Violin sound.

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Hi,

I've spent ages trying to get my violin to sound like other violins being played on YouTube videos but so far without success; I'm very aware as a novice this could be entirely my own fault but I've tried many settings/adjustments.



This is my best recording done yesterday morning. Lara's Theme played slowly.

Violin sound_0003.webp

My Tascam settings.

Violin sound_0004.webp

My Yamaha THR-10 amp.

Violin sound_0005.webp


My Line 6 relay.

Violin sound_0006.webp

And my Yamaha YEV-104

I hope my practice can play which explains better; I'm keen to learn and am now starting to learn how to read violin music scores. I'm new to recording etc and finding it difficult sorting out which control settings to use; any help would be most appreciated. I don't even know if I'm asking the right question.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
There are a couple if things. Electric violins always sound nothing like real ones - this sounds exactly like it should. Technically, you've just drowned it in reverb so it does sound a bit like you are down a cavern. I've been following a fella for years - Pete Hartley. He plays real and electric violins and his stuff is on spotify and the usual places plus weirder stuff on youtube. link here

Remember the sharps and flats thing? In this recording you have totally missed them. It is really strange hearing the piece played without them. I guess a failure of your system to cope with 12 notes, rather than the 8 you have used?

In recording terms - some reverb on solo violin is vital, but you went way overboard - but beware. Reducing the reverb will also reveal more of the stuff you don't quite hit. The critical area to improve is not really the technical side - but the playing. On any kind of fretless instrument you must get the intonation right, and the note lengths - oddly, the stuff we talked about that your system overlooks. It's also a waltz, so it must have that 123,123,123 feel. I'd not worry at all about the sound yet - it's pretty much what electric violins tend to sound like - if you listen to some of the Pete Harley stuff not on you tube, you'll hear that same basic sound. You have EQ and reverb as the only real tweaking adjustments. Just back the revern off a bit would be a good start - but identify those wrong notes and unlearn them.
 
Hi,

It's so kind and generous of you rob to spend so much time helping me; thank you. I take note of all what you tell me; it's the kind of help I need to get me on track. I'll knock the reverb back; I've been struggling with the amp and Tascam adjustments but by what you say I was getting near if it sounds like other electric violins apart from too much reverb.

Pete Hartley plays the violin beautifully at the wedding but I'm not at all keen on the blues he plays.

I've also taken your excellent advice in my other thread and am now starting to learn to read violin music. You referred to a keyboard and how using my own learning method I'm only using the white keys and not the black keys; yesterday I played around with my wife's Yamaha keyboard so now understand what you are trying to teach me; on top of this last night my wife and I watched a number of YouTube videos explaining sharps and flats on a violin; we've watched lots of Alison's videos but her explanation of sharps and flats took a bit of grasping; not Alison's fault just me not quite grasping it;



One video though I found I could understand and follow her instructions it being better for me; with your keyboard information in my head and having now had a go on a keyboard I found this video very easy to follow; just two different tutorials on the same subject both good in their own way;



I also tried sharps & flats on my Yamah violin it proving very interesting ideed; it's another important step for me to learn and as I'm familiar with playing Lara's Theme I'll stick with this for the time being and only play around with Amazing Grace just for interest; I've got the scores of both Lara's Theme and Amazing Grace and once again you are right in that Amazing Grace is a more difficult piece to play; I'll enlarge Lara's Theme score allowing me to see the notes easier and use this to start playing correctly now I'm aware of sharps & flats also using the correct score I should be able to learn note lengths; it's all starting to come together for me and I'm no longer a raw novice because I feel more at home now playing a violin.

Playing on the Yamaha keyboard I now noticed there are five pairs of keys without a black key between each pair.

I'll now study Lara's Theme score in greater depth; I've bought the two books kindly recommended to me by @Slouching Raymond and I think these will be of great help allowing me to sit and read without having to concentrate using a keyboard and staring at a monitor.

I've now got a great deal of information to try out so I need to spend more time practicing in the strudio less time on the computer; I'm also a member of other forums so I'll spend less time on these too; my days just disappear at an alarming pace; I've done the supermarket shopping this morning and was back home at 7 o'clock; retirement for me is life in the fast lane; however I managed a full time job is just a memory.

Thanks again rob; time now to use your advice.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
Music is a lot like maths - once you get it, everything makes sense. These patterns and the distance between notes is quite clever. One really interesting thing is to look at a keyboard and start on C. Go up 7, using the white and black notes. You will then be on G. repeat this 7 steps and you land on a different note each time - but suddenly you discover yourself back on the C!

Pete Hartleys youtube stuff is a bit strange - but on itunes and spotify - you'll find a huge amount of traditional stuff.
 
I work with Gina ( in the video below) in the country band I play with...I'll be practicing with her next week and I'll get te low down on what Pickup she's using in her fiddle...she's a bad ass and her fiddle sound and tone are awesome..
 
Hi,

Thanks rob; it seems every time I learn more the less I know; I don't have itunes or spotify but I did have a look at Pete Hartley's other videos on YouTube.

I'm nosy so just clicked on TAE's MP3's and played a number finding them interesting.

Will I ever get any peace; ever since adopting violin playing as an hobby its been more punishment than pleasure; I've suffered everything from storm damage to trees to subsidence to our rear extension. Yesterday morning I did the shopping very early thinking great I can get into the studio. I want to start learning to read music and play my violins from a music score. The copies I have of the original scores "Somewhere My Love" and "Amazing Grace" I find difficult to see when they are on the music stand so as I did when I made my own score I decided no problem just enlarge them which isn't a problem.

1668507667671.webp

This message totally messed up my day and I still haven't got rid of it. This appears when my Win 10 updates and it knocks my image vewer out; the last time it took ages of web browsing but going into "Services" the update had changed a setting from automatic to manual so following web instructions I reset to automatic which cleared the message now it's back after another update and this time refuses to clear; it's driving me mad having to keep "OpenWith" for each image. Life in general is driving me mad I can't move forward however hard I try and playing my violins is turning into a nightmare.

Here I am yet again with another problem to clear but once I clear this I'll only be on to the next problem; a full year so far of nothing but trouble and frustration; sorry for the moan but I can't concentrate on anything getting out of bed each day to problem after problem; I'm fully retired which is a huge joke.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
Hi,

Moaning didn't help but this did;

https://www.xnview.com/en/

Perhaps I can now enlarge the music sheets. I need to find my way around this site but using the mouse wheel on an image certainly works to resize the image and it sure is fast.

Somewhere my love 1.webp


Now I can see it. I've just done this to test the new site and now I'll resize the original score removing anything not needed whilst stacking an A4 page with enlargements. Here it's printed landscape but will still be big enough in portait for my needs. Whatever I have to do I'll do in order to learn violin playing.

Quick edit; it never lets up;

1668514092930.webp


I can't even discuss gyroscopes and rockets by email with a friend; I wish this constant hassle would leave me alone.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
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This Lara's Theme is really peculiar. There are loads of different versions. Going to the original movie - Maurice Jarre did it in 3/4, 6/8 and 4/4 time. He even included Jazz, swing and rock and roll versions. Never known a well known tune to have all these variations.

Note for Colin - time signatures - the number of beats in a bar of music. Modern music tends to have 4, waltzes 3 and then others that have even odder versions. More reading for you!
 
Hi,

I thought I'd dumped the error message by installing xnview but it pops up to annoy me.

Thanks so much @TalismanRich for the Irfanview link; I used this site years ago but then changed my computer and forgot what the site was called so I've just loaded it and will soon find my way around although I think there will be lots of new differences; I've been using GIMP but it exports in a strange file causing hassle.

Thanks rob;

1668540211980.webp

This is the copy I have; I never tire of hearing it either sung or played; there are many YouTube versions; here's a favourite;



I must have added another version just using the keyboard white notes on my violin. :-)

Thanks for the additional information; I wish all the interruptions would leave me alone to spend time in the studio but I can dream on. I'm expecting the two books to arrive shortly as kindly recommended by @Slouching Raymond then I can start learning to read music; I've been fed up yesterday and today totally frustrated with silly problems.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
Hi Colin.
GIMP is great. I use it often. I also use an old copy of Paintshop Pro which has ceased to save jpg files correctly, due to microsoft withdrawing the essential DLL files from newer versions of windows. I save files as .png instead. Perhaps you can try saving different formats in GIMP.

There are good foundation topics described in the books. Some may appear advanced at first, but persevere.
When learning to sightread, the C major key is your best friend.
Then G major, with just one sharp is not too bad.
For many years, I would shy away from any piece with more than 3 sharps.
On guitar, I really don't like flats, and you may also find that on violin.
You can get the same note on different strings by moving up the fretboard, so you have to decide which position is appropriate while reading.
Then you have to decide which finger to use, bearing in mind what fingers you will need for other notes around it.
With flats, you can find that with the wrong choice of position and finger use, you have snookered yourself, by which time there is no time left to rethink your choices.

When I started trying to get my sight reading better, and also transfer that skill onto piano too, I thought hard about finding a way to get to grips
with ALL of the key signatures, involving up to 7 sharps or flats. I thought there must be an easy shortcut, without having to memorize all of the key signatures
and the complicated 'Circle of Fifths'. And there is.

Sharps and flats are layed down in a fixed order.
One sharp is added at a time to make a new key, in the order: F C G D A E B
One Flat is added at a time to make a new key, in the order: B E A D G C F
They are both exactly the same sequence, just starting from a different end.
You just need to memorize that simple sequence, and you have all the keys cracked.
The new sharp is always the 'leading note' which is the TE before the next DOH, so when you add an F# you get the key of G major.
With flats it is a bit different, but the pen-ultimate flat is the key. For example a key signature with flats B, E, A, and D, will be the key of A flat major.
That's my secret weapon. Just memorize the simple sequence F C G D A E B.
With that, you can generate the 'Circle of Fifths' diagram from your head.

Why do we have both sharps and flats?
Because if we only used sharps, we would end up having to use some sharp sharps. Each letter can only appear in a scale just once.
Sharps and flats can be white piano notes as well as black ones.

One more morsel Colin.
I've talked about major keys. C major is just all the piano white notes C D E F G A B C.
Every major key has a relative minor key, which is just the exact same notes but starting from a different letter.
The relative minor key of C major is A minor, using the piano white notes A B C D E F G A.

You have a lot to grappel with, but you'll get it.
 
The thing that really stretched my brain, but also my concert pianist friend too is the pedal steel guitar. To play these damn things you need to really get to grips with how chords are formed and how one can change to another with just one or two of the notes moving. All the pedal combinations that change the note of certain strings, but then the place you put the bar on the strings. It fries your brain. You can play a chord then find the same chord in multiple positions on the fret markers depending on your feet. Aaaagh. Raymond is quite right with his suggestions. What you need to do is move forward slowly. As soon as yo7 get comfy with your new ‘rules’ you move to the next set. Some people get really hung up by sharps and flats. Things like G sharp is the same note as A flat are hard for some, but then calling E F flat just sounds really wrong. Well written sheet music should make the music simple, or simpler to play. Sadly, some is just poorly constructed. There is a real art in making music look good and playable on paper.

my DAW of choice, Cubase, is still awful at scoring after 30 year nearly. It is accurate, but is often very difficult to play once you move away from simple note lengths.

Colin is very keen, but needs to progress gently. Fixing each issue as it arises.

I guess priorities should really be accuracy of pitch first. Then, accuracy of note lengths. Then you get into the cleverer stuff.
 
Hi,

WOW Raymond Thank you ever so much for taking the time to add this interesting and informative reply; I've copied it for future refference when the books you kindly suggested arrive; today hopefully then I can get stuck in and really start to learn. F C G D A E B learning these at least I'm now made aware of them; lots of helpful information goes over my head at the moment but also a lot sinks in; when I start to learn something new as I progress this kind of information suddenly makes a lot of sense but as you rightly say I've got a lot to grapple with; when I first started to practice playing it was as an interesting hobby but now it's become an interesting obssession.

Many thanks also rob for your additional information; reading what you describe regarding the pedal steel guitar really shows just how little I know; I can't at the moment see the end of the tunnel in fact I can't see the tunnel but I'm downright stubborn and won't quit now I've come this far. A good point you make about priorities too; I'm gearing up and need to back off just a bit because it's getting heavy; my priority today I got out of bed determined to get rid of the troublesome error message which I found extremely annoying and was prepared to sort this out first however long it took; I've posted on two other forums requesting help but without replies so as usual with my luck I've sorted it out the hard way being on the computer since after breakfast.

Before retiring I was subjected to an intense Kaizen training course it lasting a full week; applying this to the error problem I was chasing how to remove the error message and getting truly nowhere; I've now not only dumped the error message but dumped what was causing the message which still remains unknown to me; as usual once the answer is known its simple; I went into "Apps" finding defaults and how to set defaults; I've now installed "Irfanview" as default photo viewer; job sorted but I now know more about computers than I did; I've owned a computer for at least 23 years but still get caught out. The web & YouTube are full of suggestions as to how to clear error messages and it's very easy indeed to get hung up on these wasting lots of time; without my former training I'd still have the error message; I could have taken the computer to be sorted out but this doesn't go down well with me at all.

Here's just an example; one of many;

https://techcommunity.microsoft.com/t5/microsoft-teams/how-to-delete-the-error-message/m-p/2964249

All I wanted to do was to enlarge Lara's Theme music sheets allowing me to see them better and look at the trouble it's caused me just because Microsoft messed around with my computer; two frustrating days so as usual I sorted it out my own way.

I'll now enlarge the music sheets today and with luck the books should arrive then there will be another problem just waiting to bite me.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
Hi,

Being free this morning I wandered into the studio it being nice and cosy with the heating and lighting on; 15 minutes later turn everything off sick of the heavy rain pounding on the roof. GRRRR.

The books still haven't arrived no doubt because I'm looking forward to receiving them; My "The Strad" magazine and my wife's artist magazine of course arrive first; the post arrived a short while ago it being another begging letter.

I've now copied the original Lara's sheet music; at first it came out very poor so I spent a while playing around with DPI and changed from 300DPI to 600DPI making a huge difference; I then transferred to memory stick and now I can enlarge on the laptop in the studio; every bit helps. This morning I was playing around having the electronic tuner on with sharps & flats which was interesting but I've a great deal to learn.

Each time I want a bit of peace in the studio it's shattered; yesterday with perfect timing as I tried to play my violin our neighbours decided to patch their hut roof felt using hammer and nails; all summer the felt has had a section missing so it makes a lot of sense to wait until it's a wet cold day. I'm being selfish wanting a bit of peace.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
Hey Colin, you don't need peace and quite to practice. I've sat in the basement playing guitar while the neighbor cut his grass 10 ft from my window. There are nights when I sit and watch TV while I'm playing my guitar. Sometimes I get so into the playing that I just turn the TV off, and carry on with my practice.

The only time I worry about noise is if I'm trying to record something for real.

Heck, some people would probably say that I am the noise! :-)
 
Hi,

Many thanks @TalismanRich as you say I could play even with noise around me but it robs me of concentration; quite a while ao I played back a recording through the amplified monitors whilst I popped outside to check loudness; I could hardly hear it so I know I'm being considerate. As I say perhaps I'm being selfish wanting a bit of peace but what fun I have whilst acorns bounce onto the roof just above my head; pounding rain; magpies wearing clogs five of them; high wind and worst of all immediate neighbours waging war between husband and wife totally oblivious the neighbourhood can hear them; I've had a lifetime in industry and we moved here into a highly desired area into a detached bungalow but its seldom quiet. We used to sleep in the master bedroom overlooking the valley but our neighbours son directly across the street used to return home in his small van at around 2am his van having around 20 doors which he used to enjoy slamming. A bit of peace would be nice.

Our immediate waring neighbours have just had solar panels fitted to the roof of their detached bungalow; this afternoon as expected the solar panel rep was ringing our bell; actually a very decent guy and I explained politely the only thing we want on our roof is the chimney. I've said before at work I was in charge of three departments hence three offices with five phones between them and I also was tormented with a pager; sometimes three pagers if colleagues were off site. Am I expecting too much wanting a bit of peace in retirement. :listeningmusic:

Kind regards, Colin.
 
Retired said:
Am I expecting too much wanting a bit of peace in retirement. :listeningmusic:

Kind regards, Colin.
Click to expand...
Wait a minute. I think you've found the answer right there at the end of your message. HEADPHONES!

I've had a few people tell me that I should sell my house and just move into a condo. No more maintenance, painting, grass cutting, driveway sealing or other foolishness. Frankly, I don't want to live in a building with walls in common with neighbors. I'll stay in my home as long as I am able. I don't disturb them, they don't disturb me.
 
I live in a house that should be nice and quiet - and my studio is inaudible outside. I have a neighbour who buys nice cars, then removes the exhaust system and replaces one that breaks strategic arms limitation levels - He takes his dog to a nearby park at 06:15 Monday to Saturday and returns at 06:35. He then goes to work at 06:40. Every day. There is a new law being used here. Anti-social behaviour order. Somebody complained to the Police and they did the paperwork. Then a totally separate person complained. This triggered the ASBO - they visited and told him that if he did it again, then the car, and any other cars he owns could be seized and crushed. We have had peace now for at least a month. It's a great tool - this could apply to late night/early morning van door slamming. Worth talking to the Police. As long as multiple people have the same issues, it works. It won't work for just one complainant.
 
Hi,

Thanks @TalismanRich Headphones are an excellent Idea and I've already got some good quality ones; I've tried using them but found the cable a bit of a nuisance; I also had the cable from the violin to amp as well; I stopped using the phones and also bought a Line 6 Relay but this also has a cable although short; I'm considering selling the relay to replace it with the wireless type; I need to look into this but as I've often said every time I want to get into the studio something pulls me away. This morning; Morrison's; surgery; Aldi and Home bargains already visited and home by 8:30.

I've jumped on the forum to reply because next this morning is hospital appointment at 11 o'clock (not for me) only about 6 miles away but quicker by helicopter hence lots more wasted time; sorry for my constant moaning but I can't seem to get control of my life and the harder I try the worse it gets; after dinner?

It would be a nightmare to move into a home where there are neighbours the other side of walls or even on the ceiling; we've had neighbours who have moved into apartments; posh name for prison; they haven't lasted long; my friend describes appartments as "God's waiting room" which sums them up very well indeed. Like you my wife and I will remain here in our wonderful detached random stone built bungalow for as long as possible having spent the last 35 years virtually rebuilding it.

Thanks rob; neighbours can be a real pain; I've absolutely no problem at all with neighbours making any amount of noise whilst improving their homes or carrying out maintenance; it's the neighbours who don't care about anyone other than themselves often breaking the law riding noisy motorcycles at speed along the street wearing no helmet whilst the bike is untaxed and uninsured.

For 30 years we tolerated the immediate neighbours the other side who really are nasty; it started from the day we moved in; former owners of our bungalow were old ladies and these neighbours used our gardens as if they owned them; once I stood up to them the trouble started; as I say 30 years; they still thought they owned our site telling us what to do and generally interfering with our lives; as their kids grew up they went onto things like car theft and drugs; one of the sons burgled the bungalow next door to them; they pulled a young guy who was courting a neighbours daughter out of his car and beat him up.

Constant complaints about OUR trees and hedges blocking light out; over the years I felled 8 big trees and removed our 88' long conifer hedge now the mad wife complained "It's too open" I could be talking to her one minute reasonably friendly then next minute she said she'd take action against me; when I erected the new fence having removed the conifer hedge she accused me of stealing land and would take action against me then immediately having threatened me wanted to remove our side hedge build a low wall and add a fence this to be built on OUR land; we've got idiots to three sides. The final straw was when after more complaints about our big mature holly tree dropping berries onto their patio I took the tree down; I couldn't go round to gain access to the big stump from their side so I struggles and got the thing out; I was then laying paving flags for a hut base; I'd been using mortar and was then cleaning the tools at our garage entrance; she came to me accusing me of damaging her wall demanding I accompany her to look at it; I politely refused so her voice got louder and angrier at this point I fled into the garage and closed the doors; now she was yelling at the top of her voice whilst banging on the door safety glass saying I'm going up to see your wife; I opened the door and quickly squeezed past saying no you aren't because I'm getting the police in. As my wife and I were leaving this neighbour was part way up her rear garden yelling at us.

A police officer arrived and boy he was good; I think he must have been reading the arrest records from this family; he listened to what we told him and he replied he didn't mean any offence but people of our age seldom involve police putting up with all kinds of nasty neighbours; he went round and told this mad neighbour if we reported her again she would be arrested for harrassment and he left us with formal police sheets to fill in if anything else occured; a couple of weeks later as I was erectring the hut the equally nasty husband came up to the boundary demanding I trim overhanging branches from our willow tree; I politely declined saying if he wanted them trimming he could do it at his own cost; he tried to bully me so I said I don't have to trim them or pay for them and if you do decide to trim them you've got my permission to dispose of the debris; he then asked how I knew to which I replied go online and look at the regulations; he then departed; later his son was up the tree doing the trimming.

Thanks for your information rob; bad neighbours are horrible; my wife and I are a very quite couple always doing our best to be good neighbours. The police officer suggested we install CCTV so we spent £1,800 having high end cameras installed; this has also helped a great deal; all I want is a bit of peace to call my own to spend time in the studio.

This morning I'll get a bit of peace whilst waiting in the hospital; I take along a copy of "The Strad" magazine to read.

Got to go no time to spare because I'm retired.

Kind regards, Colin.
 
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