Outboard Compressor

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gibsonsgharp

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I have taken the advice of the folks here and have started recording everything "dry" with a condenser mic, through my Lexicon Lamba interface into cubase.

So, now, if I want to "polish" up a recording using my separate rack mounted dbx compressor limiter, what is the best way to apply this device to the recorded track and save the result?

I know the signal has to come out of the computer, through the interface and into the compressor, out of the compressor back through the interface into the computer, but to where? separate new track?

I suppose same question if I wanted to use a "non software" reverb or effect on a track.

Not sure how this would work.
 
Unless it's a really killer piece of gear,just use plug ins.
 
Thanks for the advice, however, I'd like to learn the proper method, just in case.

I suppose I would ask the question that if plug ins are the answer, then why do all these studios have all these racks and racks of gear?
 
gibsonsgharp said:
Thanks for the advice, however, I'd like to learn the proper method, just in case.

I suppose I would ask the question that if plug ins are the answer, then why do all these studios have all these racks and racks of gear?
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Because if a studio is using outboard gear it's because it's a high end piece that is worth keeping.
And if their putting it in their signal chain it's because that particular piece of gear has a certain sound that can't be obtained through plug-ins.

Unless you have a piece of gear that just blows your mind then you should probably just use plug-ins.
 
Run the track(s) that you wish to compress from your DAW program to an output(s) on your audio interface,
Take the output(s) to the in(s) on the compressor.
Run the out(s) of the compressor back to the input(s) of your audio interface.
Route that input(s) to a new track and record the compressed signal.

You can use input monitoring on your interface or the Daw to ensure that the compressor is doing what you want and to help you get the setting right on the compressor.

It's actually much easier than it sounds and if you have even a reasonably nice compressor can give you a verry different feel to a plug in.

I just got my hands on an Art Pro VLA 2 and am experimenting with this and even at under 300 bucks the sound is quite different than I get from "Very Good" plugins. I don't know if it's better but it's another option for sure and there is something more satisfying and organic about a real hardware compressor. It also seems easier to work with than a plugin.
 
It isn't just for interfacing great outboard gear.

Sometimes you might want the sound of some cheapass stomp box chorus on a synth even though you have great plug ins or even a great outboard unit available.

It can be a very creative thing to do.

I've recorded tracks by playing a track through speaker through a telephone that was on line with another phone that was being mic'd by a Neumann. I love the contrast of high-end excellent gear and total crap. Contrast is one the coolest things you can squeeze art out of.

If there's anything I avoid like the plague it's doing what everybody else is doing and being normal.

normal = boring :)
 
If you have outboard gear, then learn how to use it. In my dumb opinion, just selling it and buying plug ins doesn't answer your question and ain't the greatest advice you could get though it may one day be an option you'll have to consider.
I'm in a similar situation to you, I'm learning how to use the compressor and I find it confusing at times, but at other times surprizingly straightforward. My main problem is to do with figuring out where to set the threshold. But we live and learn.
 
grimtraveller said:
If you have outboard gear, then learn how to use it. In my dumb opinion, just selling it and buying plug ins doesn't answer your question and ain't the greatest advice you could get though it may one day be an option you'll have to consider.
I'm in a similar situation to you, I'm learning how to use the compressor and I find it confusing at times, but at other times surprizingly straightforward. My main problem is to do with figuring out where to set the threshold. But we live and learn.
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I'm not saying "DON'T USE OUTBOARD COMPRESSORS". I'm saying only use one if you can't beat it's quality and sound with a plug in.
I've seen studio that run every track they record through a tube compressor with an incredibly light compression to smooth off a little bit of transients before it hits the A/D converters.
Just be wise about what outboard gear you use and what you don't and if it's even worth it.
 
All I'm saying is that if you're just getting into recording trying to use mediocre outboard equipment isn't high on the list of things you should be working on.
If you like to tweak and you just want to try it to see what it sounds like,fine knock yourself out,but don't expect it to put your recordings over the top.
As far as Normal=boring,well there's no hard rules when it comes to recording,but there's also a reason certain methods become standard.
 
basically you would send the track in question to one of your outputs on your soundcard, into the dbx, out of the dbx, into a separate input... so if your card is 8 in 8 out, you could play your normal stereo mix on outputs 1-2, and send this track to output 5, and record back on input 6. or something like that.

The best way though would be to get a mixer, mix on that by sending each track to outputs 1-8, into your mixer 1-8, but patch the compressor in, and send the mixer outputs to inputs 1-2 on your soundcard and record the stereo back in.
 
acidrock said:
All I'm saying is that if you're just getting into recording trying to use mediocre outboard equipment isn't high on the list of things you should be working on.
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But why ? If one is just getting into recording, how will they know what is and what isn't mediocre ? If they have a piece of gear at their disposal, whether it's crap or not, does it not make sense to learn how it works ? Eventually, our ears and that sneaking feeling of dissatisfaction tell us if a piece of gear is indeed limiting.


Originally posted by Kingofpain678 ; I'm not saying "DON'T USE OUTBOARD COMPRESSORS". I'm saying only use one if you can't beat it's quality and sound with a plug in.
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I can dig that but if the poster already has a compressor at their disposal and wants to know how to hook it up......
I guess I'm curious as to how this person is meant to know whether their gear is "killer". Isn't much of that a matter of opinion ?
 
grimtraveller said:
I can dig that but if the poster already has a compressor at their disposal and wants to know how to hook it up......
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That's fine but if he/she wants to know how to use a compressor, it doesn't have to be used by running the output of a PC into it and then back into the PC. There are simpler ways to learn how to use a compressor.

I guess I'm curious as to how this person is meant to know whether their gear is "killer". Isn't much of that a matter of opinion ?
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You're right. And so is your opinion, obviously.
 
grimtraveller said:
But why ? If one is just getting into recording, how will they know what is and what isn't mediocre ? If they have a piece of gear at their disposal, whether it's crap or not, does it not make sense to learn how it works ? Eventually, our ears and that sneaking feeling of dissatisfaction tell us if a piece of gear is indeed limiting.
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It's called making things unnecessarily complicated.

I'm just a hobbyist and my recordings are nothiing to brag about,but they are much better than when I started.The one thing I've found out to be true in recording is that the biggest part is tracking and mixing,but for some reason it's always gear this,gear that,complicated method that and unless you just have terrible equipment it's not going to help your recordings as much as pure skill,this is the newbies forum.

If you read my second post I did say to try it,but I also implied it might not be as big of a jump in quality as a lot of people think it will be.Maybe ten years ago,but computers are stronger and plugs are better now and the payoff on outboard gear isn't what it used to be.

In the end the OP will have to figure it out by himself whether he likes it or not,I was just saying the payoff probably isn't worth the hassle.
 
acidrock said:
It's called making things unnecessarily complicated.

I'm just a hobbyist and my recordings are nothiing to brag about,but they are much better than when I started.The one thing I've found out to be true in recording is that the biggest part is tracking and mixing,but for some reason it's always gear this,gear that,complicated method that and unless you just have terrible equipment it's not going to help your recordings as much as pure skill,this is the newbies forum.

If you read my second post I did say to try it,but I also implied it might not be as big of a jump in quality as a lot of people think it will be.Maybe ten years ago,but computers are stronger and plugs are better now and the payoff on outboard gear isn't what it used to be.

In the end the OP will have to figure it out by himself whether he likes it or not,I was just saying the payoff probably isn't worth the hassle.
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+1

You may not agree with us, but one thing we've given the OP is options and choices. and in the end that will give him more experience.
 
Kingofpain678 said:
You may not agree with us, but one thing we've given the OP is options and choices. and in the end that will give him more experience.
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I agree.


Originally posted by acidrock; but for some reason it's always gear this,gear that,complicated method that and unless you just have terrible equipment it's not going to help your recordings as much as pure skill,this is the newbies forum.

If you read my second post I did say to try it,but I also implied it might not be as big of a jump in quality as a lot of people think it will be.
In the end the OP will have to figure it out by himself whether he likes it or not,I was just saying the payoff probably isn't worth the hassle.
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I agree with you there. Skill and practice goes so much further than having this piece of gear or that.

Originally posted by Kingofpain678; You're right. And so is your opinion, obviously.
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Touche !
 
OK, let's get past the side argument for a second, and go back to the actual question. For the record, I agree that current plugins beat most cheap outboard gear, bang for buck. I also agree that even inexpensive outboard gear can produce different sonic results than plugins. I've got perfectly good compression software, and it doesn't stop me from using an RNC.

OK, that aside, I'm curious. Now the Lexicon Lamda has two 1/4" inserts. Is there a way to record the same track dry and a second track compressed simultaneously using the inserts?
I understand you are trying to help this guy, but he asked "How do I do this?" , and an interesting argument ensued about whether he *should* or not. I think if you have a piece of hardware, you should learn to use it, and then decide for yourself whether some other piece of gear (in this case, software) does the job better. In that sense, I think I'm in the camp of the original poster.

Furthermore, I also don't agree that it's *always* better to track dry. If I'm using an aggressive optical compressor for an effect, I may use it up front. If I'm using gentle compression for dynamic control, I'll probably insert it later. I'm *not* turning the compressor on my twinQ off because I can do it later with a plugin. Actually, I can't. Is that because it's a piece of "killer" gear? No. It's because it's an analog optical compressor, which doesn't sound any more like a compression plugin than a Mesa Boogie sounds like a POD.-Richie
 
gibsonsgharp said:
Thanks for the advice, however, I'd like to learn the proper method, just in case.

I suppose I would ask the question that if plug ins are the answer, then why do all these studios have all these racks and racks of gear?
Click to expand...

1 Using an outboard compressor is not inherently the 'proper method'. It is just another way of achieving a result.

2 Studios have racks and racks of gear because they have made a big investment in high-end gear, and there is no need for them to ditch it. It is worth their while making use of it. They are still achieving quality benefits from it.

3 If you want you learn how to connect outboard equipment, that's fine. There are answers above, but in a nutshell: assign a recorded track to one of the interface outputs, from there connect the interface output to the input on the piece of equipment, take the output of that, feed back into a channel on the interface and record that.

4 If you want to learn how to use a compressor and what it does, that's also fine. Messing around with a plug-in is the easiest way.

5 Wanting to use a piece of equipment because you've got it is fine, but it is not always the best option. The equation involves complexity and quality. Unless there is a significant quality gain, there is little point in the complexity of going to an external device.

6 For the most part, the hardware that homerecordists have is matched by the quality of plug-ins available, therefore, for the most part, the significant quality gain is not there.

7 Having said all that, rack-mounted gear has a benefit that plug-ins don't; their physicality. Lots of knobs, flashing leds and dials: they look impressive.
 
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