Which Budget Preamp?

  • Thread starter Thread starter emomusician
  • Start date Start date
If I were looking for an "ElCheapo" preamp, I certainly wouldn't be looking for anything with a "toob" in it.

"Cheap" and "Tube" in the same sentence almost invariably leads to "Crap" in the next.
 
I've heard a couple people say they liked those pres but I would personally save the money and put it towards a better one.

I'm not speaking from experience (I've never used them myself) but as Massive said, cheap and tube don't go together too well in most cases.

If you're looking for something that will add a lot of good tube character to your music then you will probably need to spend a lot more than $70.

I'd start out with something clean and cheap like the DMP3 or just save for a better tube pre.
 
I bought an $50.00 ART and it hissed and picked up every radio frequency in the city. impossible to use for recording, i had to take it back.
 
The Rane MS-1B would be a better choice. I agree with the advice about going for something clean and tube free in that price range.
 
SonicAlbert said:
The Rane MS-1B would be a better choice. I agree with the advice about going for something clean and tube free in that price range.
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I was surprised at how nice this pre is...
 
I used to have a rolls mini mic pre I used to use..

not looking for professional quality.. but something better than a live sound mixer's pres.

www.myspace.com/silenceduntilnowrock

this is what we are working with now.. and the vocals sound horrible.
 
emomusician said:
Question,

of the Art Preamps in the 50-70 dollar range, you've got the ART tube MP (49.99) and the ART tube MP project series (69.99)

is there much difference in the 2?
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If you're trying to decide which of those two to buy, I'd choose the standard MP if you've used a mic pre in the past and don't need any presets to get your "sound"... dial in the sound that you want using the input gain pot on the standard MP (if you're comfortable with that thought). If not and you're new to using a mic pre, spend the extra $20 on the MP Project because it has several input gain presets that you can try without getting into too much trouble.

The trick to getting the most out of the Art Tube MP series is proper gain staging, and NOT cranking up the tube circuit too much. Plug your mic into the Tube MP; put a signal through the mic (vocal, guitar, direct bass, whatever); turn up the input gain control to the point where the signal LED just begins to flicker from green to red; turn up the output gain control so that it delivers a good, non-distorted preamplified signal to your PC, recorder or other recording hardware, and you're on your way.

The Tube MP series works very well as a bass direct box too... try it with a passive Fender Jazz or Precision (as two examples) and you'll see what I mean.

It's a good little mic pre for the money IMHO, as long as you take the time to dial it in. I think most people that have problems with the Tube MP series mic pres either have a defective one, or are very unexperienced and don't know how to use them. FWIW.
 
kid klash said:
I think most people that have problems with the Tube MP series mic pres either have a defective one, or are very unexperienced and don't know how to use them. FWIW.
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I agree. I haven't used the art mp, but i got suckered into buying a presonus tube pre at guitar center. I'd heard all these bad reviews about it and felt very uneasy about the purchase. After i got it home, swapped the tube for a GT tube, it sounded wayy better than my behringer mixer pre(which really isn't alot to say, but yea!). Suprisingly, i got alot of good recordings out the behringer pre and i've gotten even better ones out of this pre. All you have to do is learn YOUR gear to get a good sound, unless your gear is absolutely unusable. For example, I see alot of folks get so hung up on purchasing pro-tools because they think it automatically makes your stuff sound better. Starts with the user of the gear, not the gear. Imma stick with this pre until i have money for something really good. No need to buy a new pre every few months!! :D
 
there's an m-audio dmp3 on ebay for 100 bucks and free shipping right now.

I hope this isn't considered spam, but:

I also have a dmp3 that I'd sell for the same price. I'm buying a preamp from johnnyc, so I won't be needing the dmp3. It's in perfect working condition. it has some scratches from being kept in a duffel bag with some other preamps, but that's the only problem with it. I probably have the original box and anything else that it came with also.
 
The Electro-Harmonix 12AY7 preamp is quite good for a budget tube pre in my opinion. For the $50-$70 region, you're pretty much screwed though.
 
Massive Master said:
......

"Cheap" and "Tube" in the same sentence almost invariably leads to "Crap" in the next.
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Not exactly true. It could lead to :
Chube or
Tuch or
Becheap

There are many possibilities for the "next sentence". Last one is probably closer to the truth here. I can't find "crap" anywhere no matter how hard I try.
 
yeah, thats how i view it..

I could go and buy a 500.00 preamp...

but if I don't really know that much about how to use it, its not gonna sound any better than a 70.00 one.

I know this, because.. I am a guitar player..

I have a mesa boogie dual rec. and mine sounds amazing (to me and other people who have heard me play through it)...

I know another guy who has one, and knows nothing about guitar tone.. settings, pickups, and what not.. just bought it because of the brand name..

and well, his sounds like garbage.

buying a cheap 50.00 preamp might not make my recordings sound like gold.. but they will at least get them slightly less "dead" since, a live sound mixer is not exactly the best pre's for a condensor mic. And, I have always found that you should learn on something cheap.. because if you can make it sound good.. then when I get the money to get an expensive preamp.. (if i really want to pursue this) I will already know how to make it sound like gold.

I don't want a pile of expensive equipment I can't get rid of if for some reason I can't or don't want to continue doing music. I'm a hobbyist, so cheap is good :)

Thanks for all the replies.. you've helped me make my decision.
 
Most preamps are pretty basic units. They raise the signal to line level. Gain controls the gain, might have a low cut filter to cut lows, or a few extra features that you can mess with.

There's not really anything you have to 'learn' how to use. What's important is to know how it sounds so you can make a better judgment on what you need in a preamp, if anything.

Most cleaner pres that are decent and not noisy (DMP3 for example) don't really add anything to the sound. So if the source sounds good then you should be okay. If you want something 'warmer' or 'smoother' sounding then you would probably want to get a *nice* tube pre. These aren't cheap. I think the preamp is one of the best places in the signal chain to add character to the sound. A $50 tube pre is not likely to do this well, if at all.

Preamps aren't really like most other gear in the sense that "I need to learn this unit inside and out before I can be worthy of a more expensive one". Each one is different and it's the character that you need to learn.

And also what gain settings sound best on certain instruments and mics. For example, a little over 0dbVU might sound okay on electric guitar (or not), but bad on vocals. A little less than 0dbVU might sound a little cleaner on acoustic guitar, etc. These small subtleties are unlikely to be heard well by someone inexperienced or on most clean pres and are dependent not only on the preamp but the other gear in the signal chain.

What I'm saying is these kinds of things usually have to be relearned each time you get a new pre because each one is different. So don't hesitate buying one because you think you don't know your gear well enough. ;)

You may get more familiar with pres in general and how they effect the sound, but you will still have to take the time to learn your new pre just like the one before.
 
Nameless said:
Most preamps are pretty basic units. They raise the signal to line level. Gain controls the gain, might have a low cut filter to cut lows, or a few extra features that you can mess with.

There's not really anything you have to 'learn' how to use. What's important is to know how it sounds so you can make a better judgment on what you need in a preamp, if anything.

Most cleaner pres that are decent and not noisy (DMP3 for example) don't really add anything to the sound. So if the source sounds good then you should be okay. If you want something 'warmer' or 'smoother' sounding then you would probably want to get a *nice* tube pre. These aren't cheap. I think the preamp is one of the best places in the signal chain to add character to the sound. A $50 tube pre is not likely to do this well, if at all.

Preamps aren't really like most other gear in the sense that "I need to learn this unit inside and out before I can be worthy of a more expensive one". Each one is different and it's the character that you need to learn.

And also what gain settings sound best on certain instruments and mics. For example, a little over 0dbVU might sound okay on electric guitar (or not), but bad on vocals. A little less than 0dbVU might sound a little cleaner on acoustic guitar, etc. These small subtleties are unlikely to be heard well by someone inexperienced or on most clean pres and are dependent not only on the preamp but the other gear in the signal chain.

What I'm saying is these kinds of things usually have to be relearned each time you get a new pre because each one is different. So don't hesitate buying one because you think you don't know your gear well enough. ;)

You may get more familiar with pres in general and how they effect the sound, but you will still have to take the time to learn your new pre just like the one before.
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The #1 thing that is forgotten is that any pre-amp has a gain of over 1000. The mic has a very small signal that is boosted over 1000 times and it is at this stage that EVERYTHING matters. Whatever the pre-amp does to the signal cannot be changed ever. It makes sense that the pre-amp is very important to the recording process (probably the most important after a good quality signal in the first place IE: the mic).

Great pre-amps do make a huge difference IF you have top notch everything else. In the normal home environment, great pre-amps don't really change things for the better much.
 
I'm recording with a Delta 66 card + breakout box.. into my PC using Audition.

I do have a Yamaha MG10-2 mixer.. that I use for instruments.

I usually record vocals with a MXL 990 condensor I have.

I don't think an expensive pre is gonna make that sound any better than it already does.
 
What is there to figure out about using a preamp? It's only one damn knob.
 
birthday boy said:
What is there to figure out about using a preamp? It's only one damn knob.
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Learning how to make the most of one damn knob. Knowing how far to turn that one damn knob for certain situations. Hell, most people aren't even sure how far to turn the one damn knob just to get proper gain staging.

And speaking of damn knobs, don't even bother recording if you don't have the REAL one damn knobs installed. It's not even worth it. For about $6,000, you can't go wrong.

http://www.referenceaudiomods.com/M...reen=CTGY&Store_Code=RAM&Category_Code=VOLUME
 
Still, the learning curve isn't really all that steep. I mean, if it's just a matter of gain staging, it's really not all that complicated. Someone would have to be a complete retard to fuck up using a good preamp to the point where it sounds worse than a crappy one.
 
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