Martin D-28

  • Thread starter Thread starter Monkey Allen
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Just out of interest, what are they doing to the bridge?

Its kind of hard to explain.

So, when you glue a bridge on to a guitar, you need to have a good wood to wood glue joint. If you don't, you will have problems with bridges pulling off all the time, which sucks. However, it would be extremely difficult to finish a guitar properly with the bridge in place (particularly as you finish the neck and the body separately - well, most of us do, and it makes for a better finish - which means you are not 100% sure EXACTLY where the bridge will end up). So, you finish the guitar, set the neck, and then you measure very carefully for the bridge placement, scribe a line around the bridge, and remove the finish inside the line. There are a lot of ways to do this (we use a little bit of paste stripper to remove most of it, and clean up with some chisels and sandpaper).

All this is fine so far.

Now, because they want to build as many guitars as they can sell as profitably as possible, Martin whatever modern factory equipment they can. Which is fine, you can still do good work that way (as they always have), and these days it means they use a lot of CNC machines. The CNC machine they use to remove the finish where the bridge is going to go basically uses a very fine end mill (a twisty sort of router bit) to remove the finish under the bridge.

Again, that's fine by me, as I know many guys who remove the finish with just a plain old router. You need to be insanely careful with your depth setting, but if you can do it I say, more power to ya!

The problem is, Martin takes of more than just the finish. They take off a bit of top wood, essentially inlaying the bridge a few thousandths of an inch into the top. In the day to day life of the guitar, this doesn't matter one wit. Where it becomes a problem, however, is when that bridge needs to be replace. Maybe it cracks, or it starts to lift or something. Well, anything I want to do to remove that bridge so I can reglue it requires that I get at the glue line - WHICH IS NOW BURIED INSIDE THE TOP OF THE GUITAR!!!!! There are a lot of ways to remove a bridge. The most common one these days is to heat up the bridge, and use a very thin palate knife or spatula to pry off the melting glue. An older and (I think) better method is to take a very sharp chisel, and place the cutting edge of the chisel right at the glue line, and give it a whack. You do this around the perimeter of the bridge until it pops off (the reason I like this method more is it typically takes significantly less wood out of either the top or the bridge - but it takes a lot more skill and practice. You don't want to try this one on your own!) Neither of those will work with this new Martin design, and it is going to be a nightmare to do the amount of touch up which will be required.

Now, I should say that we haven't actually needed to do this yet - we recently asked the guys in Martin's repair department about this, and they said they had not seen any yet either but were also worried about the issue - so it could be I'm seeing goblins in the shadows, but I doubt it. Every repair person I've spoken to about this has the same concerns, and that has me concerned. However, your guitar may never need a bridge reglue, and you may never have to worry about it, so it's up to you if you want to be concerned.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
By the way, it IS a remarkably cleaver bit of machine work - I just wish they would cut a couple thousandths shallower.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
A bandmate and buddy has an HD28V and as lpdeluxe said, it's a freaking CANNON of a guitar. HUGE sound, extremely well balanced, tons of volume and massive low end.

i've found that the trick to recording it is to use omnis instead of cardiods. in the case of the HD28V, proximity effect is NOT your friend. using omnis will allow you to get in closer with less boominess than cardiods would.

i would definitely look for an HD28 over a D28, assuming the budget can swing it. although i'm not overly sold on the V-shaped neck on the HD....every one i've played has been a better sounding guitar than the D28.

btw, light, thanks for the info on martin's new bridge adhesion process. that WOULD make that job a PITA. fwiw, i've always had tremendous respect for someone who has the cojones (let alone skill!!) to remove a bridge using a hammer and chisel. i've seen it done, and that's NOT a gentle tapping you need to do to get it off. at least they're still using hide glue for this......aren't they?

do you know approximately when Martin started doing this and the pocketed frets?


cheers,
wade (who has a D15 that's been sitting in its case for far too long)
 
at least they're still using hide glue for this......aren't they?


Not since like 1958. They make the Authentic series with Hide Glue for most parts, but nothing else. They use Tightbond for most things, which is a perfectly fine glue for the purpose, and though not quite as repairable as hide glue, it's pretty good.

And I would call it more of a firm tap than anything else. You're certainly not going around WHACK! WHACK! WHACK! 6-12 firm taps, and it usually just pops off.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
A bandmate and buddy has an HD28V and as lpdeluxe said, it's a freaking CANNON of a guitar. HUGE sound, extremely well balanced, tons of volume and massive low end.

i've found that the trick to recording it is to use omnis instead of cardiods. in the case of the HD28V, proximity effect is NOT your friend. using omnis will allow you to get in closer with less boominess than cardiods would.

i would definitely look for an HD28 over a D28, assuming the budget can swing it. although i'm not overly sold on the V-shaped neck on the HD....every one i've played has been a better sounding guitar than the D28.

btw, light, thanks for the info on martin's new bridge adhesion process. that WOULD make that job a PITA. fwiw, i've always had tremendous respect for someone who has the cojones (let alone skill!!) to remove a bridge using a hammer and chisel. i've seen it done, and that's NOT a gentle tapping you need to do to get it off. at least they're still using hide glue for this......aren't they?

do you know approximately when Martin started doing this and the pocketed frets?


cheers,
wade (who has a D15 that's been sitting in its case for far too long)

I have a 1998 HD-28 and it doesnt have the V shape neck. I believe they all have the nice thin neck. It is comparable to Gibsons 60's slim taper neck.
VP:cool:
 
For the record, the "V" in HS28V and D45V is for "Vintage" and is in reference to the bracing.
 
For the record, the "V" in HS28V and D45V is for "Vintage" and is in reference to the bracing.
Yep, and the H in HD is for the Herringbone inlay/purfling.

Victory Pete said:
I have a 1998 HD-28 and it doesnt have the V shape neck.

Interesting. My buddy's is more recent, early 2000's, and it does. He got his after i got my D15 (which i bought in 2000). I would definitely like to play one with a neck shape closer to my D15's.

Light said:
And I would call it more of a firm tap than anything else
Well yes, but still--one slip and you've got some 'splaining to do. ;)

and tightbond, eh? that's good to know!


cheers,
wade
 
Well yes, but still--one slip and you've got some 'splaining to do. ;)

and tightbond, eh? that's good to know!


cheers,
wade

You can do just as much damage with one slip of a palette knife as well. I don't knock them off any more as you can never tell what glue has been used for resets repairs or the like. I prefer to go slow to start to find out whats under there.
 
Yep, and the H in HD is for the Herringbone inlay/purfling.

I think the main reason was for the scalloped bracing...since that is the real difference between the modern D28 and the HD28. Then the V model is for the forward shifted scalloped bracing.
 
Hmmm...

It seems that I have changed my tune in considering the D-28 as the guitar I want.

I think I want to go with a small bodied Martin acoustic.

Can anybody suggest a fine small bodied Martin acoustic? Something maybe in the price range of the D-28?

thanks

(I suppose I want to record something with less boom)
 
Hmmm...

It seems that I have changed my tune in considering the D-28 as the guitar I want.

I think I want to go with a small bodied Martin acoustic.

Can anybody suggest a fine small bodied Martin acoustic? Something maybe in the price range of the D-28?

thanks

(I suppose I want to record something with less boom)

OOO28 or an OM28.



Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
As you have read before this post - all Martin D-28s and HD-28 are crafted in the USA.

I favor the HD-28. The H stands for "herringbone" for the famous herringbone inlay in the edge binding and back seam. Somewhere in the 50s Martin started making the D-28 with plain striped Binding to save costs.

Martin is now making those guitars again as the D-28. There is also a Golden Era D-28 that was made in the 80s and 90s.

All D-18s and D-28s have X bracing and rosewood backs and sides but there is also a Vintage Series D-28V that is made to the specs of the 1930s guitars including the vintage style neck taper and joint and tuners.

Confused yet?

It is best to find someplace that has several Martins because they will all sound and play different.

There are also other makes to consider such as Collins and Santa Cruz
 
All D-18s and D-28s have X bracing and rosewood backs and sides but there is also a Vintage Series D-28V that is made to the specs of the 1930s guitars including the vintage style neck taper and joint and tuners.


D18's have mahogany back and sides.

HD-28 have herringbone trim, and are braced slightly differently, though not actually the same as the earliest D-28s. The D-28V is pretty much right, but not quite.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
Sorry to drag this thread up again...but can anyone give me any advice...

If I do buy an expensive guitar like the D-28, I will have to take it back to HK on an 8 hour plane flight. So, anyone got any tips for that?

Sure, I'll secure it well in its case...and try to get some insurance for its trip...but how about air pressure, temperature etc...in what way will it suffer damage? Will it be ok?

thanks
 
Sorry to drag this thread up again...but can anyone give me any advice...

If I do buy an expensive guitar like the D-28, I will have to take it back to HK on an 8 hour plane flight. So, anyone got any tips for that?

Sure, I'll secure it well in its case...and try to get some insurance for its trip...but how about air pressure, temperature etc...in what way will it suffer damage? Will it be ok?

thanks

Loosen the strings (no, it will not hurt your guitar to loosen the strings, I promise), and try to get the guitar on the plane with you. I can't say anything about Asian airlines, but in the US I've always had good luck getting my guitars on as carry-on luggage. Of course, it probably depends on the airline, but I'm pretty much always fly Northwest, and they actually have a policy about letting musicians carry on their instruments (you can find it on their website, if you look). If you can't get it on board, then it is best to package it as though it were being shipped. The store you buy it from can probably help you with that.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 
So I guess the only reason to try to get it on board with me is to ensure it isn't thrown around by baggage handlers or whatever? (not that I imagine they would be callous or they would do anything mallicious).

I'm on a Qantas flight. I'll see what they say
 
So I guess the only reason to try to get it on board with me is to ensure it isn't thrown around by baggage handlers or whatever?

....that and climate control. I don't know what the underbelly of a plane is like, but a tarmac in the summer can be hot.
 
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