Help with vocals

[Roc]

Hello all, i am doing hip hop music and i rap over beats already made for me, so all im doing with my program is vocals. I would just like to know if anyone had any tips on doing the vocals, for example do the double track them by doing two complete different takes or do they just copy and paste. Also could someone please just give me some advice about eq and compression? Like what am i trying to do with each one. I have read about them both but im still not completely sure and i would just like to know if ne one could help me out. Thanks.

 

[doulos24]

rap is the easiest stuff to do by far hears an idea hit record and uh rap there are no presets no go to settings no free lunch and no good rap music

lol the last part is my personal opinion of course

 

[NL5]

Hello all, i am doing hip hop music and i rap over beats already made for me, so all im doing with my program is vocals. I would just like to know if anyone had any tips on doing the vocals, for example do the double track them by doing two complete different takes or do they just copy and paste. Also could someone please just give me some advice about eq and compression? Like what am i trying to do with each one. I have read about them both but im still not completely sure and i would just like to know if ne one could help me out. Thanks.

Your going to have a tougher time trying to get the vocals to sit right over a stereo mix. I'd try and get the multi-track files. As far as eq and compression, I'd recommend not eqing much, if possible, and just slamming the bejeezus out of it with a compressor.

The best way to help you would be to hear what you've got so far, so post up a sample.

 

[deejaytrixx]

Your going to have a tougher time trying to get the vocals to sit right over a stereo mix. I'd try and get the multi-track files. As far as eq and compression, I'd recommend not eqing much, if possible, and just slamming the bejeezus out of it with a compressor.

The best way to help you would be to hear what you've got so far, so post up a sample.

I ditto the ridiculously compressed vocals...Do a lot of double tracks throughout, enforcing puchlines and various phrases..make sure the lyrics have a lot of bite..maybe shelve from 5k up (use your own judgement) And for God sakes make sure you pronunciate your words.

 

[KineticSound]

...and just slamming the bejeezus out of it with a compressor.

Whoa. Back up the train there just a second. This depends entirely on your delivery style, type of mic, etc.

If you're style is very rough or syncopated; very "in your face" a la Busta Rhymes, then yes, you'll want to hit it pretty hard with a compressor. If it's smoother, more constant (think 50 cent) then you might need little, if any compression. Likewise, you might need a lot or a little EQ depending on how you sound in the mic.

Before we get into a dissertation on what compression does and how to apply it, save yourself the time and run a Search for "vocal compression" up top. Once you've done some homework, hit us with some specific questions on where you need help.

Also try posting a rough track or two in the .mp3 mix clinic. That's the best way for us to hear where you're at and make suggestions on changes you might want to consider.

 

[deejaytrixx]

Whoa. Back up the train there just a second. This depends entirely on your delivery style, type of mic, etc.

If you're style is very rough or syncopated; very "in your face" a la Busta Rhymes, then yes, you'll want to hit it pretty hard with a compressor. If it's smoother, more constant (think 50 cent) then you might need little, if any compression. Likewise, you might need a lot or a little EQ depending on how you sound in the mic.

Before we get into a dissertation on what compression does and how to apply it, save yourself the time and run a Search for "vocal compression" up top. Once you've done some homework, hit us with some specific questions on where you need help.

Also try posting a rough track or two in the .mp3 mix clinic. That's the best way for us to hear where you're at and make suggestions on changes you might want to consider.

I dunno..even Fifty sessions have a lot of compression..Its just a little less obvious

 

[NL5]

Whoa. Back up the train there just a second. This depends entirely on your delivery style, type of mic, etc.
If you're style is very rough or syncopated; very "in your face" a la Busta Rhymes, then yes, you'll want to hit it pretty hard with a compressor. If it's smoother, more constant (think 50 cent) then you might need little, if any compression. Likewise, you might need a lot or a little EQ depending on how you sound in the mic.

LOL. Fifty has a TON of compression on his tracks. Are you being serious? Besides, you have it backwards. I'd put more compression on s smoother, more "sung" delivery.

I dunno..even Fifty sessions have a lot of compression..Its just a little less obvious

Yep. I think most people fail to realize what compression sounds like.

 

[KineticSound]

Guys,

I'm dead serious. Let's think about it for a second... our original poster:
1. Is a newbie
2. Is likely in an untreated room
3. Has an unknown mic
4. Has limited knowledge of how a compressor functions

If he slams the signal going in with a compressor, he will achieve:
1. Increased room noise
2. Increased mouth, breath, etc. noises
3. Zero dynamics

What I'm advocating is for him to learn to record his track(s) dry. IF he has a more "aggressive" style and has issues overloading the inputs on occasion, he could use a compressor/limiter to dial back some of that aggression (or he could go to therapy, get a hug, etc.). During the mix, he can bring a compressor in slowly until he gets the desired effect. Just slamming it as hard as you can is not the answer.

 

[deejaytrixx]

Guys,

I'm dead serious. Let's think about it for a second... our original poster:
1. Is a newbie
2. Is likely in an untreated room
3. Has an unknown mic
4. Has limited knowledge of how a compressor functions

If he slams the signal going in with a compressor, he will achieve:
1. Increased room noise
2. Increased mouth, breath, etc. noises
3. Zero dynamics

What I'm advocating is for him to learn to record his track(s) dry. IF he has a more "aggressive" style and has issues overloading the inputs on occasion, he could use a compressor/limiter to dial back some of that aggression (or he could go to therapy, get a hug, etc.). During the mix, he can bring a compressor in slowly until he gets the desired effect. Just slamming it as hard as you can is not the answer.

Yeah definitely a bit of exaggeration we are all using, but you're right..let's not lead the dude astray...I think they are more saying that the hip hop vocal sound we have all come accustomed to hearing is very compressed, but no doubt in an intelligent way (well sometimes anyway)

BUT Kinetic is right, you should of course, learn what to do, and just compressing the shyte outta some vocals won't get you there everytime. Spend some time doing some research on the boards and learn bout EQ, compression and other related topics.

And because I already started sounding like SouthSide and some of the other dudes around here, I might as well go all in and say, if you are an artist, maybe you should let someone who specializes in mixing do that for you and just concentrate on writing your lyrics and mastering your delivery..As you wills see from a quick read through on this board, or any for that matter...quality control at all stages is what makes something great..if you haven't found your "Recording voice and delivery" yet, even if the mix and "mastering job" are good, you'll still sound like ass cheeks cause you didn't track well, or at least found out how to track that best suits your voice.

If you insist on mixing, you got a LOT to do before that. Get a good handle on your room acoustics, get yourself some good monitors and throw away the Ipod headphones. Get yourself a really bright mic with some upper range bite(I won't make any suggestion cause ppl will start a riot at the mention of any piece of equipment lol) and learn your voice. After you have all that down, spend countless hours mixing and comparing it to commerical CDs..and you might sound decent in the end.

Also, those stereo files as another poster said, are not the easiest things to fit your voice into. Picture a million piece puzzle that is already completed, and your an extra piece on the side, trying to be part of the puzzle after its already done...That is essentially what you are trying to do when you take a "completed beat" and try to rap over it.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

And because I already started sounding like SouthSide and some of the other dudes around here

No need to dis yourself like that; it's very un-flattering. You're better than that

G.

 

[deejaytrixx]

No need to dis yourself like that; it's very un-flattering. You're better than that

G.

 

[Roc]

Here is a sample

Here is one of the tracks i did a few months ago but it is the latest track i did cuz i have been busy with school and stuff but i would like 4 yall to give me ne advice. Thanks. its on imeem so i dono if u can hear it if u don't have a account but the account takes like 5 seconds, but just click the link. http://www.imeem.com/dominicanboricua/music/qM0iGvCQ/da_roc_sorry_girl/

 

[NL5]

Guys,

I'm dead serious. Let's think about it for a second... our original poster:
1. Is a newbie
2. Is likely in an untreated room
3. Has an unknown mic
4. Has limited knowledge of how a compressor functions

If he slams the signal going in with a compressor, he will achieve:
1. Increased room noise
2. Increased mouth, breath, etc. noises
3. Zero dynamics

What I'm advocating is for him to learn to record his track(s) dry. IF he has a more "aggressive" style and has issues overloading the inputs on occasion, he could use a compressor/limiter to dial back some of that aggression (or he could go to therapy, get a hug, etc.). During the mix, he can bring a compressor in slowly until he gets the desired effect. Just slamming it as hard as you can is not the answer.

Nowhere did I suggest to compress on the way in. I do on vocals, but I did not suggest that. I wouldn't tell anyone to do that until they had a good grasp on compression. If you ruin the tracks with bad compression on the way in, you're pretty well stuck.

As far as him being a newbie - sure. But if he wants to get a good modern sound, he's going to have to learn compression. It's really not that hard to figure out. Besides, how else is he gonna learn? And, I was just answering the question he asked.

edit - just too add to this - if your clipping the input, you need to turn your gain down. Using compression to control peaks is just plain stupid. (yes, I said stupid). The OP never said anything about clipping or gain control. He wanted to know about processing his tracks after they were recorded. If you want to sound any where near modern, slamming the shit out of the vocal is the answer. Name one album in the top 40 the last ten years w/o the vocal being hit hard by a compressor.

 

[Gabriel_0]

Lol, after reading a lot of these answers I have to chime in on this. To the OP, the BEST compression is knowing how to use your voice and mic. Also get the BEST mic that fits your style that you can afford. Condenser mics are NOT always the best choice. Knowing when to back off and when to punch in the vocal dynamics is a must! Mastering this will lesson your need for compressing the hell out of your vocals. The 1st thing I do with vocal tracks, and I mean the VERY 1st thing is EQ them.

some ideas for EQing....

ADDING freqs, look at adding around 1-2K, 7K

boxy is usually heard in the 200-500 range. In the case you want to add, I start with a wider q filter .... 2.4-1.4, add a good boost, maybe 6 dB

sweep the frequencies between 1-2K slowly to find the growl in the voice

go back and forth until it doesn't stand out against the rest of the voice.

when I find it I start sharpening the filter and readjust the freq

Now I have the growl, I add sparkle with the 7K. depending on the room it was sung in I will either use a bell filter or a low pass

If the room is hot and shiny (hard walls) I low pass above 10K or so. Then I add a boost at 7K

The initial comp is at 12:1. The comp is very transparent and you can add goobs of comp without hearing it ...

Spend a good amount of time listening to the raw track without processing.

Recording and mixing vocals is an art to itself. Takes a lot of time and practice to achieve the desired effect you are seeking.

My vocal chain is usually set as follows
De-Esser, Compression, EQ, Reverb. If I want a nice warm sound I'll add some saturation in there is well.

Another rule of thumb to remember (though all rules are made to be broken...lol), if you can hear the reverb on the vocals then chances are you are using too much, unless of course that is the desired effect you are shooting for