and only a single dot on the binding at the 12th fret. It didn't take a week before I had a bottle of white fingernail polish and put my own dots on the binding at 3, 5, 7, and 9. I was way too discombobulated without them.
 
Tadpui said:
My classical came with no fretboard markers and only a single dot on the binding at the 12th fret. It didn't take a week before I had a bottle of white fingernail polish and put my own dots on the binding at 3, 5, 7, and 9. I was way too discombobulated without them.
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Thats pretty standard for classical guitars. You we're lucky to get the 12 fret marker although that is the neck/body join in any case.:)
 
Armistice said:
How so TP?
I mean sure, if you only play fingerstyle, then yes I can see that they might be surplus to requirements, but playing strummed and fingerstyle in live situations, then a pickguard is required to stop me occasionally hitting the wood with the pick and, over time, destroying it. The reason they're there in the first place.
Click to expand...

I think to 'destroy' the top below the sound hole by strumming, you'd have to have an extremely unorthodox or overly aggressive approach to strumming, even over a number of years.
 
I have to agree.

My martin acoustic doesn't have a pick guard - and to this day there's barely any scratches. (and I usually play with a pick)

I can't imagine "Destroying" it.
 
Every now and then I see an acoustic with noticable pick damage to the top and it leaves me wondering about the player's technique.

BTW, Armi, you're right, that Baden is ugly ;)

:cool:
 
Armistice said:
...but playing strummed and fingerstyle in live situations, then a pickguard is required to stop me occasionally hitting the wood with the pick and, over time, destroying it.
Click to expand...

My dad has a Gibson from the early 60's:

IMG_2340.JPG


Thanks to some help from this board, we've pinned it to most likely be a B-25N from around '63 or so. It originally came with a pickguard, but it either came off or was removed almost immediately.

Over the past 50 years, then, that's the amount of 'destruction' that had been acumulated. And, to be fair, as a kid I definitely remember rubbing a pick along the grain of the top, making little indentations in it - some of that was not natural wear. I'm a little embarrassed to admit that today, but it's not like I knew any better and anyway by now it's part of the guitar's charm.

Long story short, I wouldn't lose too much sleep over it - if that's what 55 years and an 8 year old can do, then unless you're a completely abusive player you should be fine. :)
 
Aus! You're still here! How goes it?

So, yeah, I guess you're right on the fret markers... hadn't really thought about it but at rehearsal last night I was looking almost exclusively at the side dots... almost... not quite.

Still not convinced on the pickguard... I don't hit it much but I do hit it.. and I'd prefer strike damage there than on the wood, I guess.

I lent a band member a guitar many moons ago because it was better than he had (story of my life... musicians!) and we needed to be pragmatic, and in a very short space of time he managed to significantly damage the wood around the sound hole with his pick... I have no idea how... talk about bad technique, how can you even do that? Took it back as soon as I noticed, but the damage was done...
 
When I think of picking damage, I always think of Willie's Trigger:

6980590-md.jpg


I mean, how the hell do you do that to a guitar, even if you play hundreds of shows per year for decades?
 
muttley600 said:
Thats pretty standard for classical guitars. You we're lucky to get the 12 fret marker although that is the neck/body join in any case.:)
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A blank binding AND a blank fretboard is like a parking lot with no lines indicating parking spaces to me...might as well do away with the frets too and go all violin-like. Oh man can you imagine what the bedrooms and rehearsal spaces of the world would sound like with fretless, mark-free fretboards on every guitar? If you think the layman can't manage his/her intonation now...
 
Tadpui said:
I mean, how the hell do you do that to a guitar, even if you play hundreds of shows per year for decades?
Click to expand...

Someone should make a replica of that... sure it'd sell for thousands to the gullible... mebbe even provide Willie with enough royalties to git himself a newbie...

I mean I get having favourite guitars 'n all, but there's a point at which you just have to stick your hand in your pocket...
 
Fret markers? I suppose I must look at them but I'm not conscious of it. Probably at the beginning of a tune to make sure I'm in the right key but after that I know if I'm off and just blend it back in.


lou
 
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