Multiple Monitors...

[Atom Bomb]

Justa general question?

I had been in studios and have seen pictures of instances where there can be 4 or more monitors at the mixing helm?

What benefit is there from having a set up like this?

 

[miroslav]

1. Some people like to A/B/C/D their mix constantly across many systems.

2. Sometimes a commercial studio has multiple systems to accommodate the different tastes of visiting engineers...though these days, freelance engineers often bring their own.

I have a second set on my meterbridge...though they are mostly there as a backup, I never have them on when I'm actually mixing. I also have a large 3-way Hi-Fi set in my studio...but they also are never used during actual mixing...they're mostly for listening after the fact and entertainment...not for making mixing decisions.

 

[Atom Bomb]

1. Some people like to A/B/C/D their mix constantly across many systems.

2. Sometimes a commercial studio has multiple systems to accommodate the different tastes of visiting engineers...though these days, freelance engineers often bring their own.

I have a second set on my meterbridge...though they are mostly there as a backup, I never have them on when I'm actually mixing. I also have a large 3-way Hi-Fi set in my studio...but they also are never used during actual mixing...they're mostly for listening after the fact and entertainment...not for making mixing decisions.

By A/B/C/D d oyou mean like they will 'shuffle' for lack of better terms through the various set ups for consitency or something?


So they would never use more then a left/right at once?

At first thought i was thinking (as i am reasearching monitors at the moment) that by having multiple set-ups with different monitors, one set may compensate for something where another may lack? If that makes sense...

Which i guess would kind of make sense to do in practice, but do to to sound reflections and shit like that, it would make getting the set up just right pretty dam hard?

I dunno.

I guess its up to personal preference?

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

It can be any of the following reasons (or any combination of them):

- One set of speakers can be used for their accuracy and extended response to help examine the sound in detail, where another may be intentionally "poorer-sounding" as a check to see how the mix will sound on more average- or poorer-sounding playback systems such as car stereos, office/store PA systems, etc.

- One or more house engineers may have a preference for a certain speaker model or response type whereas other may have a different preference.

- Sometimes a pairing of loudspeakers can provide a fuller frequency response than just one speaker model alone; e.g. one may have better high-end response whereas the other may be tighter in the bass frequencies. By either switching between them or sometimes using them in combination, the engineer can get the best of both worlds.

- Often times you'll find studio control rooms include a second set of monitors mainly to have them as part of their advertised equipment list to attract customers. Sometimes it's to attract visiting engineers who want a "reference" speaker model that they know and recognize instead of having to learn a whole new set of monitors at every studio they go to (e.g. Yamaha NS10). Sometimes its simply to look impressive to the client ("this can't be a good studio unless they have at least one Neumann U87 microphone in their mic locker and a pair of NS10s sitting on top of the mixer" ). Whether they use them is irrelevant, as long as it brings in the clients to have them.

G.

 

[miroslav]

By A/B/C/D d oyou mean like they will 'shuffle' for lack of better terms through the various set ups for consitency or something?


So they would never use more then a left/right at once?

Right.

Each set has its "sound"...so they flip between them in order to check how the mix behaves on different sounding speakers.

There's some benefit to that...though it's very easy to get caught up "chasing the mix".
You set it perfectly on one pair...flip to another, and decide to tweak again...then flip to a third pair and tweak yet again...finally coming back to the original pair, only to find the mix now sounds badly on them...etc...etc..etc....which is why some folks only use one pair (most accurate pair they have) for all the mixing decisions...though there's nothing wrong with *checking* on other systems or even in your car.

 

[dintymoore]

I made a speaker selector switch and use the folowing monitors:

Yamaha NS-10m - my main monitors
Acoustic Research AR-7 - cool 70's home stereo speakers that sound "stoned". I love those things for listening to music, not so good for any judgements but they're up high and easy on the ears
Auratones - classic 70's speakers that suck but don't (?)
KLH homemade boxes - real trebly, kinda a joke
Homemade 4" mono speaker - I made this around 1967 and have used it since, sounds great for television.

I normally only listen to my Yamahas. I really like having more that one pair of speakers though. I spend most of my life at my console. I watch tv while I play keys and the ability to put the speakers up high, over my head is really good sometimes. If I'm editing a hihat part for an hour I can do it on a pair of speakers that are above my head and not in my face and that really wears you out less.

I have been meaning to make an article on my speaker selector box, I call it the Bride of Frankenstein. It's modeled off of a Proco and doesn't let you use more than one pair at once thus maintaining a 8Ω load. What it's set up for is A/B'ing pairs. It A/B's everything against my Yamaha's with a switch (actually 2) and is one of the best things I've ever made. I can confidently say that it is far superior to any of the garbage they sell in stores, which isn't saying a hell of a lot 'cause the ones I've seen from companies like Niles are about 1 mm away from blowing your output transistors by shorting.

 

[Atom Bomb]

So i guess then, in my situation of basically recording my solo stuff and friends bands here and I'd be just as far ahead to invest in one good pair of monitors rather then a myriad of different ones...

 

[dintymoore]

So i guess then, in my situation of basically recording my solo stuff and friends bands here and I'd be just as far ahead to invest in one good pair of monitors rather then a myriad of different ones...

I would want a speaker selector switch like I made plus a few different pairs of speakers. Your "serious" monitors will cost some money, but the extra pairs of speakers should be free or almost free.

There will be times when you are editing some stupid shit like the intros of songs - chopping off the front, and it's nice to get the sound out of your face when you do that for an hour. It depends on how much time you spend at your console. I pretty much live at mine. In the 90's my best friend died at the console.

 

[Atom Bomb]

Dude that makes total fucking sense.??????????

+1 million.

So i could in theory have my awesome monitors for ... montioring, then have some book shelf speakers set up on my other sound card and have a set of semi-lame computer speakers ready to plug into the headphone jack of my laptop ..for argument sake...


just to give it a few once overs on other stuff??

genious...

truly.


I kind of lol at myself, cause i'll mix on my set-up now and then make an 320 Mp3 jam it on BlakcBerr y and go for a drive and give it another listen.


I could potentially start saving gas if i just get some speakers.

 

[XLR]

I have one set of speakers that make everything sound smooth and balanced. Nothing ever sounds harsh. I use those on days when I want to feel good regardless of how the audio I'm working on actually sounds. I also use those to play back recordings of my guitar students so they can hear themselves in lessons. They're motivational speakers, haha.

I also have a set of speakers that are more clinical, very detailed, where anything sticks out that isn't just right. For serious work.

 

[bouldersoundguy]

Justa general question?

I had been in studios and have seen pictures of instances where there can be 4 or more monitors at the mixing helm?

What benefit is there from having a set up like this?

You've already gotten good responses but here's another one. Imagine a time before CDRs. If someone wanted to take a mix home to play on different systems the only option would have been a cassette which would color the sound. So you'd have an unreliable reference point by which to judge the mix. Now go even further back and you'd be stuck with an acetate, a crude and fragile record that you could play a few times before the sound degraded beyond use. So, instead, you have a bunch of speakers in the control room for multiple points of reference and therefore perspective.

Now we have CDRs and DAWs. We can burn a disc, listen at home, in the car, at a friend's house, and then come back into the studio, open the DAW and pick up right where we left off. Multiple monitors are still useful, but not as critical as they once were.

 

[XLR]

When I'm finishing something up I usually check the sound on my home stereo system that goes to some decent speakers in 3 different rooms. Same speakers in each, but each room sounds totally different. I just carry the laptop over and connect, then walk around. I also have a line in with my car's system. I usually check things on iPod earbuds and desktop computer speakers too. Pretty sure those last three are the types of systems that most music is listened to by the average person, so good to check.

 

[SouthSIDE Glen]

This is really one of those personal preference things, there is no definitive right or wrong that covers everybody, but for me I'd much rather have one set of speakers I can translate with and listen to without fatigue than multiple sets of speakers that don't really suit me as well as the quality ones.

At my home mixing/editing desk, I originally set it up with two pairs of speakers, a pair of HR824s on the overbridge wings, and a pair of Klipsch kg0.5 home bookshelves mounted on custom wall brackets that I wanted to use as my translation check. Frankly, it didn't take very long (maybe a few months) before I realized that after the translation check on the Klipsches that I was making very few changes to the mix, and has learned how to make those small changes (in the midrange usually) by hearing the difference on the 824s, and since then the Klipsches have mostly just been hanging on the wall collecting dust. Every once in a while - maybe twice a year - I'll crank them up just to double-check to make sure my ears haven't changed tuning, but other than that, they just look neat hanging off the wall above my desk now.

In the new garage studio we have two pairs of speakers; a pair of JBL4411s powered by twin BGW amps, topped by a pair of Event 20/20p self-powered nearfields, that we run simultaneously. Yes, we can choose one or the other, but the combination of the two - when properly volume-matched - provides us with a very good-sounding and translatable result that is better then either one individually.

G.

 

[miroslav]

I could potentially start saving gas if i just get some speakers.

Keep in mind that a pair of car speakers mounted at your console are not going to sound the same as when they are in your car...so you may want to go for a ride anyway.

I've tried using my smaller (B) studio monitors for stuff like editing chores and non-critical pre-mix work...thing is, it's rather distracting because it just *doesn't sound the same* as it does on my main (A) studio monitors. So once I'm use to how stuff sounds, especially after I'm editing/working for awhile...switching to some other monitoring source is not very helpful....I actually find it counterproductive since I have to readjust my hearing and tell myself it's fine even though it sounds different.

The best thing you can do for ear fatigue is to monitor at lower/safe levels and simply get up and walk away from it every so often so your ears take a break. I find that switching playback systems only confuses and fatigues the ears even more....but YMMV.

 

[XLR]

Sometimes it can even be helpful to stand just outside the door of the mixing room and listen from there when comparing mix options. ...Are the low mids of the rhythm guitars getting in the way of the bass? Or is it the other way around? Stuff like that. Gives a different perspective for a moment, especially when your ears are fatigued.

Don't remember who I heard about that trick from... somebody over at rec.audio.pro.

 

[Atom Bomb]

Sometimes it can even be helpful to stand just outside the door of the mixing room.

Weird. I have heard of this and do it from time to time.


All awesome stuff in here. Thanks a million fellahs.

 

[Yonce N Mild]

Sometimes it can even be helpful to stand just outside the door of the mixing room and listen from there when comparing mix options. ...Are the low mids of the rhythm guitars getting in the way of the bass? Or is it the other way around? Stuff like that. Gives a different perspective for a moment, especially when your ears are fatigued.

Don't remember who I heard about that trick from... somebody over at rec.audio.pro.

I do that for writing. Burn a CD of the riff or whatever I'm working with, put it on repeat and go do something in the other room while I hum along. Great way to come up with melodies or lyrics. I don't know why it works but it's a great writers block buster for me.