Double CD, Long Post.

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WhiteStrat

WhiteStrat

Don't stare at the eye.
[Sorry for the extremely long post. I'm posting up a double CD here, and I figure the back story's gonna help it make some sense. And I'm a wordy SOB.]

Yeah, I'm breaking some clinic rules with this thread. For one thing, I'm posting 24 songs. I'll at least break 'em into categories so you can pick what you want to hear. Next, I'm not gonna do anything with any advice you may give me. The CD was pressed 8 months ago. And while not a "rule"—this is all Christian music. I make no apologies for that, and even if you don't care for it—the recordings can still trigger some conversations, no?

I've got good reasons for posting these, though. A lot of folks here helped me with mix advice that I did (or tried to!) follow when it was still in progress. I figure they might like to hear the finished project. And to my detractors—yeah, I do more than midi. There's vox and drums and guitars and harmonicas and congas and shakers and more guitars—so let me know what you think. And last but not least, even though I can't change anything based on criticisms, I still welcome those criticisms. I'm always looking to learn, and maybe the conversation will help others as well. So feel free to ask me about anything I did on any of the tunes.

Here's the story. A good friend of mine—a singer, songwriter, piano player, comes to me wanting to record some songs. They're Christian adult contemporary/pop. She’s got a bunch of 'em—a double CD's worth, but has like no time, and just wants to get some scratch tracks down—like momentos or keepsakes.

I've worked with her before in a producer/arranger capacity, and after hearing this new set, I convinced her to let me take 'em up a couple notches. All she had the vision for was piano and singing—she had no idea what to do beyond that. So she came to the studio and just sang and played piano. (As I recorded her digital piano, I also captured the midi—so I could use some better piano samples. I’m glad I got that midi—I was gonna need it later.)

After she tracked piano and vox, she left to have a baby. Then I got to work. I took the 24 songs, and designated some to stay as just piano and vocals (though we pushed some of those by adding harmonies and vocal counterparts). I started working on the rest—adding simple instrumentation to some, full orchestration to others, and taking still others in a "full-band" pop direction.

In the end, I wore many hats: I recorded and mixed everything. Except for her piano and voice, I played most everything but the drums—acoustic and electric guits, bass, extra keys, harmonica. Her husband played acoustic on a couple that he wrote and sang, and a friend played bass on I think 2 or three tunes. Wherever you hear any percussion—drums, congas, shakers, whatever—that's my son in law. I wrote and either played or programmed all the orchestration. Oh yeah, and I did the photography and design for the CD (I'm in media/marketing in my day job).

And the midi from the piano? While she played to a click track on everything, when I added drums after the fact, the drummer was tighter than she was. So I had to edit all of her piano parts to sound like she was playing with the drummer. (She couldn't come back and retrack.) The whole project was a bit challenging because I was taking a number of her songs in directions she had never imagined—and she pushed back on numerous occasions. I held my ground and won almost all the time. In the end she was glad—with 24 songs, the variety that my "new directions" added turned out to be a good thing.

Anyway, it's been long enough since the release that the sales have more than settled down, so I feel free to post 'em all here now for your review. Here they all are—in loose categories:

Just piano and vocals:
Who Is Like Our God
In Defense
What If
All I Want to Say
Touch My Broken Heart
My Reward
Make Your Name Great

Light instrumentation:
Hope
Beautiful Love

Heavier orchestration on these:
Break My Heart
Song for a Prophet
In my Garden

Full band "pop" treatment:
You Are My Rock
The Lord Is Good
More Than Enough
The Fasting Song
Feet
Because/Enough
Taken Away

Small band, hand percussion on a couple:
Talk To Me
Lord I Believe

Acoustic guitar based songs. The first one (The Safest Place) is me, the second and third are her husband on acoustic, since he wrote those two.
The Safest Place
The Love of the Lord
Apple of Your Eye

Thanks for your time! I look forward to hearing your thoughts on this project.

WS
 
I didn't listen to all of the songs, but little snippets in each section. I have to say they really came out well. In the pop section, there were nice guitar tones, the drums sounded great all the time, and the bass fit the songs. Not to mention that your friend has a great voice! :eek: I also really dig that acoustic-behind-electric guitar sound. That was pretty much the same with everything I listened to. Great job! :D
 
Bob,

Congratulations are in order. You've done a really professional job on these. Great job on the strings. Did you play the midi for those? Of course my favorites are the acoustic guitar ones. Nice work on those. Some of the acoustic guitar has some great 3D movement in it, like it was recorded mid/side, or at least some two mic technique. Really nice.

I remember you posting some of these earlier, and the addition of strings, drums and guitars really takes it up a notch IMO. I'll bet your friend is ecstatic over the result.
 
I listened to several of the songs and I have to say they sound really good. The lady has a really nice voice and it sounds like there has been a lot of hard work put into this project, very professional. It's great that she has a friend willing to go the extra mile to make these songs sound the way they do. I hope the CD was a success.

Trump
 
squibble94 said:
I didn't listen to all of the songs, but little snippets in each section. I have to say they really came out well. In the pop section, there were nice guitar tones, the drums sounded great all the time, and the bass fit the songs. Not to mention that your friend has a great voice! :eek: I also really dig that acoustic-behind-electric guitar sound. That was pretty much the same with everything I listened to. Great job! :D
Click to expand...

Thanks for the kind words, squibble. She does have a great voice, doesn't she? I feel now like I was bragging about "all I did" to take these songs to the next level--but the bottom line is, she wrote and sang the songs. That's the foundation. And it's a solid foundation in her case. The rest is just gravy!
 
guitar zero said:
Bob,

Congratulations are in order. You've done a really professional job on these. Great job on the strings. Did you play the midi for those? Of course my favorites are the acoustic guitar ones. Nice work on those. Some of the acoustic guitar has some great 3D movement in it, like it was recorded mid/side, or at least some two mic technique. Really nice.

I remember you posting some of these earlier, and the addition of strings, drums and guitars really takes it up a notch IMO. I'll bet your friend is ecstatic over the result.
Click to expand...

Thanks zero. BTW--I gave this lady (Angela) one of your son's CDs--she and her husband both love it!

All of the guitar parts are standard two mic technique (one at the 14th fret, one at the lower bout). Some are done with the same exact part, some with different inversions for texture.

As far as the midi goes, in every case I started by playing it. I don't do well programming from scratch. I take the part of the song I'm working on, set it to loop, pick my patch (whether it's oboe, strings, whatever) and just start playing along with it--over and over. After I like the line I've come up with, I record it. Then I go in and edit the MIDI part--timing, aftertouch, velocity, etc.

And is she ecstatic? Lemme put it this way--this is her third or fourth attempt at serious recording (one was a live concert capture via remote studio truck that cost her tons!) and she's perhaps her own worst critic--just down to earth and not too excitable. So I considered it a high compliment when she called me out of the blue 4 months after pressing to tell me that she was still listening to it. I'll take it!
 
trumpino1 said:
I listened to several of the songs and I have to say they sound really good. The lady has a really nice voice and it sounds like there has been a lot of hard work put into this project, very professional. It's great that she has a friend willing to go the extra mile to make these songs sound the way they do. I hope the CD was a success.

Trump
Click to expand...

Thanks Trump. It was a success. Considering she wanted to burn copies on her PC and photocopy covers as needed, she (and her budget minded husband) was pretty scared when I suggested these songs were worth a more professional production.

I donated all of my time and services. So it became a "side project" since it didn't pay any bills. After she tracked piano and vox, I spent 9 months writing and recording the rest. She got a bit impatient (in a nice way!) but in the end was thrilled. All she needed to do was sell enough to cover the pressing--and she did that in a month. (We rushed to get it back before Christmas--she did a couple Christmas concerts and sold a bunch as Christmas gifts; the timing really helped.)
 
Right on, Whitestrat! That was quite a service you provided her. 9 months of work on this? Wow... I'd be pretty grateful... I know how much work goes in to production, so.. Good on ya, bro.

I listened to Feet, Taken Away, and Beautiful Love (just clicked on what piqued my curiosity).

I must say, the production has some good work in it. Especially considering the way in which, and the reason for which you did it.

I really like the guitar work Taken Away, and I really enjoyed the strings in Beautiful Love.

If there's a critique in order, for me it'd have to be the drums. Getting drums to sit in a mix properly is an art. Whenever I do it, most of the work is just crossing my fingers and hoping it works out. Each session is very different.

The drums I heard, sadly, sounded a bit flat and 2-dimensional. Not horribly, though. I'm can't quite put my finger on why, but they didn't quite fit in the packaging of the 2 songs I listened to. Almost like they were in their own little world, wanting really badly to be part of the song, but not quite fitting in.

All in all, Whitestrat.. Stellar work - and good for you. I respect you all the more by giving your services in this way. Just awesome.
 
PoeticIntensity said:
Right on, Whitestrat! That was quite a service you provided her. 9 months of work on this? Wow... I'd be pretty grateful... I know how much work goes in to production, so.. Good on ya, bro.

I listened to Feet, Taken Away, and Beautiful Love (just clicked on what piqued my curiosity).

I must say, the production has some good work in it. Especially considering the way in which, and the reason for which you did it.

I really like the guitar work Taken Away, and I really enjoyed the strings in Beautiful Love.

If there's a critique in order, for me it'd have to be the drums. Getting drums to sit in a mix properly is an art. Whenever I do it, most of the work is just crossing my fingers and hoping it works out. Each session is very different.

The drums I heard, sadly, sounded a bit flat and 2-dimensional. Not horribly, though. I'm can't quite put my finger on why, but they didn't quite fit in the packaging of the 2 songs I listened to. Almost like they were in their own little world, wanting really badly to be part of the song, but not quite fitting in.

All in all, Whitestrat.. Stellar work - and good for you. I respect you all the more by giving your services in this way. Just awesome.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the input. I totally agree with you about the drums. I was (still am) definitely on the learning curve with drums when I did these. I hear the same thing.

My favorite of the "pop" tunes is The Fasting Song:

Listen to The Fasting Song

It's a little rednecky/bluegrassy, but honestly it just seemed to mix itself. If you get the chance, listen and tell me if you think the drums sit better in this one.

Thanks!
 
WhiteStrat said:
My favorite of the "pop" tunes is The Fasting Song:

Listen to The Fasting Song

It's a little rednecky/bluegrassy, but honestly it just seemed to mix itself. If you get the chance, listen and tell me if you think the drums sit better in this one.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Yup! They definitely sit better. Much better. The more I listen, these drums even sound a bit more 3-dimensional... What did you do differently?
 
PoeticIntensity said:
Yup! They definitely sit better. Much better. The more I listen, these drums even sound a bit more 3-dimensional... What did you do differently?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure--but there's definitely a difference. It's gotta be in what I did in the mix, cause it's the same drummer, same kit, same mic set up--all the drums were done in the same two day session.

I'll have to go back to my mixes and see what I did differently--I've always thought that some of the drums sounded much better than others. Wish I'd have noticed that back then!
 
Just checking out a few of them and I am very impressed with the work you have done. Great Job!
 
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