The Shures

[tkingen]

Hello,

I have the following mics:

Shure KSM44
Shure KSM32
Neumann KM184
Octava MC012 (pair)

The KSM44 is gorgeous on vocals, but I'm still looking for the ultimate acoustic guitar mic setup. I've tried mono and stereo micing with all the different configurations of the above mics, and still haven't been able to acheive the level of air and naturalness that I'm so desperately craving.

This leads to my question...anyone have working experience with the Shure KSM small diaphragm condensors? The KSM 109, 137 or 141. There are a few reviews available, but it's difficult to come to conclusions about a product when a reviewer tries something out for an hour, and then writes a magazine article about it. I'd like to hear opinions from someone who uses these mics consistently, or why they chose not to.

BTW, preamps are MAUDIO...Tampa and DMP3.

Thanks,
Terry Kingen

 

[musical5]

I have not tried the small diaphrams in the KSM series yet. I too am curious if the 109 has the same diaphram as the 141 with just less features? I have however tried the SM81 and it blows away the MK012 that I own. Whats wrong with the KM184 on the acoustic? I have used them with great success. Maybe the preamps you own are letting you down?



Justin

 

[tkingen]

Justin,

The KM184 is a great mic and I have gotten good recordings with it. However, it does impart it's sound...as most mics do. I'm looking for 3-dimensional transparency, if that makes any sense. In my experience, the Oktava's seem to be "wannabe" KM184's. The KSM44 sounds wonderfully realistic, and the 32 sounds unhyped, but that does raise the question of possible advantages with their small diaphragm cousins (109,137,141).
Also, as always, my mic technique may be lacking!
It's encouraging that your SM81 does a good job...that may be another option.

Thanks,
Terry Kingen

 

[musical5]

I think 3-dimensional transparency is a great phrase for the SM81. Its really quite flat and sounds great.



Justin

 

[StevenLindsey]

I'd say that if your reeeeeaaaaaaaly craving that sound, it's time to spend a couple of thousand on a preamp.

 

[tkingen]

Ouch...I was afraid talk would turn to expensive preamps!

 

[Michael Jones]

I have a pair of SM81's and I LOVE 'em!!
I use them on all things acoustic.

A really, really, really good pre-amp is essential though.
I run mine through either an API 312, or an Audix 35102.

 

[BradD]

The KM-184s should be able to give you a very nice acoustic sound with tons of depth. I use mine with the RNP and love them on acoustic. I'm saving up for the next level of pres (Great River, API, John Hardy) though.

 

[tkingen]

Thanks for all of your replies.
Since posting this, I've been able to experiement with the impedance matching on the Tampa pre. It seems to make quite a difference. If anyone is interested, please see the post titled "Impedance Matching".

Terry Kingen

 

[dwillis45]

In addition to preamps, you might want to think about the guitar itself, strings, your recording space, mic placement technique, effects (especially reverb and compression), and EQ. A great preamp and mic combo might be defeated if you don't have a decent guitar and fresh strings. What's a decent acoustic guitar? Well, that's another forum, but a hardcore acoustic player would tell you to spend as much on the guitar as the preamp!

If you close mic, room considerations might be less important, but it’s probably worth looking at the space you record in. Is it too dead? Is there a way to blend room sounds and the guitar? Also, spend a day experimenting with mic placement. Try it from above, from below, up the neck, at the 12th-14th fret, at the bridge, etc. In addition, I’ve found that I almost always add a touch of reverb to my acoustic and the improvement is dramatic. You can also do alot with EQ, especially the low end with larger guitars.

I record with a number of acoustic instruments (guitar, mandolin, banjo, acoustic bass guitar, dobro) and I’ve had decent success with the sm81 and an AT4050. I can also tell you that, of all these instruments, the acoustic guitar is the hardest to master. Even with good mics and a decent preamp, the acoustic has a mind of it’s own: Some days it likes to be recorded and some days it doesn’t! There are books and articles about micing the acoustic guitar, but it’s like micing a human voice: Each guitar has its own sound and sometimes you just have to experiment until you find the right combination of factors.

 

[ozraves]

Well, we reviewed the KSM141s and tried them out for nine months. www.mojopie.com/ksm141.html

They are very much a Rock 'n' Roll microphone like a lot of Shure products. They are very much in your face. I think they are my favorite mic on acoustic guitar. But, I would never put them up to capture acoustic guitar where I want a sense of space.

Steve
www.mojopie.com

 

[Michael Jones]

... But, I would never put them up to capture acoustic guitar where I want a sense of space.

Steve
www.mojopie.com

OK. I'll bite. What mic would you use to capture a "sense of space"?