The New Tone Thread

[Tadpui]

we were talking about slide a bit back and now miner has used some reverse delay which I'm currently finding very interesting in how it can give you the 'atmospheric' feeling of echo without actually sounding like echos.

Here's a couple of sections of something I'm working on where I'll be using slide as part of the bed ..... there will be vocals and/or orchestral stuff going on over this.
The slide is probably a bit hotter than it will be in the mix because I just did it and am dialing in the reverse delay so I want to hear it well.

Of course ..... once everything's there, who knows?
For that matter who knows if I'll ever even fool with it again? It's a strange world ..........

also .... not any kind of music that you will like ..... just showing you the emo-slide

Nice slide tone there Bob. Every time I try to play slide, I mainly just get the sound of the strings rattling against the slide. Yours sounds clean and "pure". What guitar/amp are you using here? Sounds like a single coil pickup, but not as thin as a Tele. Nice smooth tone.

 

[Tadpui]

I bought a clownburst LP copy a couple of weeks ago that is one fine guitar...with the exception of the pickups. They sucked.

I ordered a set of tonerider alcino 4 humbuckers. I'm used to the duncan 1959's on my Les Paul Studio. I played it for years so its really all I have to compare them to. That being said I LOVE these pups. I recorded these tracks with a Shure SM 57 close to the speaker. Playing through a fender mustang modeling amp. Its turned up kind of loud. These pickups are not real hot. I think 7.6 on the neck and 8.9 on the bridge. Im not crazy about the real hot pickups for my playing style though

Please excuse my sloppy playing....I'm getting kind of rusty from not playing much.

This is the clean sound
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4koycre89oyeev6/clean toneriders.wav?dl=0

A little ac/dc/style gain
https://www.dropbox.com/s/vjlh1zrrqvtfryx/more gain toneriders.wav?dl=0

Allman brothers style clean lead
https://www.dropbox.com/s/pfs0jf0c7lhm30j/clean lead tonerider.wav?dl=0

Higher gain rock lead
https://www.dropbox.com/s/8vcme5whlc56upu/higher gain lead.wav?dl=0

Blues tone
https://www.dropbox.com/s/31w0lideddhnv4a/blues lead lead tonerider-01.wav?dl=0

Some good sounding pickups there. I think that the amp isn't doing them justice, especially on that first clean clip. But the others sound pretty good to me. The pickups have some bite to them when you really dig in, I always love that.

 

[JDOD]

I covered how to do that in the video I posted in your EZD thread a couple of weeks ago, in case you're interested.

Excellent.cheers tad. I've subscribed so I expect you'll be giving me regular videos of just what I need at the right time.

Tad, that's an excellent tutorial - I had no idea that you could stick a load of tracks inside a folder to give them their own master in Reaper.

What I don't get is how you got the option to build the multi-track output. I didn't get this and I just have the normal stereo output from EZDrummer in Reaper. Is there a way you can add this afterwards?

I suppose worse case I could start a whole new project and build the multi-track then copy the midi from my current project into the new project along with all my tracks.

EDIT: Decided to have a little lunctime skive and I've worked it out

Greg, if you could send me those re-verb impulses that would be great.

 

[Bubba po]

Bubba - that is pretty awesome. I have to admit I liked the Crocodile Dundee version much better. The spoken word is easier to make out. I struggled to understand the more "serious" version. I think you have some spatial imbalance between the guitars and drums. The drums are kind of lo-fi-ish, while the guitars are tracked pristine and clean. Either tidy up the drums, or dirty up the guitars in the mix. Good surf feel and licks though.

Thanks, Greg and cheers for the listen!

I'm deffo re-visiting the vocal. I'm going to do away with the pitch shift. For some reason it doesn't work as well on this as it did on "Marianas" - there's a glitchiness that's spoiling the intelligibility.

Do the drums sound lo-fi to you? Perhaps it's something in my choice of 'verb, but they were recorded as cleanly as anything I've ever done. Odd. I shall investigate.

Anyway, onwards and upwards. Something more conventional next, I think.

 

[JDOD]

Ok, here's take 2 of the same di, same exact thing, except I rolled the presence & treble off (probably too much....hahaha)...

DSL:
100 w mode
Green Crunch
Mid-Shift: Off
Resonance: 0
Presence: 5
Bass: 4
Mid: 5
Treble: 2
Volume: 6
Gain: 5

SG>DSL>G12H>i5 Take 2

I think it might sound a little better with the treble around 3, maybe 4...I'm still impressed as shit with the DSL...

Miner, that sounds great and your rhythm playing is tight as fuck as it has been on all your recent clips. Do you record along to a metronome or is that just free time?

Second question - I've never used an i5 - I only use a '57. Do you have a 57? If you do could you post up a comparison? If I don't get distracted by buying more pedals any time soon I might invest in another mic.

EDIT: Why on earth did I decide to round the evening off with a Manhattan?

 

[Greg_L]

Thanks, Greg and cheers for the listen!

I'm deffo re-visiting the vocal. I'm going to do away with the pitch shift. For some reason it doesn't work as well on this as it did on "Marianas" - there's a glitchiness that's spoiling the intelligibility.

Do the drums sound lo-fi to you? Perhaps it's something in my choice of 'verb, but they were recorded as cleanly as anything I've ever done. Odd. I shall investigate.

Anyway, onwards and upwards. Something more conventional next, I think.

I don't think the drums sound lo-fi, like in the lo-fi style. I just mean in the mix, they're not as clean an in your face as the other stuff, mainly the guitars. It could be the reverb. It just sounds like the drums are in a whole 'nother space. I mean, anyone can mix however they wanna mix, but it sounds more amateurish to me, even on pro recordings, when the pieces don't sound like they're in the same space. Like, what band scenario could you ever envision where the drums are 500 feet behind the guitar amps? It's just not realistic in nature, so it's not gonna seem realistic in a mix. And that especially doesn't work for me in a surf rock mix. But in your mix the drums are probably more appropriate, so I'd probably muck up the guitars some. Roll off some highs and get them in the same reverb as the drums.

 

[rayc]

OK Folks,
the next step in my darktone research:
I've modified the mic position to the brightest - at the grill cloth & pointed smack at the centre of the dust cap.
I've used three different mics and 2 interfaces (Focusrite 8i6 & Zoom R16) in the hope of addressing the issue.
Mics are a Shure 57, a Sennheiser e609 and a relative no name LaGrange dynamic.
Here're links to a dropbox file (MP3 320) and Soundcloud (squished by their algorithms):

If you actually double click this & go to soundcloud you'll see comment/ markers that announce the changes.

Again, All snippets are mic at the grill cloth pointed directly at the middle of the dust cap.
A series of ppower chords followed by an open C maj and a bright chord - augmented fiddly D.
The amp (Kustom H5 Defender) has vol set at about 10am. No tone controls on the amp.
Oh, I used my "fang" pick which makes things EVEN BRIGHTER.
Is there still a "darkness" or lack of high end to my recordings.
Guitar: bridge PU, tone full treble.
In the room it was almost ice pick to the brain bright:
Parts of the clip in order are:

1st: a 57 through Focusrite
2nd: the same through Zoom R16
3rd: an e609 Focusrite
4th: e609 ZR16
5th: a LaGrange Focusrite
6th: LaG ZR16
Is there a difference between interfaces?
Is one better than the other?
Does one of the mics producuce a brighter tone?

 

[rayc]

JDOD,
Sut wyt ti.
Sut dach ti?
Beth wyt ti'n meddwl o Saesneg?
Sut mae'r syrffio heddiw ?

 

[Bubba po]

I don't think the drums sound lo-fi, like in the lo-fi style. I just mean in the mix, they're not as clean an in your face as the other stuff, mainly the guitars. It could be the reverb. It just sounds like the drums are in a whole 'nother space. I mean, anyone can mix however they wanna mix, but it sounds more amateurish to me, even on pro recordings, when the pieces don't sound like they're in the same space. Like, what band scenario could you ever envision where the drums are 500 feet behind the guitar amps? It's just not realistic in nature, so it's not gonna seem realistic in a mix. And that especially doesn't work for me in a surf rock mix. But in your mix the drums are probably more appropriate, so I'd probably muck up the guitars some. Roll off some highs and get them in the same reverb as the drums.

Got you. I'll have a look into that.

 

[rayc]

MM,
Cool AC/DC type crunch.

 

[JDOD]

JDOD,
Sut wyt ti.
Sut dach ti?
Beth wyt ti'n meddwl o Saesneg?
Sut mae'r syrffio heddiw ?

Wedi blino lan! Stayed out and had a few too many drinkies last night.
Mae'r rhagolygon syrffio yn cachu

To be honest, we don't speaking great deal of Welsh on the south coast. Its almost exclusively english. I had to look up what Forecast was 'cos I had no idea.

Most of your clips sound fairly bright, Ray. But not crazy fizzy/sour sweet-face bright.

 

[rayc]

The forecast here is so so. The water's pretty warm (24) and there's a swell expected tomorrow evening but it'll be accompanied by rain. No one surfs, and very few who know it swim, at our beach (I'm about 5 mins walk from the surf) as the rips are evil and there's Sandon Point 15 mins south which is renowned for it's break.
.

Sandon Point is the North most one in the pic.
There's a high school 5om from the Point and, yes, they do surf for sport.

Here's our beach looking south at it from the hill above (note the rips)
Oh, I used the internet to do the Welsh.
Sorry.
Thanks for the feedback re the tone samples.

 

[JDOD]

24!!! I think the warmest water I've ever surfed in is about 20 in France. Its still the only time I've ever surfed without a wetsuit and that was in the late 90s. Hoping to go to the Canaries in a month or so though. That should be nice. Looks like a great place to live, Ray.

 

[Greg_L]

24!!! I think the warmest water I've ever surfed in is about 20 in France. Its still the only time I've ever surfed without a wetsuit and that was in the late 90s. Hoping to go to the Canaries in a month or so though. That should be nice. Looks like a great place to live, Ray.

Man, our water is like bath water in the summer. Hot. By noon it's not a refreshing dip in the sea. The fish don't even like it. If you haven't caught a good haul of fish by lunch time, pack it up and go home. The fish run to cooler deeper water.

 

[JDOD]

Man, our water is like bath water in the summer. Hot. By noon it's not a refreshing dip in the sea. The fish don't even like it. If you haven't caught a good haul of fish by lunch time, pack it up and go home. The fish run to cooler deeper water.

Our water is just starting to warm up now. We're up to 9 or 10C (just under 50, Greg)

Greg, don't know if you saw - I worked out that shit Miner and Tad were telling me about - can you send me them reverbs? (and a rec for which one to use!)

 

[Greg_L]

Our water is just starting to warm up now. We're up to 9 or 10C (just under 50, Greg)

Greg, don't know if you saw - I worked out that shit Miner and Tad were telling me about - can you send me them reverbs? (and a rec for which one to use!)

Ok I'll pack em up.

 

[JDOD]

Ok I'll pack em up.

Cheers, mate.

 

[JDOD]

Tad/Miner - in my EZD mixer - I have kick top/kick bottom and snare top/snare bottom. At the moment I have them both going to the same track in Reaper. I notice Tad didn't have this on his version, should there be any default that I am looking for here?

 

[Bill L]

Every time I try to play slide, I mainly just get the sound of the strings rattling against the slide. Yours sounds clean and "pure".

The toughest part of playing slide is the muting of the other strings (on both sides of the slide). I play with my fingers (no pick) which helps my ability to dampen some strings while plucking others. It took me many years to learn how to do it properly. If you have excessive string buzz, try getting a set of flatwounds. It adds a very creamy sound. The guys in Little Feat use flatwounds, if you were looking for some sound clips.

 

[minerman]

Tad/Miner - in my EZD mixer - I have kick top/kick bottom and snare top/snare bottom. At the moment I have them both going to the same track in Reaper. I notice Tad didn't have this on his version, should there be any default that I am looking for here?

Click on where it says "stereo" or "1/2" at the bottom of each track/fader in the EZD mixer, & it should give you an option for multi-outs...And yes Jdude, I have a '57, it's kinda like the i5 but to me doesn't have the upper-mid hump...I'll try to post some comparison clips for you...

Ray: I'll have a listen to your clips in just a little while...