Vocal frustrations...

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RobTob

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Hi all,

I have a Boss Br1180CD and I use an Electrovoice EV RE20 mic. For some time now I have had problems getting a clean recording. even without fx the recording seems to have a sound in the bg..not a crisp, clear sound. I record in a small room with a lot of absorbant material in it.

When I save the recording onto CD i then put it onto my pc and use Adobe Audition to attempt to clean it up. I am no sound engineer and I am usually groping in the dark when using equaliser, noise reduction, etc..

I am now virtually at the end of my tether as all I want to record is crisp clean vocals. i have been told by a sound engineer that I might be better off abdandoning the stand alone studio and instead getting a USB audio interface such as M-Audio, Presonus, Tascam or M-Box (has anyone used any of these??) as I already have a professional mic. I would then be recording directly into the pc as opposed to using several options.

All I want to do is simply record clean voicals, no music, as I add that in later but its the vocals I am concerned with. I listen to some podcasts and I hear the crispness and it almost brings tears to my eyes :(wishing mine could sound that clean

Any suggestions would be appreciated before my Boss gets relegated to the world of ebay...

Cheers guys.
 
I'd say run a search on recording techniques and mics. you will find someting! Cheers!!!
 
have to agree..
there is a lot of info out there for beginners on eq+compression and what not....


re 20 is a good mic,,,,which should help you along.a lot!

if it's good enough for frasier crane............


the only thing is,,,,if the re20 is anything like the sm7(b)..it'll need a lot of preamp gain..

i don't know anything about your boss unit, but that might be worth looking into,,,
 
Thanks guys...i have read a fair amount but finding its holding me back on the creativity side..

So for pre-amp gain would i ned to buy another unit to plug into my Boss??
 
sure,you could use another preamp, but i think it'd be better to get an opinion from a boss user.....i know nothing about their units.

gain may turn out to be nothing to do with your problem...




have you tried using the mic at different proximities.


what exactly do you do, from start to finish that results in the sound that you aren't happy with (gain,proximity,environment,effects etc etc)
 
if i had to guess i think it's the preamps messing up the signal. or maybe your using cheap long cables. or bad mic technique. it's hard to say. is everything else you record sound right?

btw the recording medium you use whether it's a portastudio or a computer based software doesn't really matter. the recording specs for devices nowadays are all pretty much parallel it's just a matter of convenience and memory space. if the Boss has everything you need as far as memory and number of recording inputs and enough simultaneous recording inputs the rest is just bells and whistles. You might want to mix on some software package because they're usually more convenient and have more options.
 
Steenamaroo said:
if it's good enough for frasier crane............
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LOL, thank you for not using Rush Limburger as your example. ;) Of course, real RE-20 fans just ate up the movie "Prairie Home Companion":)
Steenamaroo said:
the only thing is,,,,if the re20 is anything like the sm7(b)..it'll need a lot of preamp gain..
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I think that if this is not THE problem, it certainly is *a* problem. I love the RE-20, but it requires more than just a token bare-bones preamp, which is what most of these compact DAW-in-a-box units are equipped with.

The RE-20 is rated at an open voltage of 1.4mV/Pascal, which translates into a sensitivity of -57dBu. This would mean under standard conditions you'd want a preamp that's going to give you a good 60-65dB of clean gain minimum to get you up to snuff (though there are ways around that). There are not many econo-DAWs that give that much preamp boost.

The problem with this BOSS - as with most such units - is their specifications listings are somewhat ambiguous because they are not necessarily using "standard" measurements all the way down the line. For example, they do not provide input gain settings per se; they only list on their website a "nominal input level (variable)" of -40dBu. (Note: the input impedance specs seem acceptable.)

Now, if we take that at face value, that would put the pres on the Boss some 17dB short of what they'd need to drive the RE20 respectably. In reality, they are probably not quite that anemic, but because that "(variable)" is not spec'd out, we really don't know for sure, let alone by how much.

Add to that the fact that it appears that the Boss works at a "line level" of -10dBu - which is very strange (not -10dBV, mind you, but -10dBu) - and I'm not sure how that all plays together.

But if I had to bet, I'd bet that the Boss peamp just doesn't have the juice to carry an RE-20. But when I bet I rarely actually gamble; I'd contact the boys at Boss and get some clarification first, and only *then* decide on my next move.

G.
 
good on you glen,

you said what i couldn't...lol


i had read the boss specs, and couldn't reach a conclusion (cos i don't know a lot about specs and numbers,,,,at least not the ones they give)


bottom line for me was, i figure if it's got enough gain to drive a big dynamic like that to it's full potential,,,,,they'd probably have made a big deal about it on the specs sheet.....



to op...i'd still love to hear a sample though, because without sounding like a twat,,,i reckon there's more of a chance that you're "doing it wrong" lol
 
Steenamaroo said:
i had read the boss specs, and couldn't reach a conclusion (cos i don't know a lot about specs and numbers,,,,at least not the ones they give)
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Yeah, I have a general rule; if they can't make the effort to publish the de facto basic standard specs, don't buy it.

There are a few classic models for which it can be difficult to find modern-style specs because they have been around so long, but usually just one or two more clicks will resolve that. The RE-20 is actually a good example. I was surprised not to see standard sensitivity specs for it on the EV website. But it took all of about 3 seconds to type in a search that did the conversion from the published mV/Pa spec for me.

G.
 
aye, i know what you mean

i got a pair of md421n's a few weeks back for £100 :P:P

if you were goin on information available, you wouldn't have bought them! lol
 
Steenamaroo said:
i got a pair of md421n's a few weeks back for £100 :P:P
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Please tell me that was the price for each of them. That would be a hell of a deal right there. But for the pair, that would be a heart-attack ridiculous low price that would make me just way too jealous :P.

G.
 
i'm sorry to do this to you, but it was £107 for the pair...

as you know they are small tuchel connectors.

one mic was sold as having a buzzzzz sound, the other with no connector...


the buzzing one was wired incorrectly, and i sourced a replacement barrel for the other for free....so two mint 421n's literally cost me £107 :)

i love them.....actually used one for female vocals on a session a few weeks back

here's a few tracks





to op, sorry we stole your thread!!! lol
 
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I get pretty clear and crisp vocals. I use two cheap condenser mics, an Apex 415 and an AT 2020 to record in stereo into a computer program called Sonar 6 PE.

But I think any DAW will work well if you use pre-amps with your mics.

I use the Presonus Firebox (About $300.00) If I were you, I would borrow one from a friend and if it works, buy one.

HTH

Wig
 
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