vf160ex vs. aw1600

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slide_blues

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Tough choice on these two DAWs, I've been searching and reading threads for days.

The aw obviously costs more, and you get compression and 4 band parametic eq on each channel. The downside is the paired stereo tracks, which you must find a way to use without compromising the mix. The vf's 16 independent channels and faders eliminate this problem.

Since this is a Fostex board, can you help me decide by answering these questions? Thanks.

1. How do you get around the limitations of the eq on the vf? Outboard eq? Mix only on a PC instead? It just seems so handy to have what the aw has (independent 4 band para on each channel) - then you can hear how tracks blend with each other and react to eq during mixdown.

2. What about compression on each channel? It seems it would be handy to be able to compress each track independently rather than the mix as a whole?

Anyway, those seem to be the major differences between these two. One benefit of going with the Fostex is that I'm used to the way things work as I have a VF80 now.
 
The EQs are all independent and the compressor, I believe, can be assigned to some channels independently. I think 2 or 4 at a time(I can't remember) and it has inserts for a compressor on the 2 XLR inputs.
 
Thanks Zeeb,

I should have mentioned that the vf's low eq is the main problem (only a shelving eq from 400hz on down).

Is that a big problem for you vf160 users, and if so, how do you "get around" the problem?

If I wanted a slight boost at 100hz, and a cut at 350, that's not happening without an outboard eq, correct?

Perhaps the cost savings of the vf vs. the yamaha would cover an outboard parametric eq...then one could run a track through the outboard eq, then on to another channel?

Sorry if I'm overthinking this, just trying to figure out the best way to go.
 
I didn't think the EQ's were a big problem as much as the overall dynamic range. I used to use a Berhinger Ultrafex or BBE Sonic Maximizer to master on to an external CDRW. The vf is nice for live recordings with an ADAT adaptor, though. Then it will record 16 tracks at once.

That Aux out is best for using a mixer to master. And you can use the individual compressor on any channel, just not at the same time as the eq.
 
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The low eq sucks on the VF. But you can tweek it with some boosting of the mid and adjust the q. Then cut the low's.

I do all my tracking on one of my 2 VF160's. (I love them).
I only do rough mixes on the VF160's.
I transfer every thing to the PC via CD to mix.

I think the VF160 the best all in 1 box out.
For less than a grand you can record 16 tracks at once.
You can only do 8 at a time on the AW1600.

The FX's on the fostex are usable. I never use the compression on the fostex.
 
Thanks guys, looks like you're playing to the strengths of the VF, and going to PC for the mixing and/or mastering.

Still a tough choice for someone like me who only does occassional band recordings, mostly stuff at home (acoustic, drum machine, etc.) - all of this is just for fun. I've got a decent PC but it's not set up for audio, plus it's the family PC that's upstairs away from all my music stuff.

The "all in one box" seems to be the way to go at this point in time, otherwise it's a lot more money for a laptop setup. I need portability for recording my band...at least for tracking anyway.
 
Why not consider a used aw4416?You would get a lot more bang for
the buck.
Here is a link to a used aw4416 in mint condition for about the same
price as a aw1600 new.
http://www.analogjapan.com/yamaha1.html
I've seen some good deals on ebay as well.
 
If you are looking for portability for "live" band recording, the VF is the way to go. You will need a light pipe to record 16 at once though. Behringer has the ADA8000 which I haven't bought yet, but there are quite a few posts that rave about the ADA8000 because of it's bang for the buck (about $200.00). Musicians Friend had an all in one package, (VF160 EX, PB 0.5 monitors, 4 cables, 2 condensers, 2 stands, headphones and a 50 pack of cd's) for $1099.99. You can't beat that deal. Not sure if they are still running that deal, though. I should mention that I have had great success with my VF. I do use external compression, eq and effects but the VF's effects are not bad.
 
this won't help you much, but i got a used vf16 for like $300 and just mix everything on my computer transferring it via lightpipe. i can't imagine how unpleasant it would be to try to mix everything on that little machine.
 
Interesting that you should ask this question at this time. I was asking myself the same question before Christmas: I own a VF but should I buy a AW1600?. I have owned/used a VF160 for about 2 & 1/2 years, having had a VF16 for about the same time before that. I like it cos it's simple and solid, but there are some snags: limited Compression, limited EQ, no separate inputs on mixdown and the on-board effects are not good. This last point wouldn't matter so much if it wasn't for the problem with the Aux outs. They are out of phase with the main outputs, which can cause artifacts if you use them with external effects (I use a Microverb and a Lexicon MPX200 - the Lex particularly suffers from the phase prob.). Because of the external effects problem I tried to go the VF record/PC mix route - but that's an extra level of messing about which would not be required if I had better EQ/Effects/Compression built in to the box.
Well, over the holidays I decided to go for it and I bought the AW1600. And I think it is a better machine. Yes it has some limitations, like a max 8 at once inputs (actually I think that could be ten under certain circumstances), and some tracks are tied to stereo pairing. Neither of these is a problem for me, in fact I imported all my old VF programs and the track pairing caused no difficulties. I tend to use a lot a track pairing anyway: drums, keyboards, electric guitars. On the other hand on the AW1600 I've got a bigger hard drive, 8 phantom powered xlr inputs, a HiZ guitar input, 24 bit option, USB connectivity (MIDI and file transfer) and a Pitch-fix mode.
Basically I've got what will be in the next generation Fostex VF. My VF cost me £650 (GBP) the AW cost £735 (GBP). I think it's worth the money.

Orc
 
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