How do I adjust two mics on Acoustic Guitar

J

joe1871

New member
Hi,

I have two mics, an AKG 414 and a Neumann KM 183 that I run through two different channel strips, then into my DAW. What logic do you recommend for how to set EQ and compression, etc on these strips for each mic, and what pattern would you select on the mics?

I am brand new to recording. If there is any other advice you could provide I would really appreciate it. PlugIns, techniques etc. I am recording acoustic solo fingerstyle guitar principally.

TIA

Joe
 
Tell us about your guitar and the room you're recording in. And are you a proficient player and have you ever been recorded before?
 
joe1871 said:
Hi,

I have two mics, an AKG 414 and a Neumann KM 183 that I run through two different channel strips, then into my DAW. What logic do you recommend for how to set EQ and compression, etc on these strips for each mic, and what pattern would you select on the mics?

I am brand new to recording. If there is any other advice you could provide I would really appreciate it. PlugIns, techniques etc. I am recording acoustic solo fingerstyle guitar principally.

TIA

Joe
Click to expand...
Being new to it I'd say google some on acoustic guitar mic placements and such, and try the two in XY (yes I know they're not matched', it won't mater that much initially).
Skip all the eq/compressing at first and start with getting basic clean tones and a feel for the sounds with varying positions and distance.
Expand from there.
 
One aimed almost directly at the sound hole and one at about the 12th fret, aimed slightly in toward the soundhole.
 
joe1871 said:
Hi,

I have two mics, an AKG 414 and a Neumann KM 183 that I run through two different channel strips, then into my DAW. What logic do you recommend for how to set EQ and compression, etc on these strips for each mic, and what pattern would you select on the mics?
Click to expand...

As armistice says, it all depends on the guitar, the room, and the player.

To add my two pence;

if you're brand new to this, like mixsit said, i'd try and avoid EQ and compression to start with and just practice getting the best possible sound you can from the mics themselves. Also, once you get into EQ'ing and compression, it's often best left until the mixing stage, i.e not on the channel strips on the way in. that way you have more control over the sound rather than trying to work with an already processed sound.

I'd also suggest that if you're new to recording acoustic guitar that you start with just using one mic and seeing how you get on. experiment with both mic's and with various polar patterns and see what sounds you can achieve. As a starting point you may want to try one mic pointing at where the neck joins the body (around the 12th to 14th fret depending on the guitar) at about 1 foot back and move from their to see what sounds you can get.

i found this to be quite a useful article;

Sound on Sound; Recording Acoustic Guitar
 
Armistice said:
Tell us about your guitar and the room you're recording in. And are you a proficient player and have you ever been recorded before?
Click to expand...


Thank you all. I will checkout thatSound on Sound article right away.

Hi Armistice

I have a variety of guitars, principally I use two Collings, a rosewood OM2E and a Custom Jumbo Koa/Adi. I also have a nice Martin HD-28. I would classify myself as a reasonably accomplished player. I have played in several bands, almost exclusively electric. I have enough command of the instrument to play charts and figure out songs by ear pretty quickly. I also play keyboard.

My room at home is a dedicated studio room. It is about 15' wide x 25 ' long and carpeted with a thick Berber carpet. It has a rough non-reflective ceiling, and wall surfaces are very broken up with hanging instruments, large book cases etc. I think it's a pretty dead room.

I have cut demos with prior bands in pro studios, so I guess that qualifies as having been recorded. Never acoustic solo however, at least not professionally.

I do very much like the idea of recording dry and then applying processing after the fact, with the possible exception of compression. I am just wondering if using compression on my takes will allow me to capture more of the guitar's richness and high end sparkle. Collings guitars are very nice instruments and sound amazing live.

Thanks folks. I hope to have something you can critique soon.

Joe
 
singer202 said:
One aimed almost directly at the sound hole and one at about the 12th fret, aimed slightly in toward the soundhole.
Click to expand...

Actually - as a general rule of thumb, try to avoid aiming directly at the sound hole. You will find that it does sound louder but it tends to sound boomy and resonant. You're usually better off micing the body of the guitar, or from the neck.
With a 414 and a 183 then you're in the great position that you can try both at once.
Best advice I can offer is to put both mics up, and record 30 seconds or so. Then move both mics and record/listen again and again. Even if you think it sounds great first time - still move them both and learn how your guitar sounds in different places, and how the mics react. Switch patterns too, omni and cardioid are probably the most useful. If you go for an omni, chances are you'll get a nice low end from it but you will pick up more room ambient noise.

To be honest, it's a bit of a guessing game even for the pros - they've just got enough experience to make educated guesses.

This article on recording acoustic guitar might help give you some ideas, or this one on advanced guitar recording techniques if you want to try something a little different.

Enjoy experimenting!
 
OK, as others have said, if you're new just use 1 mic for a while. In fact, most of my acoustic parts are still one mic. I only really use a stereo set up when I'm doing solo acoustic stuff or just want to fill in a lot of space.

Avoid EQ for a bit, and compression. You can play with them, but don't count on them to fix anything or improve the sound. Learning the tools is almost like learning to play an instrument...you'll suck for a long time, then you'll gradually get better.

ok, if you're dead set on two mics (which is cool and fun to experiment with), I like to have someone else play while I move mics. I set up the one at the 12th fret to sound really nice. Then I get the second mic near the butt sounding good on it's own. Then I put on head phones and put both mics up the middle (no panning). Then I'll move the but mic until I don't hear any canceling. Finally I'll spread the two mics wide to see how it sounds. If I hear too much highs I'll usually adjust the 12th fret mic, if too much boom the butt.

make sense?
 
Use the 414. Super acoustic mic in my opinion. Move it around until you get the sound u like, no position is wrong. Beware of comb filtering when u use two mics.
 
All good advice except the sound hole thing.
Experimentation with mic position is key and i would avoid processing too. You can do that later in the box.
Get as near to the sound that you want for a start and work from there.
Maybe consider some room treatment too.
 
5 Stereo Miking Techniques.

Here's a good starting point for you.These are some reference notes I use on a regular basis.You should get what you are looking for by following one of these techniques.See attachments.ShureStereoMikingTechniquesChart[1].jpgspacedpair[1].gifx-y[1].gifortf[1].gifmidside[1].gifblumleinpair[1].gif
 
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There is a mic theory that says to mic an instrument one instrument body-length distance away. This averages and blends the variations in sound you would get from close micing at the soundhole, or the bridge, or the 12th fret position etc.

A suggestion I remember Harvey Gherst making on this forum is the over the shoulder technique for acoustic guitar recordings. Position the stand behind the player and the mic above and pointing straight down over his right shoulder.

To reduce standing waves from small boxy rooms, try positioning the player with the guitar soundhole pointing into a corner of the room.

and finally a specific two-mic technique is to have one mic close in whatever "sweetspot" position sounds best through the phones, with the second mic more distant for the room sound. Blend the two to taste.
 
Commémorer cet

C?est fait de la mondialisation  fille fille ma fille on de peng. Dans le profil de l'utilisateur meilleur qu'on puisse ramener heures la compagnie reçoit repris deux fois.
 
Here is a link to a great video series on recording the acoustic guitar.It is a 5 part series but I have included just part 3 which covers your situation with using the 2 very good mics you have mentioned in your original post.It also covers the important 3:1 rule for spacing mics to avoid phase cancellation and other soundwave issues.Proximity effect should also be taken into consideration when placing mics for a specific bass response.You can access the whole series at the same link below.

- Acoustic Guitar Part 3 : Recording Magazine -
 
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The techiniques RollTape showed pictures for are great...pretty much the standards. But one thing I would caution is that just because your mics match the pictures doesn't mean they'll sound good. You will have to move them around to get the right balance of sound and keep the cancelation to a minimum.
 
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