Why Not Elixirs?

[ggunn]

Opinions, opinions. For every plucker who dislikes tortoise shell plectrums there is another plucker just as experienced or qualified (or not) who does.

Every guit is different. So is every player. Don't listen to others. Just pluck the damn strings on your guitar. You will either pluck them or you won't. Why do you care what other pluckers think? Are we plucking your guitar for you? Are you going to decide if you are a plucker based on some consensus here? And, BTW, this plucking question has already been asked and answered way too many times on this board.


Plucking plectrum pushers...I play fingerstyle!

Yeah? Well, pluck you, pal! ;^)

 

[WhiteStrat]

Yeah? Well, pluck you, pal! ;^)

Now you're just picking a fight!

(Sorry--I couldn't resist. )

 

[Jouni]

I had to read the entire thread to make sure no-one hasn't posted this!!!...


I received a bass stringed with Elixirs.
Took it to rehealsals, played for a couple of hours and the coating was hanging allover the bass!..
My guitarist leaned closer and asked "what the h*ll kinda cobweb is that hanging in your strings?"

This was after some 2-3hours of play. (I pick)

What'd cobwebs hanging in yer strings do for Tone??

..digged up a lighter an burned off the hanging coating.

I'm using mainly GHS on bass, since 35" and 36" scale strings are hard to find around here.
Dean Markley "Cold steel" I use on guitars. Lasting, lively.

 

[brich2929]

I've liked the Elixir's that my roomate has on his Ibanez Acoustic. I think they give his axe a much fuller sound. I think for my Washburn I still prefer phosphor bronze, plus I can't afford Elixirs right now---still out of work

I dunno... to me, what makes a string sound bad as it ages is the junk that accumulates on it, and impedes it's vibration. To start out with a coating seems counter-intuitive.

Peace!

~Shawn

 

[DrewPeterson7]

No, "experienced or qualified" people generally do not like them. Most of the respected luthiers and repair guys I know don't like them nor do many of the busier gigging players I meet, a few do. They aren't wildly against them they just know that they do not sound as natural or are as dynamically versatile as other strings. That isn't to say they are bad strings. As you rightly point out. If you like them use them.

That's the only thing I would disagree with you on, that in general experienced or qualified people dislike Elixirs. I'm not saying this hasn't been your experience (because i'm sure we know different experienced and qualified people), but that mine has been quite a bit different.

I think a lot of it is contextual - I'm primarily a seven string player, so most of my discussions on the net have been with seven stringers and a good contingent of the players I know in real life play sevens, as well. A seven string guitar comes with its own set of problems, with regards to low end clarity - you need a fairly bright string with good attack to really reproduce that low B, something that's augmented by the fact that thicker strings tend to be darker and with a more compressed attack at a given pitch than a comparable thinner string.

So, Elixirs are a double win on a seven - first, right out of the box they're (and here I'm talking about Nanowebs - Polywebs are crap, the coating's too thick) a little brighter in fundamental tone than most strings. I know, that sounds crazy, considering all the badmouthing here about the coating, but try a .68 Nanoweb tuned to low B and compare it to a Daddario or GHS of the same guage. I've been told it has something to do with the core... Secondly, not only do they have a good attack when fresh, they also preserve it well. I can deaden a set of Daddario's in about a week of regular play, at which point the low end turns to mush and you lose a lot of low B articulation. Elixiers, I've gone several months - in rare cases, I've had strings still sound tolerable after 6 months plus.

Again, I'm not saying this makes them good for every single playing situation, just as you're not saying they're bad in every single situation either. I'm just tossing this out as an example that whether or not you like Elixirs isn't a factor of how experienced or qualified you are, across the board.

Personally, I love Elixir phospher bronze nanowebs on my Martin. I also haven't had nearly the breakage problem some of you have been talking about - I've had maybe one or two early breaks over the last four or so years I've been using Elixirs almost exclusively.

 

[muttley600]

That's the only thing I would disagree with you on, that in general experienced or qualified people dislike Elixirs. I'm not saying this hasn't been your experience (because i'm sure we know different experienced and qualified people), but that mine has been quite a bit different.

I think a lot of it is contextual - I'm primarily a seven string player, so most of my discussions on the net have been with seven stringers and a good contingent of the players I know in real life play sevens, as well. A seven string guitar comes with its own set of problems, with regards to low end clarity - you need a fairly bright string with good attack to really reproduce that low B, something that's augmented by the fact that thicker strings tend to be darker and with a more compressed attack at a given pitch than a comparable thinner string.

So, Elixirs are a double win on a seven - first, right out of the box they're (and here I'm talking about Nanowebs - Polywebs are crap, the coating's too thick) a little brighter in fundamental tone than most strings. I know, that sounds crazy, considering all the badmouthing here about the coating, but try a .68 Nanoweb tuned to low B and compare it to a Daddario or GHS of the same guage. I've been told it has something to do with the core... Secondly, not only do they have a good attack when fresh, they also preserve it well. I can deaden a set of Daddario's in about a week of regular play, at which point the low end turns to mush and you lose a lot of low B articulation. Elixiers, I've gone several months - in rare cases, I've had strings still sound tolerable after 6 months plus.

Again, I'm not saying this makes them good for every single playing situation, just as you're not saying they're bad in every single situation either. I'm just tossing this out as an example that whether or not you like Elixirs isn't a factor of how experienced or qualified you are, across the board.

Personally, I love Elixir phospher bronze nanowebs on my Martin. I also haven't had nearly the breakage problem some of you have been talking about - I've had maybe one or two early breaks over the last four or so years I've been using Elixirs almost exclusively.

I play and have built seven string boxes. I wouldn't put a coated string anywhere near them. Thats my choice, I don't like the sound of any of them and it is harder if not impossible to get the full dynamic range of the instrument out with coated strings. This is a guess but of the hundred or so makers I know that build guitars I'd say maybe one or two would agree with you. Many would give you a wry smile and just nod. Of the dozen or so players that have had seven stringers off my bench none use coated strings. There is a difference in the types and gauges they use, but no coated strings.

You do lose dynamic potential with a coated string. As soon as you put a flexible polymer coating on a string it acts as an impedance to the free vibration of the stiffer core and windings. The real question is whether or not you like the effect that it has. You obviously do Thats fine, I have no problem with that.

Like I've been saying all along. You pays your money, you takes your choice.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

I play and have built seven string boxes. I wouldn't put a coated string anywhere near them. Thats my choice, I don't like the sound of any of them and it is harder if not impossible to get the full dynamic range of the instrument out with coated strings. This is a guess but of the hundred or so makers I know that build guitars I'd say maybe one or two would agree with you. Many would give you a wry smile and just nod. Of the dozen or so players that have had seven stringers off my bench none use coated strings. There is a difference in the types and gauges they use, but no coated strings.

You do lose dynamic potential with a coated string. As soon as you put a flexible polymer coating on a string it acts as an impedance to the free vibration of the stiffer core and windings. The real question is whether or not you like the effect that it has. You obviously do Thats fine, I have no problem with that.

Like I've been saying all along. You pays your money, you takes your choice.

Again, I think a lot of it is contextual - as you seem to bill yourself as the "grumpy old guy" around here, I have a feeling you and I play with radically different gain structures, even considering that I play with relatively little gain for the proggy shred-blues sort of thing I'm into. At a lower gain threshold, yeah, it might make a difference to me and I might reconsider. But any possible dynamic potential you may be losing on a Nanoweb is such that in even Rectoverb-on-5 gain levels I don't really feel like swapping to a different brand would positively impact my tone.

That said, from the seven string players who I've spoken with who gig at least semi regularly and aren't complete morons (and to be clear since this is the net and it's notoriously tough to catch tone, I'm definitely not throwing you in this second group), I'd say Elixir's market share is running at a not-too-insignifcant 30% or so. They're popular strings amongst the metal crowd, say what you want about the metal crowd's fondness for dynamic replication.

Anyway, cheers for your taste in guitars, always happy to run into another seven stringer.

 

[muttley600]

Again, I think a lot of it is contextual - as you seem to bill yourself as the "grumpy old guy" around here, I have a feeling you and I play with radically different gain structures, even considering that I play with relatively little gain for the proggy shred-blues sort of thing I'm into. At a lower gain threshold, yeah, it might make a difference to me and I might reconsider. But any possible dynamic potential you may be losing on a Nanoweb is such that in even Rectoverb-on-5 gain levels I don't really feel like swapping to a different brand would positively impact my tone.

That said, from the seven string players who I've spoken with who gig at least semi regularly and aren't complete morons (and to be clear since this is the net and it's notoriously tough to catch tone, I'm definitely not throwing you in this second group), I'd say Elixir's market share is running at a not-too-insignifcant 30% or so. They're popular strings amongst the metal crowd, say what you want about the metal crowd's fondness for dynamic replication.

Anyway, cheers for your taste in guitars, always happy to run into another seven stringer.

The seven string guys I deal with are archtop jazz players. As with all things electric and high gain I think there is a good deal of diminishing returns with these things. As we were talking primarily about acoustic instruments I was focusing in on them. Thats where the dynamic detail becomes very important. For me it has to do with the way some players can simply "pull" sound out of an instrument and a range of dynamics as well. For me coated strings just don't cut it in that regard.

A few years back when these things were first put out they were getting passed round the trade for us all to try out and give comments on. Believe me the luthier trade and shops all tried them out and we are very good at becoming anal about the minutia of these things. Shops love them they make more money per set. Luthiers don't because they don't show the guitar off to it's full potential.

Once again use whatever strings sound good to you.

 

[DrewPeterson7]

A few years back when these things were first put out they were getting passed round the trade for us all to try out and give comments on. Believe me the luthier trade and shops all tried them out and we are very good at becoming anal about the minutia of these things. Shops love them they make more money per set. Luthiers don't because they don't show the guitar off to it's full potential.

Well, to be fair, if this was when they first came out those were probably the Polywebs you were playing. The Nanowebs are worlds better.

I think there's a lot to be said in terms of consistancy of sound, as I think it was you who made the point earlier - if you've got a wall full of acoustics and they're strung up with Elixirs, not only is that an even comparison point, but if someone comes in and spends an hour demoing a guitar and then doesn't buy it you don't have to immediately swap the striings for it to sound its' best.

I'll be perfectly honest - I play Elixirs on my acoustic not because I think they sound better than anything else out there, but because I'm mostly an electric player and can't be arsed to change the strings on my acoustic more than once every couple months.

 

[muttley600]

Well, to be fair, if this was when they first came out those were probably the Polywebs you were playing. The Nanowebs are worlds better.

Oh that must be it then. How on earth did these new wonder strings pass me by? Me using hundreds of sets every year and all...

Once again use what strings you like.

 

[MK-Ultra]

Hmmm.

I've tried to hate Elixirs, but don't manage to. My Taylor 310 had Polywebs on it when I bought it, and the sound of that guitar with those strings is probably the main reason I bought it in the first place. I've tried normal PB strings on it, and I love their sound - for about 3 days, and then they start to go quite dull on me. Must be my body chemistry or something.

When I bought my Martin D-15 last November, it had on regular Martin 80/20 lights, and they were pretty well DOA. Given the nature of the whole hog git, I put on a better set of PBs - and they, too, were dead within a week. I then went back to the Elixir PB nanos, and the guitar came back to life - and stayed that way for a good two months of playing 2-4 hours a day.

My Lakewood M-18 also came with Elixir PB nanos, and this gitbox has amazing tone, though I have yet to try real strings on it.

Now, after my guitar buying binge of the last year, money is a bit scarce, so instead of buying some Elixirs last week, I bought some D'addario EXP PBs. They are about €5.00 cheaper per set, and I bought two sets. I put one on my D-15. Absolutely, fricking horrible. Dead sounding, squeaky, strange feel, had to fight going up the neck a bit, and did I say sounded horrible? I am left with one set, and I intend to see if Thomann will take it back, as it is unopened, and I doubt I'll ever want to use it.

I've just restrung my Martin and Lakewood with Elixirs, and both guitars and I are back in our happy place!

Just my 2 Pfennigs....

MK

 

[eeb]

No, "experienced or qualified" people generally do not like them. Most of the respected luthiers and repair guys I know don't like them nor do many of the busier gigging players I meet, a few do. They aren't wildly against them they just know that they do not sound as natural or are as dynamically versatile as other strings. That isn't to say they are bad strings. As you rightly point out. If you like them use them.

Shops sell them with a high markup and some put them on display models because they homogenize the sound and last longer, supposedly.

I can't see anything wrong with the question, several people have posted opinions or qualified experiences of them. Its up to everyone to draw their own conclusions on this based on whatever works for them. I guess thats what you were saying in any case, just like others had suggested.

I guess I'll never be respected for saying this but i will never buy another kind of string. Stringing up my telecaster with my elixir string and my orange amp create my ultimate tone.. I found the sound I love and i'm not about to change it... basically i'm backing up the ones saying that listen to your guitar.. If you're absolutely happy with the tone of the elixirs then keep with them.. if not keep experimenting until you find that tone

 

[DrewPeterson7]

I guess I'll never be respected for saying this but i will never buy another kind of string. Stringing up my telecaster with my elixir string and my orange amp create my ultimate tone.. I found the sound I love and i'm not about to change it... basically i'm backing up the ones saying that listen to your guitar.. If you're absolutely happy with the tone of the elixirs then keep with them.. if not keep experimenting until you find that tone

To be fair, Muttley seems to be more against acoustic Elixirs than electric.

I was kind of thinking a couple weekends back after my last post above, as I was swapping out the on-its-last-legs Ibanez Edge LoPro 7 for a nice shiny new Original Floyd Rose 7 on my basswood-bodied Ibanez Universe UV7PWH, with my Rectifier waiting for me upstairs, that bigger picture if anyone wants to talk about problem areas in the dynamic responsiveness in my rig, the strings I use are pretty far down on that list.

 

[muttley600]

To be fair, Muttley seems to be more against acoustic Elixirs than electric.

Not getting at you DrewP, I promise but lets clear this up once and for all. Here are some statements I've made throughout this thread. I don't think I've mentioned electric or acoustic but I am primarily talking about acoustic set because that was the OP's topic.

If you like them and they give you the sound you want use them. There is absolutely nothing that will hurt your guitar or fingers with them.

I don't like them for one reason. To my ears which are fairly acute when it comes to these things they inhibit a lot of the dynamic possibilities of your attack when playing.

I have always use D'addario EJ series. These things are personal choice.

............That isn't to say they are bad strings. As you rightly point out. If you like them use them.

...................Its up to everyone to draw their own conclusions on this based on whatever works for them. I guess thats what you were saying in any case, just like others had suggested.

In this this case we've both stated that it's our opinion on them and YMMV. Thats fine, but we do seem to be of the same opinion.

One thing for certain you'll not mess your guitar up by changing between brands of strings so if you find you like something else go with it.

All I did in the first place was point out that most people with a qualified opinion about these damn strings don't like them. If any of you lot do thats fine as I've said every time I've posted in this thread.

...........

In the meantime, USE WHATEVER BLOODY STRINGS YOU LIKE.

Lets move on shall we. We've done this to death. Now what about plectrums? Anyone got a winner for that one?

The real question is whether or not you like the effect that it has. You obviously do Thats fine, I have no problem with that.

Like I've been saying all along. You pays your money, you takes your choice.

Once again use whatever strings sound good to you.

and again next post

Once again use what strings you like.

I think from these comments it's fairly obvious what my general thoughts are on the subject. I'[m really not getting all snobby about it. Use whatever strings you like. I have stated an opinion and given reasons why I hold that opinion. It's all in there.

I feel like a misquoted politician now..

Oh and did I mention.

Use whatever strings suit you best.

 

[WhiteStrat]

I'm not sure that was clear...are you saying I should use whatever strings I like???

 

[muttley600]

I'm not sure that was clear...are you saying I should use whatever strings I like???

I'd just stick with Elixer's if I was you. It would be easier all round.

 

[WhiteStrat]

I'd just stick with Elixer's if I was you. It would be easier all round.

Too late...

 

[phonzadellika]

I like Elixirs, except that they are kind of fragile. I have a Martin that I play very hard...the Elixirs sound very good to me when you get them going...

 

[Big Kenny]

I'd just stick with Elixer's if I was you. It would be easier all round.

good one, Muttley what electrics do you use?

 

[muttley600]

good one, Muttley what electrics do you use?

Strings? I'm more flexible with electric. I use ribbons on my archtops, and am not as fussy about solid bodies. Most still get D'addario though but again just a preference not anything to do with best. I don't use coated on them either.

I do honestly think D'addario are the best acoustic phospher's but on electric it's harder to make a judgment because the pickup, amp, volume, etc all have an influence on how much your ever going to notice any subtle nuance. Acoustic and it does count, at least to me..

I trust D'addario from an intonation point of view so I use them on my solid bodies.