Using SPDIF input on Mbox2

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Dave Holliday

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Hi
Does anyone know if its possible to use the SPDIF input on Mbox2 to record an analogue mic/line source by using a mixer or preamps with SPDIF output? I would really like to able to get 4 discrete tracks recording simultaneously in ProTools - say three mics and one guitar. Any ideas anyone?
Dave H
 
The short answer is- yes. It should be no problem. Mbox2 supports 4 simultaneous inputs, 2 analog and 2 digital.-Richie
 
Last edited:
Yes it is. I run SPDIF from my mixer and analogue at the same time for 4 discrete inputs (Left/Right channels mono each).
 
tlennon1 said:
Yes it is. I run SPDIF from my mixer and analogue at the same time for 4 discrete inputs (Left/Right channels mono each).
Click to expand...

That's great! So any recommendations for a suitable mixer? Hopefully not too pricey.

Dave H
 
Yo Dave! Here's a mildly radical solution. There aren't that many inexpensive digital mixers out there, and increasingly, they are intended to go direct to the computer by USB, but you need S/PDIF. There are some pretty good dual preamps with S/PDIF out, (I use Joemeek twinQ, but that's an $800 or-so box). I was stuck at one time with a similar problem, and I used this:

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=41360&Category=Audio_Processors

or actually, I used its predecessor, the M300, which can be found used for real cheap. S/PDIF only transmits 2 simultaneous signals, so you really only need 2 channels. Even if you do use a mixer, all of your inputs will be bussed to 2 channels out anyway. With the M350, you can send 2 channels to the line ins, hit the bypass button, which takes all of the FX out of the signal chain, and sends it by S/PDIF out. That way, you can use any preamp or any mixer you want to. With AD-DA delay of less than one millisecond, it's at least as fast as any digital mixer or preamp you could possibly afford, *and* it's not a bad FX box. So if you happen to need a deesser, or slapback, delay, reverb, even rudimentary compression, you also get that. Hell, you are talking about mixer preamps anyway. You could combine this with a dirt cheap preamp, such as:

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=10658&Category=Audio_Processors

and get sound as good or better than most mixers. Or you could upgrade a little, and use it with:

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=10268&Category=Audio_Processors

and get *better* sound than most mixers. It could also be used with any preamp or mixer you have lying around. I have used the older M300 extensively in this role, and I know it works. Good luck. Minor issue- with analog input, it only puts out S/PDIF at 44.1 kHz, but that's entirely usable, and we *are* talking about very affordable units.-Richie
 
Richard Monroe said:
Yo Dave! Here's a mildly radical solution. There aren't that many inexpensive digital mixers out there, and increasingly, they are intended to go direct to the computer by USB, but you need S/PDIF. There are some pretty good dual preamps with S/PDIF out, (I use Joemeek twinQ, but that's an $800 or-so box). I was stuck at one time with a similar problem, and I used this:

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=41360&Category=Audio_Processors

or actually, I used its predecessor, the M300, which can be found used for real cheap. S/PDIF only transmits 2 simultaneous signals, so you really only need 2 channels. Even if you do use a mixer, all of your inputs will be bussed to 2 channels out anyway. With the M350, you can send 2 channels to the line ins, hit the bypass button, which takes all of the FX out of the signal chain, and sends it by S/PDIF out. That way, you can use any preamp or any mixer you want to. With AD-DA delay of less than one millisecond, it's at least as fast as any digital mixer or preamp you could possibly afford, *and* it's not a bad FX box. So if you happen to need a deesser, or slapback, delay, reverb, even rudimentary compression, you also get that. Hell, you are talking about mixer preamps anyway. You could combine this with a dirt cheap preamp, such as:

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=10658&Category=Audio_Processors

and get sound as good or better than most mixers. Or you could upgrade a little, and use it with:

http://www.8thstreet.com/product.asp?ProductCode=10268&Category=Audio_Processors

and get *better* sound than most mixers. It could also be used with any preamp or mixer you have lying around. I have used the older M300 extensively in this role, and I know it works. Good luck. Minor issue- with analog input, it only puts out S/PDIF at 44.1 kHz, but that's entirely usable, and we *are* talking about very affordable units.-Richie
Click to expand...

Hi Richard
Thanks for the really helpful and interesting reply. It wouldn't have occurred to me to use an FX unit to produce the S/PDIF signal but having looked at the prices of the alternatives in mixers I can really see your point. I'm in the UK and although there doesn't seem to be any used M300 units for sale at the moment one was sold on ebay here recently for less than half the price of a new M350.

Your suggestions raise quite a few other thoughts for me though because I have been thinking about getting other equipment to improve the quality of my recordings. A separate preamp is one of the things I've thought of but I've heard (on other forums) that I'm unlikely to see much improvement unless I spend a great deal of money because the preamps in the Mbox2 are pretty good anyway. Obviously I will need a preamp to power the extra input signals I want but will is it worth spending the extra for the better unit? I've also thought about an outboard effects unit. I currently use the plugins provided with in Protools LE package and I've no idea how much difference a unit like the M300 would make but I am a musician and happier fiddling with knobs than computer menus. Does the M350 offer much advantage compared to the 300?

Thanks again for your help and any thoughts on the above would be appreciated.

Dave H.
 
As far as I know, the M350 is almost the same box as M300, but I've never used it, so there may be advantages I don't know of. As far as better preamps, of course there is improvement, but as in car racing, 90% of the money goes for the last 10% of performance. You may only notice the difference if you spend quite a bit of money. If you're in the mood to spend money on a S/PDIF preamp, I like the Joemeek twinQ. It's not a Pendulum or Avalon, but it isn't $1500 per channel, either.-Richie
 
Richard Monroe said:
As far as I know, the M350 is almost the same box as M300, but I've never used it, so there may be advantages I don't know of. As far as better preamps, of course there is improvement, but as in car racing, 90% of the money goes for the last 10% of performance. You may only notice the difference if you spend quite a bit of money. If you're in the mood to spend money on a S/PDIF preamp, I like the Joemeek twinQ. It's not a Pendulum or Avalon, but it isn't $1500 per channel, either.-Richie
Click to expand...

Hi Richie
Thanks for your help and advice. My budget won't stretch that far I'm afraid but I am going to look for an effects unit with S/PDIF output as you suggest. I believe I'm correct in saying that some Lexicon units inluding the MPX 100 and MPX 1 have S/PDIF outputs as well and these seem easier to find. I'll probably go for a cheap preamp. the audiobuddy looks good to me although I know the ART Tube MP is a popular cheap pre, any opinion on that? When I've got everthing (hopefully) running I'll post again with the results because there must be a lot of people like me struggling with only two inputs on their Mbox2s etc.

Dave H.
 
I'm not a big fan of the Art MP. I prefer the M-Audio DMP-3. Failing in that, I've used the Audiobuddy, and it is about the same as the preamps in most mixers. The DMP-3 is a cut above all of the above. I would classify it as the cheapest 2 channel preamp that doesn't suck at all. Good luck-Richie
 
I've got the DMP3 and it works great! Def. lots of bang for very little buck.
 
Wow I have an old Lexicon MPX 100 sitting in my closet that I never use, it has SPDIF out and I have a mixer. I never in a million years would of figure out I could hook those two up and add two more channels to my Mbox2! I know what I am going to do this weekend!
 
Go Eric! Just one question. I'm not as familiar with the Lexicon unit as I am with TC Electronics. Does the Lexicon have a bypass switch on it to bypass the effects? If it does, that's a plus. No reason why it shoudn't work. The mixer is the preamp, and the Lexicon is the converter. For years, I think the best dirt cheap A-D D-A converter has been a cheap FX box. Project studios, and the shortage of gear cause us all to use pieces of equipment in ways the designers probably didn't expect.-Richie
 
Yes the Lexicon has a bypass switch but it does only have on Spidf out which makes me wonder if its a mono and not a stereo out, I will have to play with it once I have some spidf cables.
 
S/PDIF transmits 2 channels with one RCA cable. You're fine.-Richie
 
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