Yamaha MG worth my money?

  • Thread starter Thread starter pdadda
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pdadda

pdadda

Captain Sea Boots
Hey folks. My band has only been playing at local places that have their own PA. We want to branch out though. So I am looking into building up a PA system. I figure the first thing I want to buy is a mixer (non-powered). Then I will buy amps, monitors, speakers.
I want to buy the mixer first because it also means more pre-amps for recording until I can get some nice outboard pre's (I currently only have 3 pre-amps). I don't plan on using the pre's in the mixer long term for recording, just while I continue to learn the craft. Also, the board doesn't need to be huge, as all the large places we will play have their own sound system as well.
So I had narrowed it down to a Soundcraft M12 or a Yamaha MG 16/4. The Yamaha is MUCH cheaper. I am quite sure the quality is not as good as the Soundcraft, but this will be mostly use for live work and not high end pre's down the road.
Anyone have the MG 16/4 or have anyone opinions here?
 
First let me say that I'm a Soundcraft man. The M series is a great board with great pres. If you've got the money to spend then get the M series. If its beyond your budget than the Yamaha MG series is a great budget choice.
 
I installed MG16/4 in church hall last month. Very pleased with it - I think it represents excellent value for money, its quiet and build quality looks good to. Got most features a small band would need though might run out of mics if u r miking up drums. Also misses a graphic but its so cheap you can easily add a proper graphic or feedback eliminator and still be quids-in.
 
I heard that you can't bypass the EQ on the Yamaha MG boards. Is this true? What if you just leave the knobs at 12:00?
 
pdadda said:
I heard that you can't bypass the EQ on the Yamaha MG boards. Is this true? What if you just leave the knobs at 12:00?
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Thats called "Unity" which means no EQ us added. If you want outputs that let you bypass the Eq you will need to get a Soundcraft M series. The direct outs are pre/post Eq selectable.
 
Forgive me for my ignorance on these matters. So what then is the advantage of true EQ bypass? If nothing is added with the knobs at 12:00.
Also, someone else told me that you can't use the inserts as "direct outs" for recording. If I can't get at least 8 channels recorded simultaneously, I'm not interested.
 
if you stick the trs cable in the insert jack until it clicks one time then it becomes a direct out. so however many inserts you have is how many direct outs you have. the only catch is that you cant have any eq on any channel of which you are using the insert as a direct out.

deepwater...you're trying to sell that soundcraft M series hard arent ya? lol its all good though..i have $250 saved so far for the M12. i dont think it cost too much..i just think it costs alot. i might have to try knocking over a few stores to speed things along
 
OK, so what officially is the advantage of a direct out over an insert? Is it just that they can be pre or post EQ and fader? Does tapping the insert as a direct out make it unbalanced?
 
The advantage is that you can use the direct out and still have an insert available.

The mixer insert jack is wired to send and receive using a TRS three conductor cable. It uses unbalanced signals because one hot lead of the TRS cable is an outgoing signal to the effects unit and the other is the return of the modified signal from the effects unit.

So if you use an unbalanced cable (TS) and plug it into the insert just one click, you will be in contact with the conductors wired to send a signal. You can use that signal to record and it does not interrupt the channel strip, so it remains available for live sound. The send is a pre-EQ, unbalanced signal. Works slick; just don't use a bunch of 50 foot cables.
 
Thanks a ton for your reply Treeline. Exactly what I needed to know. The MG16/4 may be the low cost route for me to go then. I was only planning on using the onboard EQ live, and tapping the inserts as direct outs for recording. I don't want to spend much on a board now, as I am unsure if the bulk of my income will be gigging or recording in the future. Most big places my band is looking to play have their own house PA and sound guy. If I get it, I'll post a review.
 
Keep this in mind about the Yamaha: If you use the inserts as direct outs, the unbalanced signal from the insert will be out of phase with the main and group outs. This means that you need to be careful about separation and what you choose to route where. I recorded a live gig and had the vocals from an insert bleed (from the P.A.) into a drum mic taken from the main outs. The phase cancellation ruined the recording.
 
Keep in mind that on the MG series, you do have group outs. They're not quite as versatile as having a direct out for each channel (which you can still do anyway with the inserts), but the group outs do allow you to assign several different channels together as an out. It still allows you to have separate control over each of your channels...but you won't be able to mix them separately once they're actually recorded.

Anyway, long story short: the group outs do allow you to record as many channels as you want to simultaneously.
 
leddy said:
Keep this in mind about the Yamaha: If you use the inserts as direct outs, the unbalanced signal from the insert will be out of phase with the main and group outs. This means that you need to be careful about separation and what you choose to route where. I recorded a live gig and had the vocals from an insert bleed (from the P.A.) into a drum mic taken from the main outs. The phase cancellation ruined the recording.
Click to expand...

Wow. I'm glad to know that; would never have occurred to me. I use my Mackie that way, but I've never blended in the main or group outs. I'll watch for that. Thanks!
 
Treeline said:
Wow. I'm glad to know that; would never have occurred to me. I use my Mackie that way, but I've never blended in the main or group outs. I'll watch for that. Thanks!
Click to expand...

Don't know if the Mackie's are the same. The mains and groups should be fine. It's only when you blend mains or groups WITH the inserts. Those signal are out of phase on the Yamaha MG. Says so in the manual, and I found it to be true for sure.
 
I bought a Yamaha MG16/6FX a while back and it's been great for my band. I use it as a live/rec board as follows: 4 mics for drums (kick, snare, 2 OHs) on channels 1-4, bass on 5, guitar on 6, guitar on 7, lead vox on 8, and backing vox on 9 & 10. I record onto my DA-38 with by tapping the insert points using my d-sub snake. Tracks 1-7 on the tascam are direct from channels 1-7, track 8 is all vox out of group 1. I make sure the vocal mics are properly mixed in relation to each other and send them out via group 1 to channel 8 on my DA-38. My recorded tracks are pre-eq, which is fine with me. I can EQ for the performance and worry about EQ on the mix later. Works great for me.
 
That's the model I've got too, and I love the hell out of it.
 
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