Trying Hard to Get Started with Purchases - Please Help - SO FRUSTRATED!

[Scotsworth]

Hey everyone,

So I have wanted to set up a recording studio for a while. I have poked around in posts here, reading the starter post. I purchased "home recording for musicians for dummies" have started reading it, have read up on MIDI technology...and I even have an exact idea of how I want my studio to be......

Here's my problem -- I have no idea what exactly I need to be buying. I am terrified of throwing money away by getting wrong components that simply don't work. I know exactly what type of studio I want, but it's scary and I really could use advice before I start spending hundreds of dollars.

What I would like to be able to do:

I would like to have a MIDI-heavy studio. I would like to use my keyboard, and a microphone, plugged into a midi controller (which is then plugged into the computer). I would like to have music software that gives me tons of midi sounds, as well as the ability to create beats on the computer. I understand that software exists to do this. I would also like the ability to sample tracks.

Obviously I would like to be able to record all of this.

What I have:

Dell Studio XPS 8100 Desktop (would link it but it won't let me). I bought it specifically for recording.

I also have a keyboard that is pretty old...it's a Yamaha though with a MIDI output. I understand that there is MIDI to USB, and MIDI to MIDI. This is why I know I need a MIDI controller, so I can go:

Piano-----(MIDI line)-----MIDI Controller---(MIDI to USB)---Computer
Microphone-----MIDI Controller---(MIDI to USB)---Computer

My Questions

What kind of MIDI controller do I need? I have searched at musician's friend and all the midi-controllers I see look like keyboards. In the book, the MIDI controllers I see are just boxes with lines in and out. What on earth should I be buying?

What cords do I need? I understand they have MIDI-USB and MIDI-MIDI...what are the best cords? Do I need a special cord to have the microphone plugged in?

What kind of software do I need? - I know there's recording software...I keep hearing all about Pro Tools. But I also would like to have some software for aforementioned midi sounds/ beat creation

Pretty much I feel like someone sitting in a sailboat with no wind to send me in any direction, so any advice would be greatly appreciated!

P.S. The type of music I would like to make is like...electronica/hip-hop/trip-hop/alternative

 

[kcearl]

OK stop...breathe


most midi controllers are just keyboards..they are only meant to control software

They do this through a normal usb cable that can also transmit midi...midi to midi is generally used when you want to attach or control hardware synths, as you will mainly be doing everything in the box i wouldnt worry about it

good controllers that ive experience with are m audios axiom and edirols PCR range...there are many more to suite any budget...separate drum pads, like an Akia MPD, are desirable but not essential as you can tap beats out with the keys, or controllers like the axiom have basic pads

You will need a separate audio interface, this basically replaces the soundcard in your desktop which is only meant for produce bleeps and blips not high quality audio..you will also want it if you want to add vocals or live instruments..this can be a standalone usb or firewire unit or a PCI card that sots into your PC...budget dictates which one you buy

It is also important that you spend on monitors and some room treatment...this can be expensive, buy what you can afford and get started..i have found that most monitors in the sub $500 range sound very similar to each other in their range..get out to a shop and see if you can here any difference and if theres a preference to your ears

Your actual workstation, a DAW, is something you need to try out to see which one has the best workflow for you...luckily nearly everyone offers a limited trial so get downloading and have a good play..

When it comes to electronica I find it hard to get past Ableton Live, Fruity Loops is also another popular with beat makers...but in truth most of the top software will do..you will also find that most controllers you buy come with a free version of a DAW to try out

dont be fooled by thinking pro tools is an industry standard..its the most popular but does nothing any of the others can


Software is a biggy...dont get hung up on collecting vsts..figure what you need and buy it..you dont need four moog emulations and three FM synths

DCAMs synth squad looks a good deal..never used it but read loads of good things

Lennardigitals Sylenth is awesome but more trance based

Tone 2 Gladiator is a great bread and butter synth that covers most electronic genres

then youve got Absynth (pads) FM8 (probably the best software synth to copy hardware)

Drums can be done in the software you buy...I also have idrum which is just plain enjoyment...NIs Battery is also popular, but in ableton theres a drum rack that you can load samples into..Wave Alchemy and Goldbaby have excellent samples


Thats tonnes to be going on...the most important thing is not to get hung up on equipment..there are loads of freebie software synths, drums and everything http://www.kvraudio.com/get.php ...and even if you are just using hi fi speakers the most important things is to get started



welcome to the site and what could end up being the third most enjoyable thing youve ever done (after football and beer but before sex and your bird lol)

 

[kcearl]

Forgot to say...Computer Music magazine is a great buy for any budding electronic musician..the DVD on the cover comes with tutorials and samples plus every issue has a load of free software and beginners guides on just about anything..its pricey in the US (its a UK mag) but no need to buy every issue...the walkthroughs inside are great as well and just watching how some of the pros make their tracks is interesting..chances are they will use the same software as you'll end up using

Ive been trying my hand at electronic music for a year or so know..if theres anything I can help with either stick it in here or PM me

 

[c7sus]

MIDI and audio are two seperate animals.

Many interfaces are available that combine both in one package.

Audio Interfaces | Sweetwater.com

As you can see there are literally hundreds of choices. They each have their own advantages and disadvantages. For a beginning home-reccor a good starting point may be a combo audio/MIDI interface that has built-in audio preamps and phantom power.

Yeah, you'll more than likely need a mic cable with XLR connectors. Any of the combo interfaces would accept a common 5-pin DIN MIDI cable, just like you would use from a MIDI keyboard to a synth module. The actual connection to the computer would be over USB, firewire, or a breakout box or cable for PCI-based cards.

MIDI over USB is fine, but audio over USB is probably less desirable than audio over firewire or a PCI card, IMHO, due to audio latency of USB.

For the actual recording software Reaper is a really good place to start. A lot of the interfaces available will come with a "lite" version of one software or another. The sound quality of all the biggest sellers/most popular are all relatively equivalent. The features and implementation/GUI are what sets them apart.

Reaper will record both MIDI and audio. I don't know if they have MIDI "instruments" available or not, but there are tons of freeware and shareware VST MIDI instruments out there, as well as commercial versions that run the gamut from sample-based to subtractive, additive, and granular synthesis. Prices, sound quality, features, and ease-of-use vary considerably. Or you could use a hardware synth module, like a Sound Canvas or JV-xxxx or whatever, and record the audio output of the module into your recording software via the audio inputs of the interface. The MIDI keyboard would trigger the samples in real time, or you could record the keyboard parts into the software, edit/quantize, and then play back the sequence and record the audio output from the synth module.

With VST instruments, your computer acts as the synth module, and when you want to "record" the audio of the sequence you usually use a function commonly called "bounce to tracks" and the software will render your MIDI sequence into a WAV in the audio track you select it to be.

You also need some way to monitor your playback so you can play along in time with your previously recorded tracks or a click track or metronome, so many interfaces also include a headphone output along with audio outputs that would go to your mixer or amp and then on to your speakers.

So you likely need a pair of headphones too.


Mics, well, that's a deep subject as they say. Dynamic mics don't need phantom or battery power to operate, but condensor mics do. Be advised that condensors are extremely sensitive, and most will pick up not only whatever is going on in your room, but also whatever is going on down the block if you have a window open. Seriously.

Among the most popular dynamic mics on this BBS are the ever-popular Shure SM-57's and SM-58's, Shure SM-7B, Electro-Voice RE-20, and Sennheiser MD-421.

I strongly recommend reading as much of the following thread as you can absorb, and revisit it frquently. Harvey Gerst has very graciously shared his lifetimes' worth of experience and knowledge for all of us coming along after. There is a wealth of information in this thread that you won't find assembled anywhere else, though it is difficult to sift through it all in the current format. Harvey has stated repeatedly he would like to edit and condense this information, and hopefully one day that will happen.

https://homerecording.com/bbs/equip...-polar-pattern-relate-mic-applications-27030/

And this thread too.

https://homerecording.com/bbs/equipment-forums/microphones/mics-under-$100-just-may-work-you-302579/



I personally have avoided Pro Tools because their market strategy has been to lock users into their hardware/software, although I understand that the last couple versions have allowed more open source/third-party compatability than in the past.

Hope this helps a bit, and good luck whichever way you decide to go.

 

[kcearl]

ya think we've covered it? lol

 

[Chili]

All I can say is "Wow". Someone actually read a little before posting, understood most of it, and heeded some good advice. Scotsworth, you are cool. I'm glad to see you don't want to jump in first with purchases and then ask questions. And trust me, I know what it's like to sit in a sailboat with no wind... 100 degrees and the beer is all gone. Eh, nevermind about that.

A few questions:

Do you want to record anything other than midi stuff? Like guitars or vocals? If so, you'll need an interface. Ah, just noticed you said microphone, so you will need an interface. Most come with midi ports, so you should consider those.
Will you be doing everything yourself? If so, most likely you will only need a 2-channel interface. USB interfaces will work fine.

For the midi stuff, you have several options: 1) Use the keyboard you have already; 2) Use VSTi's; ) Use a sound module.

You can use your current keyboard as a midi controller, though if it is older it may not have all the features of newer controllers. But, it will have its own patches which you might enjoy using. You rkeyboard can drive VSTi's which are software generated synths. They are computer programs and operate inside a host DAW program like Cubase. Most likely, this is what you will use. You could also get a sound module which your keyboard can control, but they do get expensive. Which software to get is up to you. I think Ableton Live is geared towards Electronica, et al. Also remember that most interfaces come with a lite form of a popular DAW program, like Cubase, Sonar, Ableton... so be sure to shop with that in mind.

Here's a list of Interfaces that will fit your needs:

USB Audio Interfaces | Sweetwater.com

You should start looking at around $100 and up. I think the Presonus AudioBox will fit your needs and it's only about $150.

You'll need a mic, headphones and monitors. Which mic to get is open for debate and is topic of many arguments and divorces. You can find some decent condensor mics for not a lot of money. It might come with a cable (XLR type and will plug into the Audiobox), if not, you'll need one. Don't forget the mic stand.

Here's a list of decently priced mics that might work well. You can also search for MXL mics at other online retailers.

Condenser Microphones | Sweetwater.com

DO NOT GET A USB MIC!!!!

Monitors?? You should do some searching in the forums for threads about monitor shopping.

Some retailers have package deals that combine the bare necessities to get you started, you might look into those. I think Musician's Friends does that.

hope this helps.

 

[Chili]

Man, it took me half an hour to write this and you two guys jump in there in minutes. Plus, you're both closer to the target than I was. lol.

 

[kcearl]

Man, it took me half an hour to write this and you two guys jump in there in minutes. Plus, you're both closer to the target than I was. lol.

lol...it was never gonna be a short answer was it? Im going for a lie down now

 

[c7sus]

Man, it took me half an hour to write this and you two guys jump in there in minutes. Plus, you're both closer to the target than I was. lol.

And I'm hung like a horse too!!!

 

[Scotsworth]

Thank you all SO MUCH. You've given me a lot to pour over and think about. It seems I had MIDI controller and Audio Interfaces confused, so thanks for clearing that up haha.

I've been frustrated because I have dozens and dozens of musical ideas and no real way to lay them down - with some direction, I think I can really start having some fun.

I'm sure I'll have more questions that will come up, so you'll be seeing me around!

 

[Chili]

The learning curve is steep and you probably won't get the results you're looking for at first. But stick with it and keep practicing and learning and soon enough, you will hear through a speaker what is in your head. I think electronica and such are much easier to get a decent mix with than an all audio tune. KCEarl puts out some very cool stuff and he started a little over a year ago.

Cool, have fun!!!

 

[kcearl]

yeah the jump from making a tune to making a good mix can be a big jump...but I havent had a eureka moment like that since the day I stopped falling snowboarding, theres only so much you can read/learn before experience has to take over..so start chucking them tunes out boy

PS: the MP3 clinic is your friend

 

[Harvey Gerst]

I strongly recommend reading as much of the following thread as you can absorb, and revisit it frequently. Harvey Gerst has very graciously shared his lifetimes' worth of experience and knowledge for all of us coming along after. There is a wealth of information in this thread that you won't find assembled anywhere else, though it is difficult to sift through it all in the current format. Harvey has stated repeatedly he would like to edit and condense this information, and hopefully one day that will happen.

https://homerecording.com/bbs/equip...-polar-pattern-relate-mic-applications-27030/

There's also a shorter version of that thread on my website, complete with the missing pictures, and sans all the "hoopla":

MIC_CHAT.PDF

And here's a correction to the first explanation of a dynamic mic:

From micguy:
OK, I quoted this because I've seen it one too many times, and it just plain bugs me at this point.

My objection to this "common wisdom" is that, in plain truth, it's plain wrong.

Dynamic mics are like little moving coil loudspeakers, yes, but... like moving coil loudspeakers, they have one primary resonance - not in the middle of their operating range, but at the bottom (typically 50 to 150Hz for a modern dynamic microphone). Above that bottom resonance, up to 5 to 10 KHz, they are remarkable linear devices that are NOT relying on resonances to work. Yes, at the very highest frequencies, there are peaks and dips on the curve, some due to housing diffraction (which is also present in large diameter condenser mics) and diaphragm breakup modes (which make more dips than peaks.

I know this is counter to common wisdom, but it's true - dynamic mics, though not perfect, do not rely on multiple resonances stacked on each other carefully (like a house of cards) to work. They're actually a little simpler (and hence more robust) than "common wisdom" implies.

My answer:
Well, yes and no, kinda, not exactly. Above the resonant peak (and up to where the diameter of the diaphragm equals 1/2 wavelength), the mic can be reasonably smooth. But the games that manufacturers play to get the resonant peak down to an acceptable level, and trying to extend the high end and low end is where the problems start.

Unfortunately, my ASCII drawing didn't allow for much detail to show the finer points, but the concept is still pretty valid for the extremes of the response curve. And the point that I was making is still pretty valid: A lot of it is done with smoke and mirrors.

I knew when I was writing this, that some of the analogies I made weren't perfectly accurate, but overall, the thread holds up pretty well as an introduction to microphones and why things aren't always as they seem to be. But you're right; I did paint a somewhat bleaker picture than necessary to get some attention.

micguy's response:
The resonant peak is indeed damped by things around it, but to a knowledgeable manufacturer (yes, I work for one), there's no real voodoo involved - it's mostly acoustical resistances that can be measured, modeled, etc. Extending the low frequency end isn't really ever done beyond the engineering of the diaphragm's mass and compliance - the low frequency limit is set by the main resonant frequency (the pistonic one of the coil and diaphragm mass on the spring of the diaphragm surround), and below that, it's a 12 dB per octave drop-off. At the high frequency end, managing diffraction is a large part of the job, and doing some extension with a resonator is a well established part of the art.
So there's a second intentional resonance (beyond the low frequency one) in a typical design - for a net of one at each end of the pass band. In most designs, any other resonances are things that are engineered out of the design, not intentionally put in, and for a reputable manufacturer, that means you won't see (or hear) them much, if at all.

Where some of the "chambers" actually come in is more in the area of polar pattern management - making the mic act as a cardioid over a wide range of frequencies. A typical cardioid mic will have front and rear entries that, left to their own devices, will tend to want to make the mic a bi-directional at some frequencies. A chamber behind the diaphragm is often used to bring in some "omni" component, and steer things towards a consistent cardioid pattern.