VF160 phantom power

  • Thread starter Thread starter thevirus5085
  • Start date Start date
T

thevirus5085

New member
I was talking to someone who said that I will need a preamp to power the condeser mics where as I thought that the VF160 phantom power would take care of that. Can someone please help me out.... I dont want to buy a new mic and not be able to use it till i get the money to buy the pre.
thanks
-Conor-
 
You're all set with the VF160, both in terms of preamps and phantom power. You'll need to plug your mic's XLR connector into the appropriate XLR input to use the phantom power. Most, if not all condensors require the 48V phantom that your recorder has. Make sure you turn the phantom on after plugging in the mic and make sure you turn it off when you're through recording, and before pulling the mic out...

The phantom power could damage a device plugged into the XLR input that doesn't need it.

Dynamic mikes don't need phantom power, but you can use 1/4 plugs on these and use any number of inputs on your machine.
 
This turning on/off thing...

Assuming I don't ever plug anything into the XLR slot other than my condenser mic am I OK to leave phantom power on permanently. I think its a bit fiddly to turn off on the vf160 don't you have to go into the sertup or something?

If I turn on the p[hatom power with the condenser already plugged in what could/would happen?
 
Re: This turning on/off thing...

glynb said:
Assuming I don't ever plug anything into the XLR slot other than my condenser mic am I OK to leave phantom power on permanently. I think its a bit fiddly to turn off on the vf160 don't you have to go into the sertup or something?

If I turn on the p[hatom power with the condenser already plugged in what could/would happen?
Click to expand...

My hunch is you should turn off the phantom power when not actually needed, and the switch may be on the back, not in the set-up menu?? I think.

Phantom should NOT hurt anything plugged into the 1/4 inch, and there are those who say it won't hurt dynamic mics plugged into the XLR, but why take the chance? Plus, I don't think it's a good idea to have the VF160 constantly supplying 48V for no reason. This last point may be irrelevant... But even so, it should be a flick of the switch to turn it off. (Even in set-up, it would be easy)

But I'm not an electrical engineer, so i could be mistaken.
 
Remebring is the thing.

Yeh, I suppose it would be easy to turn off in setup (Idon't remember seeing any physical switches BTW, but i haven't really searched for them yet not having my condenser mic yet). It's just the remebering to do it thing, when I've finished a recording session it's late and I'm tired and turning off the phantom power is bound to be forgpotten. it only needs to be forgotten once, IF damage can occur.
 
Re: Remebring is the thing.

glynb said:
Yeh, I suppose it would be easy to turn off in setup (Idon't remember seeing any physical switches BTW, but i haven't really searched for them yet not having my condenser mic yet).
Click to expand...

You are right... The Phantom on your machine is turned on and off through the Setup mode... With a condensor, should you decide to get one, you definitely want to plug in the mic first before putting on the Phantom, then turn the phantom off before unplugging the mic. Some people recommened letting the mic power up for a minute or two after the phantom has been turned on.
 
Right, so let's check...

1. Mic unplugged
2. Turn on phantom power
3. plug mic in and record
4. Finish recording, unplug mic
5. Turn off phantom power
6. Turn off vf160

Right, I think I've got it.

Shame, I was hoping to leave the Condenser permanently plugged in to channel 8 on the vf160 and the phantom power on, but it looks like that is a no no.

Thanks for the advice, you may have saved the life of an expensive mic!
 
You're kidding, right?

glynb said:
1. Mic unplugged
2. Turn on phantom power
3. plug mic in and record
4. Finish recording, unplug mic
5. Turn off phantom power
6. Turn off vf160

Right, I think I've got it.

Shame, I was hoping to leave the Condenser permanently plugged in to channel 8 on the vf160 and the phantom power on, but it looks like that is a no no.

Thanks for the advice, you may have saved the life of an expensive mic!
Click to expand...

You're kidding, right? Please say yes.
 
No need for sarcasm!!

The phantom power IS easily turned on and off in the setup and I noticed a nice little LED which indicates when phantom power is on, very nice.

Took delivery of my first ever condenser mic last night and had a little play with it. Early days yet and I have to figure out which 'pattern' will give the best results for my situation and voice (uni or figure of 8 pattern?). Tried experimenting with the foam rubber thing on and off, decided I prefer it off as it sounds clearer.

I was a bit disapointed that I still need to twist the input gain on the vf160 right up to 80% of maximum in order to get a hot signal, which is alsmost the same as the sm58 where I had to boost it to 95%. I would have thought that with phantom power it would have boosted the signal more so I needed less gain, but apparently not.

One nice thing is that I don't seem to need to compress my voice now in order to get a nice even signal, whereas I did with the sm58. But maybe my view on that will change as I learn how to use the condenser better in the coming weeks. Sounded nice and crisp on acoustic guitar too.
 
I wasn't being sarcastic, just concerned for your condensor. Plug in your condensor BEFORE switching on the phantom. Turn the phantom off BEFORE unplugging the mic. Also, most condensors don't seem to like being out all the time. They are very susceptible to dust and humidity. If your environment is very dry, then at least put a plastic bag over the mic when not in use. The rubber foam thingy is really only for outdoor use as a windscreen. It is not meant for regular use, as it will cut down on some frequencies. What you probably should use is a pop-shield for vocals. It's a wire frame that has nylon stretched across. You put this in front of the mic to block the popping p's we all tend to make.

What mic did you get? Its sensitivity will impact how much gain you need to apply. Not all are the same. I would also think it'd be quieter than your Shure. Hope you like it.
 
And the reason for doing it the way Bill outlined is so the mic gets a clean on and off - otherwise a connnection can be made and broken as pins meet sockets.

(By the way I've just got back from a fantastic holiday if anybody's interested:) :) )
 
haha this thread has 3 or 4 seprate topics in itself.....
its amazing....
 
Week in the sun on a Greek island. 28 degrees every day, 4 hours of tennis daily and the deal included unlimited wine!! Bit hard to adjust to Autumnal London.

By the way I've got the AW16G - convinced I made the right choice. We start to track our album (:eek: ) on it in a couple of weeks.
 
I got this one...

billisa said:

What mic did you get? Its sensitivity will impact how much gain you need to apply. Not all are the same. I would also think it'd be quieter than your Shure. Hope you like it.
Click to expand...

http://www.red5audio.com/acatalog/Condensor_Mics.html

The RV10 large diaphragm model. Seems OK so far, used it again over the weekend.

Regarding the plug it in before phantom thing...Oh sh#t!!! I did the exact opposite of what you said! I turned on phantom power THEN plugged the mic in ;-( Doesn't seem to have harmed it though.

You see I thought if the mic is plugged in THEN you turn on phantom power it would send a power surge through the mic and might damage it. Obviousloy this is not as bad as plugging in the mic to a socket where phantom power is already enabled?

One good thing about the fostex vf160 is that you have to turn on phantom power for every session, it is automaticaly turned off when you power down.
 
glyn, you'll get away with it 99% of the time, but Bill's way is the right one.

By the way, if you put a little sign on your condensor saying "Warning - 48,000 millivolts" it stops female singers from messing around with them:D

(Bill it was Kos)
 
This is useful info for me .
Have just bought an Audio Technica AT4033 mic.
Got it to work but am using ain a bedroom so it picks up all ambient noise . Will dampening the room by hanging blankets and such on wall help ?
How far from source should the mic be > I want it for acoustic guitar . Then also for vocals . I have tried using the compressor on the Fostex but that just amplifies the whole room's noise . Would I be better with a seperate mic pre-amp/comp/limiter etc such as a Behringer ?
It also seems very loud, so that when trying vocals it sometimes over peaks . Any advice would be gratefully received (esecially on what sort of settings to use on the compressor - attack, ratio etc etc )
 
brian trousers said:
This is useful info for me .
Have just bought an Audio Technica AT4033 mic.
Got it to work but am using ain a bedroom so it picks up all ambient noise . Will dampening the room by hanging blankets and such on wall help ?
How far from source should the mic be > I want it for acoustic guitar . Then also for vocals . I have tried using the compressor on the Fostex but that just amplifies the whole room's noise . Would I be better with a seperate mic pre-amp/comp/limiter etc such as a Behringer ?
It also seems very loud, so that when trying vocals it sometimes over peaks . Any advice would be gratefully received (esecially on what sort of settings to use on the compressor - attack, ratio etc etc )
Click to expand...

Yes, dampening the room with heavy balnkets will help. The heavier, the better. Try placing your mic a few frets above the sound hole and 12 inches from the guitar... then go from there, in, out, etc. Vocals -- get a pop filter, and place the vocalist about 6-10 inches away from the mic.

Compressor depending on how they are set will try to boost silent parts thus pulling in ambient noise. Others can say how to avoid this...

In terms of loudness, you do want a good strong signal going into the machine, but you need to turn the trim knob counterclockwise until the peak lights no longer flash, otherwise you'll get distortion. Make sure you're not judging loudness by your headphone volume setting. Use the meters as your guide. You may simply need to turn down your headphones, or speakers.

Try recording clean, without the compressor, jusat to get a sense of what things can/should sound like. I personally try to avoid any processing unless it's really needed.
 
Brian

Killing the ambient noise as you describe is the best answer; generally getting the sound right before it hits the kit is 90% of successful recording. However if that doesn't work, and of course you're stuck with the room you've got, knowing about an expander might be useful.

An expander is like a compressor in reverse; instead of reducing sound levels above a certain threshold, it reduces anything below a certain level. Thus it cuts down on the ambient noise in the parts when you are not singing/playing. The extreme version is a gate, which simply cuts out any sound which doesn't reach the threshold you set, but these can have rather a brutal effect.

You might want to think about a Behri Composer, which is a two channel compressor with, in the latest models, a separate expander/gate function also on each channel. They're very common and you will get a used one for a few tens of dollars. (It's definitely not pro gear but it's good for learning.) If you put it between your Fostex outputs and your amp, you can experiment to your heart's content with the playback. It's much more flexible than the onboard Fostex comp and you don't need to mess around with mixdown etc.

Once you've found some settings you like, you might want to use it on the input signal instead, which has the advantage that you can record at a higher sound level without danger of clipping. You would need to get a separate pre-amp however.

Have fun:)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top