what outputs?

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mikeandronda

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I just purchased a Pmh3000 mixer and thus far am very happy. What I am wondering is I also am purchasing a delta 44 audio interface to record onto my PC. I need at least 4 outputs into my PC to do what I want to do so could you please give me any info on how I can do this with my mixer. Also how to do I use inserts I/O? could I use these as outputs on the mixer? Thank you for any and all help.
 
You should be able to route seperate signals using the FX, Mon 1 and Mon 2 outs. Getting a 4th is eluding me at the moment because I don't see seperate controls for the mono out, hopefully someone else can shed some more light on it.
 
Thanx

:) So I can use the fx out for one output an the monitors 1&2 for 2 more. Now I guess that would work because I want to have one for kick drum one for snare.......and if I have to use the other for toms and cymbols...........There is a mono out that says its for a sub.....though I dont see any controls on it........The mixer also has 2 seprate L/R outs for the mains. But I am guessing that wont work.
 
As I understand it, each input on the board is routed to the main outputs, regardless of what you do. The FX and the two Monitor outs can be routed to suit your needs. I don't think you're going to be able to pull off the 4th using that board, like I said though, hopefully someone else has a trick up their sleeve. This isn't to say that a DI or Pre-amp direct to an input on the recorder/soundcard wouldn't work just as well.
 
Yes you can use the inserts as outputs. They are TRS jacks with half being a send [tip] and the other a return [ring] just like an FX loop. When you plug a standard mono cable in 1 click [half way] it acts as a send.
 
The inserts are pre-fade though yes? What would be the point? Wouldn't it be the same as just plugging straight into the recorder/soundcard?
 
You could also use say the Left output and just pan anything you don't want to go to the left output to the right output. ;)

You will have to have the channel fader up to use the FX output. It is "post fader". I am supposin' that the Mon 1 and 2 outputs are "pre fader", so, you don't have to turn up the channel fader for the channels using those two as the outputs.
 
I was hoping someone would say that, it would make sense, though I've never tried it, but I'm going to try now, thanks Ford!
 
use the inserts and keep your monitor and fx sends for what they are

use a mono patch lead. On the chanel you want to send to the Delta 44 insert the patch lead till it clicks once, not fully inserted - plug the other end into whatever channel you're recording on the delta. Repeat for each channel you're recording

This way you can do 4 at a time. If you're doing drums I'd send the kick to 1, snare to 2 and your overheads, left and right to 3 & 4. That way you get the full kit recorded in stereo in one pass.

You can then still mic up the rest of the band through the channels you have left without recording them but give everyone a mix through headphones using the monitor sends and your effects are still free if you wanna put reverb on the vocals to help the performance or something

I'm not saying it's the RIGHT way, or the wrong way. All I'm saying is that's how I'd aproach it with that equipment

good luck and happy recording
 
Creamyapples1 said:
The inserts are pre-fade though yes? What would be the point? Wouldn't it be the same as just plugging straight into the recorder/soundcard?
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Yes the inserts are pre-fade, pre-EQ, pre-send. That way you only use the gain to increase the signal and you will bypass all of the unncessary busses which gives a cleaner signal. You can't just plug a mic into a soundcard without a preamp.
 
Awesome guys......So this is what I got thus far.....I can use the Inserts as an out.......It will be like useing the mixer as a pre amp and it will go to the Delta 44 pre mix or effects. This would be just fine cuz I could ad EQing and effects from the ones on Cakewalk. So I guess that means if I wanted to get a interface with more ins I could do up to 8 with this mixer? Thats food for thought....... :)
 
mikeandronda said:
Awesome guys......So this is what I got thus far.....I can use the Inserts as an out.......It will be like useing the mixer as a pre amp and it will go to the Delta 44 pre mix or effects. This would be just fine cuz I could ad EQing and effects from the ones on Cakewalk. So I guess that means if I wanted to get a interface with more ins I could do up to 8 with this mixer? Thats food for thought....... :)
Click to expand...


yeah a delta 1010 would give you 8 channels you could plug into the inserts and still leave you the S/PDIF input to connect a mic pre or a guitar pod or something.

Basicaly you want the shortest route from signal to disk so that less noise is introduced into your signal so using the inserts bypasses everything but the pre amp on the mixer....right up your street
 
There are two potential problems with using channel inserts for recording.

One, they are unbalanced signals, and possible interference introduced to the unbalanced cable will go into your audio.

Two, the connection is kind of questionable. You are have inserting a cable into that jack, and depending upon the jack, the connector, you could break contact fairly easily.

It is a way to use your preamp in a jam, but, it isn't idea either.

Just some thoughts.
 
So what your saying Ford van is that the singnal could get interference from out side like cell phone? Sorry for my newbie questions :) Also do you mean that because its not really made to do this with the inserts that I may not get a good connection?
 
two solutions to the two above (unlikely) problems.

1. Keep your cable runs short from insert point to soundcard input....anything under 3 meters and you'll be doing just fine with no interference. As for being unbalanced. There's a lot of top end consoles out there with direct outputs that are unbalanced, tape machines, etc...

2. Make sure nobody is going to walk between the mixer and soundcard and yank out the cables, insert points are like any other jack socket...sturdy. You've actualy got more chance of ripping the wires off the half inserted jack before you'll pull the jack out breaking contact.

Peace
 
Gotcha lemontree........all good to know...... This site rocks and all of your guys knowledge is appretiated. :)
 
The are forms of interference that will get through no matter HOW short your cables are. It is a limitation of unbalanced lines.

Shorter cables gives mostly the benefit of less high frequency loss, but there are types of interference that don't much care if your cable is 1' or 10".

A balanced circuit eliminates most interference problems with some nifty tricks done in electronics.

You can read all you want to read about balanced/unbalanced lines here: http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/ampins/balanced/balanced.htm

Another problem associated with using insert jacks is that the "normalling" on them start to wear out. I am almost willing to be that 9 out of 10 people who have a channel "go out" on their console when they have been using their inserts jacks a lot simply have a problem with the jack completing the "normal" when no jack is inserted. I have seen it on MANY consoles from my years of live use.

What happens is that the "send" and "return" and physically linked together on the jack until you plug in a cable, then the physical connection between them is broken. After enough insertion on the insert jack, the metal fatigues, and quits making a good "normalling" connection when nothing is plugged into the insert jack. It is not a "rare" problem, rather, a problem that happens on many mixers after a lot of use on the insert jacks. It is the number one "fix" we do on the live mixers at the sound company I work for.

So, while using the inserts will work, again, it is not as reliable as making full connections.

I have also seen where some 1/4" connector/jack combo's don't "fit" so well. One connector makes a good connection, and another brand doesn't. Sound funny, but again, a problem I have seen many times. The fix is simply a different 1/4" connector (on the cable). But, this can be annoying, and if you didn't know that it COULD be a problem, you would never suspect that it is.

Again, tapping an insert works in a pinch. It just comes with it's own share of potential problems. If you aren't having any of those problems, then you aren't having them.
 
I emailed Behringer earlier and they echoed what I have learned here but they added that these cable may be what i need.......HOSA makes a pre-wired insert to Direct cable called a DOC-106. Use this cable to connect your INSERT channels to a channel input on a recorder........ Would this be a cable made to do this and if so would it stop the normalling problem you speak of Ford Van?
 
Nifty cable! Yup, that would work fine, and would assure that you maintain a GOOD connection.
 
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