Unfavourite frequencies

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gecko zzed

gecko zzed

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Whether I am recording or doing live mixing, and no matter what gear I am using, there are always three frequency ranges that I find unpleasant.

They are: around 160hz; around 320hz; and around 2.5khz.

I continually find myself wanting to knock these back.

I wonder whether anyone else has this experience, either with these frequencies or with others.

It is possible that it is a legacy of age-induced hearing loss.

The danger, of course, is that I am compensating for my own deficiencies and producing material that is poorly EQed, even though I find it acceptable.
 
Just the other day, my boss said, "You can never get rid of enough 8k for me!" :D

Those sound like frequencies I've cut back on. 400 Hz is also on my list. And subtractive eq can be more beneficial than additive a lot of the time.
 
MadAudio said:
Just the other day, my boss said, "You can never get rid of enough 8k for me!" :D

That's the old-timey sound approach ;) I kinda like it. It's sort of like the crack cocaine of frequencies though, at least with a Pultec :o

Those sound like frequencies I've cut back on. 400 Hz is also on my list. And subtractive eq can be more beneficial than additive a lot of the time.

Yeah, I've said it before, I'll say it again, I hate 3kHz. Hate hate hate it! Somewhere in the midrange there is often mud, but just as frequently I'll see holes at 1.5kHz. Midrange can be a minefield though. Too bad it's so freakin' important :(
 
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Actually, beleive it or not, the 2k range is where the ears start becoming most sensitive naturally. So what you are feeling is quite normal. Assuming that you aren't cutting glass with your mixes.

But another note, alot of important sonic information is also in this range. So I wouldn't nessessarly know about cutting freqs right away because my ears hurt. And beleive you me, anything that produces sound makes my ears hurt, litterally. I was diagnosed with hypersensitivty of the ears, so it makes it especially dangerous for me to sustain loud noises (Which why I can't do live).

For that I simply turn down my monitor gain for a second and really start to think about the draw backs of cutting if something is problematic. Especially in that range. In fact, this is about where your presence in vocals is found, added presence in distortion guitars, occasionally some punch in a kick drum is found here. It would be more afraid to mess up here than I would at the extreme high and low end.

At the same time, things that are "warm" in nature tend to ease up on 2k. So if I wanted to warm something up, my approach used to be subtractive, but I found a more effective and precise way of doing it. This is simply Bob katz ying/yang EQing technique which I had been aware of a few years before he mentioned it to me.

It basicly states that along the EQ spectrum, every frequency above the "absolute" middle has an equal and opposite frequency to sort of act as a counter balance.

So if you wanted to control the effect of what feels to be too much 2k, then you would maybe reduce that area slightly about 1 or 2 db and then raise 1 or 2 db on it's opposite end. I believe that's around the low mid respectively.

So in the end there's a less dramatic use of EQ and you're still able to retain the natural aspect of your sound. You're not resulting to huge dips and cuts that you would find in subtractive EQ (which has always been the problem in cheaply designed EQs, both digital and analog).


It just really comes down to ear traing and learning when and when not to be afraid to certain EQ situations. But to really do that well would mean to get a hold of good reference mixes *before* mastering. Cause I've definitly been a part of mixes that where painful to my ears when the guy was mixing and then it shows up on CD and radio and suddenly it dosn't hurt anymore.


Which always seems to prove my theory that good mastering engineers are a great mixing engineer's secret weapon.
 
LeeRosario said:
anything that produces sound makes my ears hurt, litterally.

Now if I could only explain this to the people who live with me...
 
Lee: Could you suggest some further reading on this (online reading preferred :) ).. Thanks for the great info...
 
peritus said:
Lee: Could you suggest some further reading on this (online reading preferred :) ).. Thanks for the great info...

Sure!


Well for starters Bob Katz's website (Digido.com) has some handy information that may or may not be found in his book (I highly suggest having it in your aresenal of personal reading).

But most of my source information was a combination of online medical journals (google search: the psychology of hearing, human anatomy, the human ear, etc), but mostly a pretty good access of books that my mother has in her medical practice.

Honestly, I still think the best thing is to hit the library on a day off and spend a few hours reading on the anatomy of the human hear and/or otherwise anything you can't find on the internet.

The internet is cool, but not as complete and exciting really as going through books on this kind of stuff. Same with radio history, radio technology. Basically anything my imagination can think of I can usually find at the library.

I hope that helps somewhat?! :)
 
I find that oftentimes I use a deesser around 4.5kHz on heavily distorted snares to take the edge off.
 
thanks for all the information.

i am pleased and relieved that i am not the only one who finds some frequencies unpleasant.

having said that, i note that in certain cases, they are too useful simply to apply global solutions. For example, I like the 2.5k range to highlight the clickiness in bass.

it is mainly on vocals where I find it most grating.
 
LeeRosario said:
Actually, beleive it or not, the 2k range is where the ears start becoming most sensitive naturally. So what you are feeling is quite normal. Assuming that you aren't cutting glass with your mixes.

Yes, it's where my kids like to scream :(

But another note, alot of important sonic information is also in this range. So I wouldn't nessessarly know about cutting freqs right away because my ears hurt. And beleive you me, anything that produces sound makes my ears hurt, litterally. I was diagnosed with hypersensitivty of the ears, so it makes it especially dangerous for me to sustain loud noises (Which why I can't do live).

It is, but the usual problem is that everything (in a bad mix) is there-kick, hat, vocals. The space should have been left for vocals, although even there 4kHz seems more important. It ends up too hot and thus painful.

I seem to have the same condition as you, topped often with tinnitus. Fun, isn't it? :(
 
mshilarious said:
I seem to have the same condition as you, topped often with tinnitus. Fun, isn't it? :(



tell me about it!


it's very scary to me. Like everytime I go to a show and I forget to wear ear plugs and I get back home half def, I seriously go into a nervous break down.

Like I'm not afraid to admit that I'll cry like a little girl if my ears are distroyed.

Like for example, I've been stuck in the house all week for this ringing in my right ear that resulted from taking too much bendryl for my allergies. So I called off all mixes I had due and ever since I stopped, it's been sorta getting better. I've been praying to like 5 different gods all week for it to be ok.


But you can imagine how incredibly horrifying it is every time you have to endure a tinnitus "scare". :eek:


Like when my ears are unaffected, they are radiant. Like I remember freaking out a producer I worked for in tampa cause I heard a specific "pop" in the middle of this dense mix. Pianos going off, symponies, then this ginormus pop (thats how it felt to me) right in the middle of it.


For an *hour* he couldn't find it until I made him solo out all the tracks. Then he's all like "what surgury did you have?! I want it!"


But if my ears are buzzing! There's just no way I can do it. :(
 
I did some quick reading on tinnitus... Could this be the cause for the quasi echo I hear when I'm focusing on a sound? Like if someone claps... I hear it repeating, half second or so intervals, for about 30 seconds or so... Then again, this is prolly more psychological I suppose...
 
peritus said:
I did some quick reading on tinnitus... Could this be the cause for the quasi echo I hear when I'm focusing on a sound? Like if someone claps... I hear it repeating, half second or so intervals, for about 30 seconds or so... Then again, this is prolly more psychological I suppose...



wow, yeah...I've never heard of that before. But then again, using your ears is a mental focus aside from thier physical state.
 
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