A very frustrated musician. (Particularly need help with recording lead guitar)
- Thread starter McK
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No, I can't stand the old pod farm tones. Just been working with Mic-ing mostly. And thanks, just wish I could put some newer recordings. I'm always trying to move forward and my ultimate goal is to be able to put out music to anywhere that I'm proud of as a finished product (It's not like I just need to release a demo for my band). Even just putting out that old recording was unsettling... So if the interface is really inefficient then I mean I'll definitely look into it
MusicWater
Banned
I have now read the article. The article, that was about why the standard 432 Hz tuning is no better than anything else was logically well attached, it was good reading and I'm sure the author did not have any negative intent behind it. In my view, for anyone who is willing to dig deeper into this, it is important to not go too fast about it and not to become arrogant and dismissal about it, this is a very big and complex topic really. I find that the author would have made a better story out of detailing why the standard 440 Hz tuning is not optimal. That is in itself such a big thing that you really don't have to make the problem bigger than that. That's the first thing you need to look at when doing the research. If you somehow can conclude that the standard 440 Hz tuning is not optimal then that's a very big thing in itself and that means simply that if that's not optimal, could there be a tuning that actually IS optimal?! That's the next question. So only by looking at these two questions I find you can do more progress than simply just jumping to some standard 432 Hz tuning and then make a broad conclusion. I have never in the thread claimed that the standard 432 Hz tuning is optimal (please read all my posts, that's an assumption in reply to my post), but I have claimed that the 440 Hz standard tuning is NOT optimal and that it IS worth looking more closely into this as a result of that. And you should...! Start by purchasing a multitone generator, it does not cost much. Then dial in the tones part of the 440 Hz standard tuning and let your ears and your heart guide you in that process. Either you will conclude it's very in tune or you will find maybe it's not. And that's why it's worth investing in it, to find out what YOU think about that. Because that's what it boils down to. Creating music that is aligned to you as a being, that's a very important thing! It's very important to love the music you love. I love country music, I love a lot of other music genres too, but I LOVE country music. When you love something or someone in creation, that act of passion and love is not a random meaningless event. You can be sure that one day that love you sent out will be reflected back to you unconditionally, in overflow. Therefore, passionately love what you love, just love and be in that love that you experience. Engage as many of your senses as possible into loving. You will experience what you love, because you are unconditionally loved. Therefore be true to what you love and really do engage as fully as you can in it. If you can love music live, then be live. If you can love music by listening and looking at the album cover of the artist that you love , then don't just listen to the album, but look at the album at the same time as you are listening and love with your eyes too. You will be surprised when you will meet that person. You thought it was stuck on that album cover or that t-shirt or whatever, but it turned real, just for you, because the love you send out is seen and met by total unconditional love! When you hear yourself truthfully saying or feeling or reacting or reflecting...: "I love that" or "I love the way ..." or "I love her ..." or "I love that sound" or "I love how ..."... Know that this is a love that will haunt you down and love you back - it is attracted to you.
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miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
Not sure what your specific claims are....but most pro-432 peopoe DO claim that it is "optimal" based on some "cosmic" mathematics...blah blah...blah.
You seem to have bought into that, so I guess you do think 432 is more optimal....though you really don't seem to have any specifc opinion as to why.
Just saying "dig deeper" or not to go "too fast"....means nothing.
AFA the author of the article that was mentioned....he DOES point out that NO western tuning is "optimal" (and that includes 440, 432, 452, 435...etc.) and he pointed out that was the fundamental problem with the pro-432 thinking.
All 432 does is equally lower everything...but the western 12 parts/octave tuning intervals stay the same, and THAT is really what can be seen as somethng of a problem, and not the actual A reference frequency....but the western 12 parts/octave tuning is somethng we've all learned to live with and accept.
If the 12-part octave doesn't work for you...you can always go play Hindu or Javanese music.
You seem to have bought into that, so I guess you do think 432 is more optimal....though you really don't seem to have any specifc opinion as to why.
Just saying "dig deeper" or not to go "too fast"....means nothing.
AFA the author of the article that was mentioned....he DOES point out that NO western tuning is "optimal" (and that includes 440, 432, 452, 435...etc.) and he pointed out that was the fundamental problem with the pro-432 thinking.
All 432 does is equally lower everything...but the western 12 parts/octave tuning intervals stay the same, and THAT is really what can be seen as somethng of a problem, and not the actual A reference frequency....but the western 12 parts/octave tuning is somethng we've all learned to live with and accept.
If the 12-part octave doesn't work for you...you can always go play Hindu or Javanese music.
MusicWater
Banned
But is it complicated though? I challenge you to find out two frequencies that when are mathematically doubled cause modulation noise using a multitone sine wave generator. Try to find a frequency that when is mathematically doubled will cause the combination to sound out of tune. Say for instance 200Hz and 400Hz, or 150Hz and 300Hz. What I'm challenging you with is this thought: If you can find a mathematical relationship between 2 tones in a musical scale (across the whole frequency spectrum) that always causes full resonance, why would you not be able to find similar mathematical relationships when determining the frequencies for the rest of the tones in the scale, why would it exist between two frequencies but not between all the rest? Because after all you HAVE been able to prove a mathematical relationship between notes in the frequency doubling case, it could have been different, but nature says it's not. Please think about this...
In a completely chaotic creation, you could never repeat anything, when you would try out 200Hz against 400Hz they would randomly be out of tune. But they are simply not. One can repeat that test an infinite amount of times, but the truth of nature is a constant, it always returns the same output. And it is this: Total unconditional love.
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mjbphotos
Moderator
But is it complicated though? I challenge you to find out two frequencies that when are mathematically doubled cause modulation noise using a multitone sine wave generator. Try to find a frequency that when is mathematically doubled will cause the combination to sound out of tune. Say for instance 200Hz and 400Hz, or 150Hz and 300Hz. What I'm challenging you with is this thought: If you can find a mathematical relationship between 2 tones in a musical scale (across the whole frequency spectrum) that always causes full resonance, why would you not be able to find similar mathematical relationships when determining the frequencies for the rest of the tones in the scale, why would it exist between two frequencies but not between all the rest? Because after all you HAVE been able to prove a mathematical relationship between notes in the frequency doubling case, it could have been different, but nature says it's not. Please think about this...
In a completely chaotic creation, you could never repeat anything, when you would try out 200Hz against 400Hz they would randomly be out of tune. But they are simply not. One can repeat that test an infinite amount of times, but the truth of nature is a constant, it always returns the same output. And it is this: Total unconditional love.
So why are you saying 440 tuning is "not in tune" but 432 is?
Bubba po
Tiny Stonehenge Moment
Because he's an idiot. No "perfect" tuning is perfect across all keys.
Chili
Site Moderator
But is it complicated though? I challenge you to find out two frequencies that when are mathematically doubled cause modulation noise using a multitone sine wave generator. Try to find a frequency that when is mathematically doubled will cause the combination to sound out of tune. Say for instance 200Hz and 400Hz, or 150Hz and 300Hz. What I'm challenging you with is this thought: If you can find a mathematical relationship between 2 tones in a musical scale (across the whole frequency spectrum) that always causes full resonance, why would you not be able to find similar mathematical relationships when determining the frequencies for the rest of the tones in the scale, why would it exist between two frequencies but not between all the rest? Because after all you HAVE been able to prove a mathematical relationship between notes in the frequency doubling case, it could have been different, but nature says it's not. Please think about this...
In a completely chaotic creation, you could never repeat anything, when you would try out 200Hz against 400Hz they would randomly be out of tune. But they are simply not. One can repeat that test an infinite amount of times, but the truth of nature is a constant, it always returns the same output. And it is this: Total unconditional love.
What are you babbling about this time?
---------- Update ----------
He doesn't know what he is saying.
Hey chili, why is musicwater allowed to derail a thread with this nonsense?
jimmys69
MOODerator
He shouldn't be...
I am way past being tired of it myself...
There needs to be a maximum number of ridiculous posts when infraction and ban becomes something we can do. I am sick of the stupid shit around here lately.
Derailing a thread is a bannable offense, right?
But is it complicated though? I challenge you to find out two frequencies that when are mathematically doubled cause modulation noise using a multitone sine wave generator. Try to find a frequency that when is mathematically doubled will cause the combination to sound out of tune. Say for instance 200Hz and 400Hz, or 150Hz and 300Hz. What I'm challenging you with is this thought: If you can find a mathematical relationship between 2 tones in a musical scale (across the whole frequency spectrum) that always causes full resonance, why would you not be able to find similar mathematical relationships when determining the frequencies for the rest of the tones in the scale, why would it exist between two frequencies but not between all the rest? Because after all you HAVE been able to prove a mathematical relationship between notes in the frequency doubling case, it could have been different, but nature says it's not. Please think about this...
In a completely chaotic creation, you could never repeat anything, when you would try out 200Hz against 400Hz they would randomly be out of tune. But they are simply not. One can repeat that test an infinite amount of times, but the truth of nature is a constant, it always returns the same output. And it is this: Total unconditional love.
In theory.
Sadly every real existing instrument shows your "total unconditional love" the middle finger.
Just grow up, man.
The Phytagoreans are extinct for, like, 2500 years, and rightfully so.
Oh, and PS:
An octave is an octave, no matter whether you start at 440 or 432...
miroslav
Cosmic Cowboy
Yeah....that's the part he either doesn't get, or is intentionally dodging.
I mean...nothing wrong with doing 432 or whatever else you prefer. The A= reference has been all over the place in the last few hundred years, with various frequencies being used, depending on prersonal preferences and music politics on the classical concert side of things.
Just don't sell 432 as some special/magical reference that somehow fixes all the 12 step octave tuning issues...432 doesn't change the intervals of the 12 step octave.
DM60
Well-known member
Yeah....that's the part he either doesn't get, or is intentionally dodging.
I mean...nothing wrong with doing 432 or whatever else you prefer. The A= reference has been all over the place in the last few hundred years, with various frequencies being used, depending on prersonal preferences and music politics on the classical concert side of things.
Just don't sell 432 as some special/magical reference that somehow fixes all the 12 step octave tuning issues...432 doesn't change the intervals of the 12 step octave.
The whole point of a standard is, hey, here is where we all start from. Otherwise, how the hell would you know the piano tunings before hand? I could see three guest artist showing up for a symphony concert and the orchestra having to stop for each guest and re-tune.
A=440 just seems like everyone agreed that is what will be used. Tune up before you arrive so we can play
YanKleber
Retired
LoL, this thread is hilarious.
I have stopped to read ANY MusicWater post since some time ago because well... just because... and also I don't read absolutelly any post of RAMI right after because I know that it is just he beating hard the head of the crazy guy.
Anyway, as several others has mentioned, I stick with the good old 440 Hz because it is what everybody else does, it is easy and it works. Other than that I may be hearing a bunch of songs in a different/alternative pitch but since the whole band is tuned together I never will really know.
About the planetary integrity and all this BS it is the same as to say that if you piss in the ocean it will increase the global warming. In a significant way I mean.
I have stopped to read ANY MusicWater post since some time ago because well... just because... and also I don't read absolutelly any post of RAMI right after because I know that it is just he beating hard the head of the crazy guy.
Anyway, as several others has mentioned, I stick with the good old 440 Hz because it is what everybody else does, it is easy and it works. Other than that I may be hearing a bunch of songs in a different/alternative pitch but since the whole band is tuned together I never will really know.
About the planetary integrity and all this BS it is the same as to say that if you piss in the ocean it will increase the global warming. In a significant way I mean.
MusicWater
Banned
But have I really said so? I did make a statement that the standard 440 Hz tuning is out of tune, but all I did after that was to comment on people throwing standard 432 Hz tuning arguments at me. I'm not here to point finger or anything, I just want to separate facts from fiction.
---------- Update ----------
Please read my post above.
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