Homebuilt guitar take two, critiques welcome!

metalhead28

Hates Raymond
Other thread was getting heavy..:D

Light, Muttley, anyone else who gives a damn, as I stated in the other thread I hope to pursue this and build many more guitars. This build will become more of a learning experience if it can generate some healthy criticism that I can consider in the future. I appreciate any and all comments that you care to give.

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I can take some more pictures tonight if there is anything particular anyone is interested in.
 
(That other thread went straight to shit, didn't it? :eek:)

Yeah, I started reading it, hoping to find pics of the finished beast, and almost got hit in the crossfire.

Pretty guitar, though. The only advice I could give would be "make sure it sounds and plays like my Les Paul Deluxe" which may not be specific enough for you. Keep us posted as the work progresses.
 
What's going on with the control cavity? Is that a scalloped route, or a reflection :confused:

Yes, that is a scalloped cut out for the input jack. My plan was for it to plug in at an angle so that the cord could be naturally draped over the strap, which is the way I always do it...plus I thought it looked cool. :D
 
The best advice I can give that is non specific would be to keep loving what you are doing. I have built hundreds of instruments and I'm still not entirely happy with them. Thats healthy. Believe it or not us so called pro's also seek qualified opinions all the time. We show our stuff to each other, we get to see others work. We critique them but not from a "wow that looks great" perspective. We really get into the detail. Why did you do that? How does that sound? How did you do that? Does that choice of timber/hardware/finish/outline/etc. make a difference. In a nutshell, no matter how long we have been doing this we are always examining how we can improve and what works, what doesn't.

I'll give some thoughts on your build if you want but I don't think it's relevant. You've done a fine job. The next will be better as your confidence and experience grows. Any help on specifics just ask. I'll reply to your post in the other thread tomorrow. I'm just glad we have another luthier in the making.

So, my advice is always ask yourself why? How? and then just go for it. If you are your own worst critic then no matter what else is said you can live with it. We learn by doing, so do it..;)
 
Is that a bottle of Tru-Oil that I see there... next to the screwdriver and the 0000 steel wool? I'm going to be finishing my new tele with Tru-Oil, so I hope that bottle is Tru-Oil. That'll give me a good idea of what the finish on my new rig will look like. Clear.. a bit shiny, but not like glass. Zackly how I want it. Good job on the finish, BTW.
 
Is that a bottle of Tru-Oil that I see there... next to the screwdriver and the 0000 steel wool? I'm going to be finishing my new tele with Tru-Oil, so I hope that bottle is Tru-Oil. That'll give me a good idea of what the finish on my new rig will look like. Clear.. a bit shiny, but not like glass. Zackly how I want it. Good job on the finish, BTW.

Tru Oil is great just spend lots of time filling and prepping. Sand down to 2000 grit and take your time. It's the closest thing you get over the counter to a violin varnish and looks fantastic when done right, looks crap if you get it wrong. Thats the sort of detail we've been hinting at..;)

Make sure it's fresh.
 
Hi Metalhead - What IS that finish on there? And why did you choose it?

That's a problem I always ask myself on my other furniture type projects. And I personally don't know the answer for the furniture or the guitars. I have tended to stick with poly on the furniture/casework, cause it's extremely durable and takes whatever finish I want it to take (glossy, semi, matt, etc.).

I personally like your not-to-glossy look you've got on this one - very classy and not the dipped in plastic look. Is that a tung-oil type finish with steel wool? If so, what's the long term maintenance of that?
 
I carved the neck with rasps and a spokeshave. I built a stand to hang the neck off the edge of my bench to support it and give me access to each side. I just carved on it until it started feeling good in my hand. This was the most enjoyable part of the whole thing I think.

Isn't it just though. Making necks is my second favorite part of making guitars (after stringing them up for the first time and playing them!)

So, a couple of things. I haven't had the guitar in my hands, of course, so I can't go into the kind of detail I would if you brought it into the shop, but you said you have a background in drafting and art, so you should understand the concept of the fair curve. There are a couple of places that look a little less than smooth, though that could be the picture. If you want to make your guitars look professional, that is one of the most critical things you need to look out for. The best way to test this has nothing to do with your eye, but everything to do with your thumb. Run your thumb around the edge, and you will feel any bumps. What I'm seeing here could very well be an illusion of the photo. The only real reason I bring it up is that it is the single most common mistake beginners make when building electric guitars.

There are two areas in particular that I wanted to point out. First is your volute. They are important, in my view, if you are going to use a Gibson style truss rod (I don't know if you did or not), but yours is a little clunky looking. Next time around, I would try to refine the shape of it, and to sort of "hollow" out the neck side of it a bit. It appears to have a bit of a slope, maybe just a hint of a concave curve going from the shaft of the neck into the peghead. It is much more comfortable to have a quite pronounced concave curve there. (This is hard to describe in words - three dimensional curves do not lend themselves to speech very well). The two pictures (excuse the ugly chipped and burned through finish - it was an early prototype for one of the guitars I'm making now, but it shows some of what I'm talking about) actually have LESS concavity than I would like to see (by quite a lot), but you can hopefully see what I'm talking about. You almost want it to mirror the U shape of your hand between your first finger and your thumb. I would also suggest at least trying to make the volute smaller. Customers don't like Volutes much in the first place (because they were used on all those seventies Gibson's, I think, which is silly because the volutes were just about the only GOOD thing on those guitars), and they particularly don't like big ones. It doesn't take much to make up for the truss rod pocket, so it is usually good to keep them small. I don't know if you are planning to try and sell these, but if you are, keep that one in mind.

The second thing I'd work on is the shape of the relief in the treble side cutaway. I would shift the line up toward then neck a bit more, and away from the horn. There are a couple of reasons for this - first of all, it is more comfortable for most people (I mean, you're trying to improve access to the higher frets, right? that means you want the thumb to be in as normal of a position as possible. Bringing the back closer to the thickness of the neck (though on a set neck, the transition can never be completely smooth) is what that is all about. Then again, you have just about all the frets clear of the body anyway, so you could also just do without that relief all together and not cause any real problem.

As for your jack - I've always found them to be a real PITA. If you want the best jack attachment (though this is an opinion, but then all of this stuff is) go with an Electrosocket. They aren't all that fancy (I hate the finish, and I just buy the "chrome" ones, which I take to get plated), but they really work extremely well, and look very clean. I just wish they would plate them to begin with, because getting them plated costs a flippen' fortune.

On other thing I noticed is that the control divots (or whatever you want to call those things) look like they are probably smaller than you want, but you'll figure that out when you put controls on there. I sure did the first few times I did those things. Even with smallish knobs (I use dome knobs), they need to be bigger than you would expect. That could be an optical illusion as well, though.

Now, as I said, I haven't had the guitar in my hands, so take all of this with a grain of perspective salt (I can't really see all the details), and of course these are all opinions. On the whole, I think you are on the right track workmanship wise - though I would encourage you to go a little further afield on the shape. It looks an awful lot like David Mcnaught's guitars, and while it is all well and good to be influenced by other builders, it's a lot more interesting to come up with your own stuff. Keep working on it, keep refining those details, and keep sweating the small stuff. Oh, and take every opportunity you can to get your hands on really nice guitars. All the words I've put in this post will only take you so far. These complex three dimensional curves ARE complex to understand. You will garner a much greater understanding of them by feeling other peoples guitars than by reading anything I have to say.


Light

"Cowards can never be moral."
M.K. Gandhi
 

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Yes, that is a bottle of Tru-Oil and I had just been smoothing out the finish from the third coat I had applied the night before.

I sanded the guitar up to 1000 grit, and I was really happy with the way the oil went on. Might have been nice to go up to 2000 like Muttley suggested...I'll try that next time.
After each coat, I gave it at least a few hours to dry (or overnight) and then hit it with the steel wool until it was a little bit flattened. The last coat I didn't hit it as much on the top, but I smoothed it quite a bit on the neck to keep it feeling nice and silky.


Thanks everyone for the comments.

Light, I have never owned a guitar with a volute, but I liked the look of them. I'm sure you make some good points and as I play this guitar I imagine I'll develop a better sense of what shape will work best. I thought it looked classy, so I probably exaggerated it a bit too much. :D

On the carved top, I had a vision of the contour I wanted, but not necessarily the skill to execute it perfectly. I'm pretty happy with the top on this one, but I think I'll do a better job on the next one.

You're right about the control divots. The knobs fit nicely, but I think it would be more comfortable and look better if they were a little bigger.

Thanks for all the feedback.
 
The best advice I can give that is non specific would be to keep loving what you are doing. I have built hundreds of instruments and I'm still not entirely happy with them. Thats healthy. Believe it or not us so called pro's also seek qualified opinions all the time. We show our stuff to each other, we get to see others work. We critique them but not from a "wow that looks great" perspective. We really get into the detail. Why did you do that? How does that sound? How did you do that? Does that choice of timber/hardware/finish/outline/etc. make a difference. In a nutshell, no matter how long we have been doing this we are always examining how we can improve and what works, what doesn't.

I'll give some thoughts on your build if you want but I don't think it's relevant. You've done a fine job. The next will be better as your confidence and experience grows. Any help on specifics just ask. I'll reply to your post in the other thread tomorrow. I'm just glad we have another luthier in the making.

So, my advice is always ask yourself why? How? and then just go for it. If you are your own worst critic then no matter what else is said you can live with it. We learn by doing, so do it..;)


Thanks, also for your response in the other thread.
You are certainly right about the tools. I'm already planning to upgrade some of the tools I started with and I've hardly gotten any use out of them! Especially the big tools...I wish I had spent more up front, but you've gotta learn on something.

My next project is to build a new workbench. I'm trying come up with a good design that lends itself well to guitar building and repair. Besides that I'm already shopping around for wood for the next build. This can be addictive, not to mention several of my friends have expressed interest in my building them a custom guitar. I'll need more practice before I'm ready to sell anything - but the prospect is pretty exciting.

I hope I can continue to get some good advice from you guys in the future.
 
Light and Mutley

good observations there and some great advice.

I have to put my .02 here
Metlhead I have to say... dang nice work dude!
for your first build you did an excellent job!
every time you build an instrument you will come away with more knowledge than the previous build.
you keep building axes like that you will have yourself much sought after instrument.
and I like the scalloped cut out for the output jack, that is a really cool feature.
 
Hi, Lurker here.

Thanks to the O.P. for posting a non-flame thread. It's funny that this one is much less popular. And the guitar looks _fantastic_. I'm currently working on my first project also, and I will freely admit that yours looks much more professional than mine ever will. I also am building from cheap woods the first time, to try and get some of the larger mistakes out of the way before I go ruining more expensive stuff. I actually like the laminate look, and I can tell you've put an awful lot of work into this thing. As I expected, the problems pointed out are things I would not have thought of, and it's good to finally see them in print. Thanks all for the honest and very helpful advice.

dw
 
Every time I see a thread like this, it makes me want to get into woodworking!

What's a good place to learn about the electronics of the thing? Have you picked out pickups/pots/etc. yet?

*edit: and post MORE PIX!! I'm talkin' at least 10-20 more.
 
Every time I see a thread like this, it makes me want to get into woodworking!

What's a good place to learn about the electronics of the thing? Have you picked out pickups/pots/etc. yet?

*edit: and post MORE PIX!! I'm talkin' at least 10-20 more.


Yeah, I've got everything. I have a few different Seymour Duncans to choose from, I think I'm going to try my Screamin Demon and '59 first.
I learned what I know about electronics from installing tons of pickups over the years, but I also learned alot from the book, "Build Your Own Electric Guitar" by Melvyn Hyscock. (or however the hell you spell it)

Here are a few more pics, but they kind of suck. I need to take some pics outside but it's rainy and nasty here...

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