writing drum loops

[phosphor]

Previous to Alan's illuminating post on the use of soundfonts, I have been struggling with bitheadz voodoo program for arranging authentic sounding rock drums, and importing wavs into my cakewalk 8 project. I am delighted to hear that my sblive! value and some soundfonts can create some excellent sounding drumbeats (and more besides), but im stuck on the last stage of the process - actually arranging the drum sequence.

As you can tell Im a newcomer to all things homerecording, and i've been fumbling about in the dark for 4 or 5 songs now. I would love some tips on this step. Im looking blankly at the staff view as I stopped using sheet music shortly after I gave up recorder lessons (age7). The Piano roll looks good but It seems very clumsy - is this worth persuing or is there a more user friendly interface?

I'd love to be able to include fast rolls on the snare and maybe even a small amount of double kick.

Question two - once I have say, four bars of the song in the tempo I like, is there an easier way to repeat this n times (ie for the entire length of the chorus) without cutting and pasting the 'loop' n times?

Question three - What about tempo changes? I change the tempo in the window on the menu bar and it changes the tempo for the entire project. is it possible to arrange a tempo change say for a chorus or bridge?

I retrospect these all seem newbie enough to belong in the newbie section, only that they are all specific to cakewalk. I hope you dont mind me posting them here.

Thanks for you advice!

 

[phosphor]

oddly enough I played about with CWPA after writing this and managed to answer a few of my own questions....

I see now the tempo view, and though I dont understand it fully Im sure Its understandable with a little practise. The bridge in my next song should stand out now

Editing drum loops, or at least editing the drum sequence is a little easier now. I see that you can change the scale of the snap-to utility and the 'resolution' of the piano roll window, allowing higher granularity. Im also getting the hang of using soundfonts!

Im still not sure about repeating a drum pattern n times. Im cutting and pasting the loop the desired amount of times, but thats a small price to pay.

p

 

[timothydog]

I've been programming drums with computers for 11-12 years now. I started out using the sounds off a sound blaster pro card.. (yuk). Then I stepped up to an Alesys sr-16(dm4) programming it with a midi program called Trax. I picked up Sonar and some nice soundfonts last year and I've been using that ever since.

There are a few keys to getting "real" sounding drum beats.

You have to think like a drummer and know the basics (obviously) of good drum beats. Don't program things that would be physically impossible to play (ie. unless you have 3 arms or legs). Also keep things in mind like you almost always hit a cymbal and kick at the same time.. this comes from listening to a lot of different drummers.

The first step to getting realistic drum beats is to get a good set of drum samples.. All the programming and tweaking in the world isn't going to make a realistic beat if the samples don't cut it. There are some good drum boxes out there today BUT the best way to go is to get some layered soundfonts. Layered samples are where it's at! Older drum machines give you 1 sample for each drum.. no matter what velocity you trigger it, it always sounds the same.. just quieter. With layered soundfonts, changing the velocity of a hit will trigger a totally different sample. This is a breakthrough for us drum programmers!

Another thing to consider when making "human" drum beats is to remember that humans don't have the precision of a computer. They are constantly speeding up and slowing down and hitting the drums at different velocities. Downbeats are usually hit harder that upbeats so change the note velocity to reflect this. Also, real drummers don't hit everything exactly on the beat.. you can go in and push the snare hits just a hair past the beat and it will make a huge difference. Another thing that drummers tend to do is slightly speed up or slow down as they go into different sections of the song.. too much of a difference will ruin the song but a couple beats per minute can really add more life and vary the dynamics just a little more.

I hope some of these can help you. These are all things I've learned from years of programming.

 

[phosphor]

thanks for the advice timothydog, its well received.

I have an SBLive! Value and I've downloaded The natural Studio kit V5 for my drums. It sounds great to me - do you happen to know if its a layered soundfont or not?

Luckily for me I've spent some time playing drums, and im just past beginner so working natural (allbeit simple) drum beats out is a little easier. Its only when i compare them to some of my favorite drummers (grohl, silviera, narcizo... funnily enough all called david!) that i end up feeling a little foolish!

Anyways - back to the loops! thanks for your help.

p

 

[timothydog]

I'm not familiar with Studio V5.
If they sound good to you then I say go for it!
You may want to check out sonic implants drum implants too.