Ugh... My brainnnn...

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3nigma

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So I'm purchasing a guitar today, and the past few days I've been looking at learning the basics of playing through online stuff I've found.

My god, do I have to learn all this stuff? Dozens of chords, Scales, and then translating guitar notes to keyboard notes, ETC. This is making me not wanna learn guitar. I don't wanna be a music teacher!

For the experienced players out there, is it possible to be GOOD or even amazing at guitar just by being self taught? Like, not learning any of this music theory. Do the great guitar players out there know all the technical stuff? Like, oh in this solo I've just played an E-flat followed by a G and an A, then the minor 3rd C chord! Blah!

I can type over 95 words a minute and I've never taken a typing class. Had a computer for the first time when I was around 12. Now, I probably have horrible form and posture when it comes to typing, but I've seen other people type and their fingers are in a completely different position who are taught from computer classes, and they make more errors when they type but they can't type as fast as me.

Can this relate to guitar? Can I be good without knowing any of this crazy scientific stuff and just jam and figure out which notes sound good, how to play by ear and such?
 
3nigma said:
Can I be good without knowing any of this crazy scientific stuff and just jam and figure out which notes sound good, how to play by ear and such?
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That's what I've been doing for more than 30 years and it seems to have worked out quite well. Just start by learning some basic chords and scales. Don't try learning everything all at once or it will seem to much like work instead of being fun.
 
3nigma said:
My god, do I have to learn all this stuff? Dozens of chords, Scales, and then translating guitar notes to keyboard notes, ETC. This is making me not wanna learn guitar. I don't wanna be a music teacher!
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It's possible to be a great guitar player without knowing any theory. However, I'd recommend at least learning some basics....test the waters, see how it feels. You may find that you've stumbled upon a new interest!

Theory will help to enrich your appreciation and understanding of guitar playing. Plus....you'll help fight the stereotype that guitarists are theory nitwits! ;)
 
cashcohen said:
It's possible to be a great guitar player without knowing any theory. However, I'd recommend at least learning some basics....test the waters, see how it feels. You may find that you've stumbled upon a new interest!

Theory will help to enrich your appreciation and understanding of guitar playing. Plus....you'll help fight the stereotype that guitarists are theory nitwits! ;)
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Well, I understand some basic music theory. I mean, I get intro-verse-chorus-verse-interlude-chorus-outro song templates and things like that. I know how to tune guitars, I understand how to hold them and play notes and read tabs.

As far as actual music theory, like chord progressions and in depth stuff I have NO clue. When someone says "Okay play this in the key of C." I have NO idea what that means. I'm afraid of like... entering a room with real taught musicians after I've got some skill and they're like "Okay we're gonna start in C and move to the key of A after this and then you're gonna play an E minor chord here followed by a triple line down the D string."

I'm gonna be like... wut?
 
3nigma said:
Well, I understand some basic music theory. I mean, I get intro-verse-chorus-verse-interlude-chorus-outro song templates and things like that. I know how to tune guitars, I understand how to hold them and play notes and read tabs.

As far as actual music theory, like chord progressions and in depth stuff I have NO clue. When someone says "Okay play this in the key of C." I have NO idea what that means. I'm afraid of like... entering a room with real taught musicians after I've got some skill and they're like "Okay we're gonna start in C and move to the key of A after this and then you're gonna play an E minor chord here followed by a triple line down the D string."

I'm gonna be like... wut?
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The best thing to do is not worry about it. Find people to play with who are at your own skill/knowledge level or slightly more advanced.

Learning about keys and chords is a good place to start. It LOOKS more daunting than it actually is. I mean it. Beside, knowing how to play within a given key is a skill that will take you very far. Even if you can't read music or understand the intricacies of scales and arpeggios, many guitarists will expect this from you.

If you can afford lessons (even a half hour per week), do it. Find a teacher a trusted source (a guitar-playing friend/an expert from a guitar shop/etc.) can vouch for....that way, you won't end up wasting your money.
 
Unless you're born with some sort of super-natural guitar talent, there are some things you will have to learn to become a passable guitar player. By passable I mean able to play music and express yourself to a degree that pleases you and hopefully others.

Like others have said, you'll need to learn the basic chords, majors and minors. Learning how to barre a chord is nice but not essential depending on how far you wish to progress. And if you want to solo, play a few leads, you'll need to know a couple of scales at the very least.

All in all, not too much to learn. Don't phase out before you even begin to learn, it's not that difficult.
 
Some theory is just common sense.

3nigma said:
Well, I understand some basic music theory. I mean, I get intro-verse-chorus-verse-interlude-chorus-outro song templates and things like that. I know how to tune guitars, I understand how to hold them and play notes and read tabs.

As far as actual music theory, like chord progressions and in depth stuff I have NO clue. When someone says "Okay play this in the key of C." I have NO idea what that means. I'm afraid of like... entering a room with real taught musicians after I've got some skill and they're like "Okay we're gonna start in C and move to the key of A after this and then you're gonna play an E minor chord here followed by a triple line down the D string."

I'm gonna be like... wut?
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I find that many people totally misunderstand theory - both those that know theory and those that claim not to.
Firstly, theory is born of practice. In other words, things happen, then you give it a name or describe a method - not the other way around, at least initially, if that makes sense. To be honest with you, I'd love to have the word "theory" removed from from the language banks of all humans. It has connotations.......
Secondly, at this point you just need to concentrate on mashing up your fingertips and enjoying the sounds you make. I find alot of us pick up theory as we go along, almost by osmosis. Alot of the time, we don't even know it. Of course you need to know the names of chords and notes. That's just common sense. I'm hopeless with theory, if you put me up against some of my friends that are trained musically. I don't know what they're on about half the time. Frequently I'll be told that you can't play such and such a chord, it just doesn't 'go', it has to be subtle. But I often say, I don't want subtlety....I want it to jar. And as ignorant as this may sound, I can often hear something that I think goes well, even though my trained buds are going, like "no...no..." ! And if it's cool to my ears, there's got to be 10 people who feel it too. And if there's 10, there may be 100 etc...That's when I feel theory can be a handicap to some people.
But I'm equally adamant that theory naysayers can be just as blinkered. For me the simple truth is that there are many many levels of theory, from your conservatory professor all the way to folk like me that know a few chords.....and are picking up little bits and pieces all the time. I could feel just as intimidated playing with an orchestra as I could do with a jazz band as I could do with a power chord outfit as I could do with an R&B group........until I've played a bit and gotten my bearings.
Theory is not some terrible ogre that exists to stop you rocking. Neither is it a stick with which to demonstrate superiority. It's neutral. It can be helpful. It can be a hindering straitjacket. You determine which. You don't need to be afraid of it though.
I'm a self taught player. I learned with a chord book, a guitar and a pitch pipe. Once I knew a few chords, I just started putting together 'progressions'. I didn't even think about what was and what wasn't. If I liked C, F sharp minor, B flat and G sharp or whatever put together, I didn't care what anyone else thought.
As I've noted elsewhere, knowing theory or not knowing theory is not going to be the determining factor in whether you get proficient on the guitar or whether you write attractive songs. If I sang a melody to 100 guitarists, they'd all put different combinations behind it. Who's to say that Beethoven's would be better than the kid down the road who knows 9 chords and has only been playing 3 weeks ? That's the joy of music.
Play. Enjoy. Sweat. Create. See through walls.
 
There are several famous self-taught guitarists, although its a tough road to go. At very first, you at least need somebody to make sure that you aren't establishing habits that will be a detriment to your health or your ability to achieve your potential.

Sure you can type fast, but will you have carpal tunnel syndrome in 15 years? Same goes for guitar playing. Repetitive stress injury is serious, you should know that as a computer user and a guitarist. Establish good habits early on, and the rest of your career you can reap the benefits. In both disciplines.

90 words a minute isn't much use if it's only for half of your career. 45 words a minute with correct technique will last you a lifetime. 0 notes a minute on a guitar isn't very much fun either. At least consult an instructor within 6 months of picking up the instrument, after you've had time to bang out a few chords and sqeedle-dee-doo a few licks.

Bad habits are hard to kick. And if you love playing guitar, like really LOVE playing guitar, then you'll be doing it a lot. For a long time. I don't think anybody here would disagree with me on that.
 
The first few months to one year learning guitar are the toughest as you develop calluses on your fingers and build up those particular muscle groups. Doing it on your own takes dedication, as does learning any new thing. If you have the will power to do it yourself, go for it, but you may find a lesson a week from a teacher will go a long way in getting you along past the initial hump.
You may not need to learn theory, but you should learn all the chord names, and what makes a 7th or a major 7th chord different from a regular major or minor chord, etc. Why? because certain chords (and chord progressions) lend themselves to certain types of music and certain overall 'feels'. I know guitarists who can copycat some of the world's best rock guitarists, note for note, chord for chord, but can't tell you more than "it's a C-something., now a G-something" as you try to follow along with them.

Want to play simple blues with some guys? It's usually a variant of the I-IV-V chord pattern, just pick a key. For example in the key of C, I = C major, IV - F major and V = G major. Simple enough, really, but that's what is called 'theory'.
 
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http://guitar-music-theory.com/

this is a pretty good theory page that gives you what you need to know. Don't sweat it at first, learn some chords and learn a few songs, and go from there, but then come to something like that after a bit and see if it doen' tall fit a bit better.

Daav
 
Okay I think I'm getting some of it. Like, I've been looking at Guitar Pro for a long while now and I've been studying the scales and chords sections of the program.

Like the question I asked earlier, what it means to play in the key of C, I think I understand it a little bit now. Like, playing in the key of C means you're restricted to the C-Scale, or playing within it? Anyway yeah, my guitar's not here yet but I've been downloading and printing our diagrams of chords, scales, fret note names, tuning styles, etc.

I think I'll be fine in about a month or two.
 
3nigma said:
Okay I think I'm getting some of it. Like, I've been looking at Guitar Pro for a long while now and I've been studying the scales and chords sections of the program.

Like the question I asked earlier, what it means to play in the key of C, I think I understand it a little bit now. Like, playing in the key of C means you're restricted to the C-Scale, or playing within it? Anyway yeah, my guitar's not here yet but I've been downloading and printing our diagrams of chords, scales, fret note names, tuning styles, etc.

I think I'll be fine in about a month or two.
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One of the great things about playing music is that as long as you keep playing, you keep learning.
 
3nigma said:
For the experienced players out there, is it possible to be GOOD or even amazing at guitar just by being self taught? Like, not learning any of this music theory. Do the great guitar players out there know all the technical stuff? Like, oh in this solo I've just played an E-flat followed by a G and an A, then the minor 3rd C chord! Blah!
Click to expand...

I'm mostly self taught (I took a couple years' worth of lessons in college, but had been playing for a while before that), and in the process did teach my self "all of that music theory."

Really it depends what your goals are, but knowing theory certainly helps. I rarely sit there thinking, "Ok, G# resolving to the root of the A, then a B-C#-D run, then pull off to the open B string..." while I'm soloing, but at any given point I certainly know exactly what scale I'm in and have a pretty good idea what chord tones I can resolve to and how the notes I'm playing fit in with the underlying harmony. The idea is to know the stuff cold, but then stick it in the back of your mind and when you're improvising just think about melody and sound and have all the theoretical stuff sort of subconsciously informing your note choice, and there if you need it in a pinch.

So, definitely try to learn it. Start basic, build up. Learn a couple open chords, power chords, and memorize the notes in the chromatic scale (C-C#/Db-D-D#/Eb-E-F-F#/Gb-G-G#/Ab-A-A#/Bb-B-C - you need to know that as well as you do the alphabet, though you don't need to immediately focus on applying it to the fretboard), and then learn the minor pentatonic scale. Then, research the "relative major" concept, and suddenly you'll know two scales. Next, teach yourself some diatonic scales - start with the major, I guess, and then also learn to look at it as a relative minor. From there, read up on modes a bit. Once you know how to play all seven modes of the diatonic scale, then get pretty deep into chord construction - how to build major, minor, diminished, augmented, and dominant chords from a scale. By that point, you'll know the vast majority of what you need to know to be a rock guitarist. If you want, you can then get into some more exotic territory - diminished scales, whole-tone scales, the modes of the melodic and harmonic minor scales - but this stuff comes up a lot less often than you'd expect in rock.
 
3nigma said:
Okay I think I'm getting some of it. Like, I've been looking at Guitar Pro for a long while now and I've been studying the scales and chords sections of the program.

Like the question I asked earlier, what it means to play in the key of C, I think I understand it a little bit now. Like, playing in the key of C means you're restricted to the C-Scale, or playing within it? Anyway yeah, my guitar's not here yet but I've been downloading and printing our diagrams of chords, scales, fret note names, tuning styles, etc.

I think I'll be fine in about a month or two.
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Another very big question. :lol:

In the "key of C," it means you're playing a piece of music that keeps resolving to some sort of a C chord as the tonic. However, that doesn't tell you much about the quality of the chord - you could be in the key of C major, or of C minor. For example, if something you're playing is in the key of C major, then you would keep returning to a C major chord. You'd expect to see the G chord (the V chord) a lot, and the F (IV) quite a bit too. A minor, B minor, and D minor would also be in there a fair amount, because they're all chords that can be built from scale tones in the C major scale.

However, you can (this gets a little deeper into theoretical territory) certainly blur the edges of what works a bit if you pay attention to how you resolve, and it's not uncommon to be playing in a key and (especially in jazz) have a couple notes outside the key center pop in here and there. Without confusing you too much at such an early stage in the game, music is ALL about tension and resolution, and cadence is one of the most important concepts to get down - the way a V chord will resolve much more strongly to a I than to a ii, for example (in english, the way that going from G7 to C is more "satisfying" to your ear than going from G7 to Dm or to Am. It has everything to do with the huge number of half-step resolutions present when you go from the V to the I, and using that idea you can make some very "outside" notes work pretty well if you're careful).
 
3nigma said:
I can type over 95 words a minute and I've never taken a typing class. Had a computer for the first time when I was around 12.
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So if you're still 12, you'll do OK on guitar.

If not, practice, practice, practice.

If you have the ear/brain/body connection to learn and play by ear, you'll do fine. If not, you'd better learn to read music.
 
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