Tell us a story!

[Frankie Rage]

Would any forum member who has had a song published and recorded professionally be interested in telling us your story. How, what, when, where, who, etc.

Or stories about trying to get songs published. I have one of these which I'll post later.

Fx

 

[Xdrummer]

I've been published and had songs placed in a few major studio films, a TV show (source music) and recorded by a couple of unknown artists. I do see some BMI checks each year for the film/TV work, but have seen nothing yet on the artist recordings. I also have created music for radio jingles, industrial training videos, music on hold and for a couple on local, independant films. I've done over 4,000 gigs and have logged many hours in the studio on both sides of the glass. Over the years I've accepted almost any writing/performing opportunity - often for little or no money - simply to gain experiance and build a resume.

There is no real "story" - like any dedicated writer, I've written for a long time and have studied songwriting and music theory. I've tirelessly tried to establish a network of "industry contacts" and have mailed out countless recordings to publishers, artists. producers, etc. - and I have a file drawer full of rejection letters to prove it

I read countless books on songwriting and publishing, have subscribed to everything from Billboard to various songwriter "tip sheets". Each year I purchase the Songwriter Market and am currently a member of BMI and NASI. I was previously a member of Taxi.

I own a collection of well over 3,000 records, tapes and CDs and I spend hours disecting songs.....always trying to improve as a writer (candidly, I'm a rather one dimentional type of person). I have taught myselff to play several instruments well enough to demo my songs and have worked on my vocals enough to cover most melody and harmony parts. I have invested more money in music related things than many people invest in a home.

Like most dedicated writers - I write not in hopes of making money................but simply because I could not live if I did not write. If I am not sleeping, eating or working a day job, I'm writing.

 

[Mart[1001]]

Wow...Interesting reading Xdrummer. I hope you get your big break soon my friend.

Mart.

 

[Frankie Rage]

Xdrummer, I salute you man that is one hell of a statement, and an inspiration...

I hear what you say about having to write. I went into a series of major day jobs (director level) but I couldn't stop writing in the car on the way to and from the office and appointments... (also in meetings sometimes!!!)

It's like sailors with the sea in their blood!!!

 

[Aaron Cheney]

My story is basically the same as Xdrummer's.

I've had many songs published, gotten many cut by indie artists, had some placed in films, won some songwriting contests. I've written and recorded jingles and earned money doing sessions as a guitarist. I've taught songwriting and music psychology/appreciation at a college level.

I write all the time. I write songs that are marketable. I've spent a lot of time learning what kinds of things will make a song appeal to an artist. I've read all the books (even written one), I've been to seminars, workshops, etc.

I've spent a ton of money having my songs professionally demoed, and later amassing the gear and knowledge to create pro demos myself.

I've also spent a lot of time nursing my bruised ego when things went wrong, learned how to take hard criticism, and learned how to ignore bad advice and be firm in my decisions when I'm sure they are right. I've grown thick skin. I've learned how to nurse my wounds and come back fighting.

I've learned that getting a cut, or a song in a film, or whatever, is really just a very small step, and the quality of your songs is only a very small component. Getting an honest-to-goodness money-making major-label cut is 50% song, 50% relationships, and 50% luck.

I've also learned that your best a song is a dangling carrot, always a step or two away. That's OK though....because success is the journey to the carrot.

Don't focus on writing masterpieces....just focus on writing. Every day. You only find quality in the midst of quantity.

 

[nzausrec]

Do you suggest for beginners that they try to place their stuff with Taxi or a publisher like that?
How did you both first get published?

 

[Frankie Rage]

Aaron, I am once agin humbled by the response to my request to 'tell us a story'. Immensely inspiring to read what you had to say!

A couple of points, I've added below, just my opinion, for what it is...

I've learned that getting a cut, or a song in a film, or whatever, is really just a very small step, and the quality of your songs is only a very small component. Getting an honest-to-goodness money-making major-label cut is 50% song, 50% relationships, and 50% luck.

Thanks, Aaron for this. Having been in Sales & Marketing myself for 20 years from rookie through to Sales Director selling high value goods/systems, I agree wholeheartedly that the product (SONG) is only a part of the picture. People buy from people. And you make your luck. How? Well, you need to be in the right place at the right time. The only way that works is either by being in a lot of different places at a lot of different times; and/or pure luck. Also, lots of competitors are about the place, and they have the same product as you (A GOOD SONG), just as good as yours, or not as good, but maybe they know someone and can get to his ears, belly, feed his snout; or whatever it takes to win. In selling (and songs have to be sold too...) the only goal is the profitable sale, the target is the sale, nothing else matters. If you don't believe that, don't go into professional selling!

I've also learned that your best a song is a dangling carrot, always a step or two away. That's OK though....because success is the journey to the carrot.

Don't focus on writing masterpieces....just focus on writing. Every day. You only find quality in the midst of quantity.

Agree 100%, as you'll see when I tell my story...

Thanks again, Aaron for the insight into your World. Man... <words fail me now...>

(Probably a good thing!)

Fx

 

[Frankie Rage]

Do you suggest for beginners that they try to place their stuff with Taxi or a publisher like that?
How did you both first get published?

Great questions! I'd love to hear the answers too...

 

[gecko zzed]

My story is sadly lacking in excitement.

I started playing guitar when I was about 16. I played anything I knew the chords to. I wrote hundreds of songs, all pretty mediocre.

I played in assorted bands for a while, mainly doing original material, but never had the perseverance or patience to push anything further.

In about 1971 I rocked up to Festival Records in Sydney with a demo (recorded live on two-track tape) done with a friend of mine. It was a 'concept' album: two sides of an LP of continuous, improvised material . . . not one song, but a series of songs linked together musically. I thought it was a neat idea, but it didn't fly.

In the early seventies I signed a contract with RCA on the basis of another demo (of about six songs). These were recorded on four-track reel-to-reel (Teac 3340), and mastered on a Revox. I remember that being the time when I started getting interested in the process of recording, rather than just recording. RCA released a single ("Think about tomorrow") which sold maybe a couple of hundred. That was it. I wasn't performing anywhere, and I earned about $3 from it.

Although I liked the thought of writing songs, and making and selling records, neither my heart nor my brain was really into it . . . I preferred dabbling in ideas. I moved away from Sydney and back to Tasmania, where I played in assorted bands, mostly doing covers. In 1988 I joined a band doing mostly traditional music (mainly Celtic, then Cajun and Zydeco, an unlikely, but actually fun and workable combination). This rekindled my interest in music creation and arrangement.

Around about the same time I worked for the government, and part of the job involved writing (system documentation, reports, etc.). I become interested in business language; or rather how content-free, cliche-ridden and jargon-filled most of it was. I spent a lot of time rewriting material so that it actually had meaning and could be understood.

This caused me to revisit literary writing. I ventured back into poetry, short stories and songs, using my experience from the business world to craft (what I considered were) much better efforts than I had in the past, now that I understood more about language.

I managed to get a few poems published, and the occasional song found its way onto a CD. I've entered a few song competitions, and done reasonably well, even winning one. I also won a jingle competition, but the firm went broke before they used it! I no longer actively pursued a literary or musical career, but enjoyed writing, composing, and most importantly recording. In the mid-nineties, when I shifted from 4-track cassette to a PC, I was like cat into the sardines. At last it became magnitudes easier to recreate what I heard in my head. Between 1997 and 2006 I recorded ten CDs of (mostly) my own material, and between 2006 and 2009 recordeed four and a half CDs (the fifth is a work-in-progress) with two musical collaboraters (we call ourselves the Defibrillators) doing our own arrangements of obscure songs, or songs we just like. At the same time I started doing live mixing, discovering that sitting behind a mixing desk was way more enjoyable than playing in front of one.

This process has sharpened my arranging and recording skills, and most of my time I now spend recording other people. In particular, I get special pleasure from taking their sometimes mundane material and transforming it into something way beyond their expectations.

You maybe can see now why I am always going on about cliches and stock phrases in lyrics, and why I am forever seeking movement in songs!

 

[Strat1958]

What a great story, GZ, thanks for sharing it.

 

[Xdrummer]

Do you suggest for beginners that they try to place their stuff with Taxi or a publisher like that?
How did you both first get published?

I was first published about 30 plus years ago - before law suits made people so afraid to accept unsolicited material, etc. At the time, it was simply a matter of making calls, knocking on doors and mailing our tapes (yes tapes - that was before CDs). Actually, the process has not changed that much....however, these days, it can be much harder to get people to accept outside material, there are way more artists who are self contained (write their own material) and there is waaaaaay more competition (in particular since anyone with a computer now can have a demo studio).

Regarding Taxi - They can be a stepping stone. I and a person I co-wrote with did get material forwarded to a publisher through Taxi and we went on to have a very good business relationship with that publisher (still do).

I must emphasize, that TAXI (at least based on my dealings with them) do look for specific material which they believe they can forward. When it comes to "songs" this often means well written songs which follow a relatively standard AABA type of "formula" with accessible lyrics..........or as some would call this "writing commercially".

Song writing can mean many things to many people - but to be a published writer (vs. an artist).....writing to a commerial formula is a reality and a necessary evil.

 

[Aaron Cheney]

Do you suggest for beginners that they try to place their stuff with Taxi or a publisher like that?
How did you both first get published?

Two things really went in to getting my first song published:

1) Having a song that was good enough - in both the quality of the writing and the quality of the demo.

2) Writing a lot of letters and mailing a lot of discs. I bought the "Songwriters Market" book and sent demos to every publisher I could find that would accept my stuff. Sheer numbers finally paid off.


What I would recommend to someone just starting out now is ..... unless you have interest from and access to a major publisher, self publish. In today's digital age most small publishers need you more than you need them.

Get your songs professionally demoed, and post them everywhere you can find; myspace, soundclick, reverbnation, etc. Start approaching indie bands to cut or perform your songs. Promote your songs yourself.

I have some great songs collecting dust on publisher's shelves. The publishers are no longer jazzed about them, and are just holding them so they can collect on the off-chance that anything ever comes of them. Lame.

Self-publish.

 

[Walter Tore]

I was raised with the old bluesmen that played live and when recording, would get songs published at that point. I kind of followed that path. I recorded a record in Belguim in the early 80's on the Konnexion label. It is a subsidiary of Muselium Records (sp?) which is a heavy metal label. Anyway, I make all my stuff as I go along, so the songs had to be written down after the recording and then registered with SABAM. I got a publishing company to do all that. I have yet to see a dime. Not that I sold many Since then I haven't dealt with any sort of trying to get my songs out there other than just posting them on my soundclick and myspace site. Roger Slovine, then president of BMI tried to get me to sit down and write normal songs. He said I had great ideas that went astray. He wanted me to come to Nashville, and he would oversee me learning from top songwriters- the "hit formula". Then he would put a band behind me. I would only sing the songs and maybe blow a little harp. Next he would take me to the major labels and all I had to do was sign with BMI and forget about spontobeat. I said no way, and he told me when I got tired of playing for nothing to call him. He called me several times over a couple year period, but I had no interest in such a thing. I still don't. I have watched lots of guys, especially in austin, go big with songwriting. Towns Van Zant, Lyle Lovet, Timbuck 3, The Call, all were friends during their rises to riches. They just opened the mailbox. That would be something to have happen! For me life is way to short to do anything but I want with my art. Walter

 

[Aaron Cheney]

Song writing can mean many things to many people - but to be a published writer (vs. an artist).....writing to a commerial formula is a reality and a necessary evil.

I would partially agree with this.

Yes..to give yourself any kind of realistic chance as an independent writer you have to 1) write catchy, commercial, accessible songs. This means following a lot of conventions, and 2) write in genres where outside songwriting is accepted. This basically means country, pop, and R&B.

The part I disagree with is that this is "evil". I don't think writing within a set of "rules" and being creative are mutually exclusive. Just the opposite, in fact. I believe people are often at their most creative when they are working within limitations.

That doesn't mean you can never write "outside" songs for yourself. In fact, I do it all the time. It's cathartic. My hard-drive is filled with songs no one will ever hear but me. You just need to have realistic expectations for them. A publisher is never going to sign a 7 minute song about malignant tumors, with a kazoo rhythm section and a nose-flute solo.

 

[Xdrummer]

I would partially agree with this.

The part I disagree with is that this is "evil". I don't think writing within a set of "rules" and being creative are mutually exclusive. Just the opposite, in fact. I believe people are often at their most creative when they are working within limitations.

.

I should clarify.....I personally do not feel writing within the confines of long respected "rules" is evil. In fact, I believe understanding those rules and working within them is a significant part of the craft of songwriting.

I used the phrase "evil" because there are soooo many people that seem to think restricting thier "artistic vison" to a recoginized set of "norms" is a bad thing. I personally think writing a well crafted song with a good melody, a great hook in the chorus and lyrics that the masses can relate to - defines the craft. Perhaps I have encountered so many musicians/writers who look down on people who do try to write within "rules" that I automatically feel inclind to somehow qualify the use of the word "commercially".

 

[Aaron Cheney]

I should clarify.....I personally do not feel writing within the confines of long respected "rules" is evil. In fact, I believe understanding those rules and working within them is a significant part of the craft of songwriting.

I used the phrase "evil" because there are soooo many people that seem to think restricting thier "artistic vison" to a recoginized set of "norms" is a bad thing. I personally think writing a well crafted song with a good melody, a great hook in the chorus and lyrics that the masses can relate to - defines the craft. Perhaps I have encountered so many musicians/writers who look down on people who do try to write within "rules" that I automatically feel inclind to somehow qualify the use of the word "commercially".

I had figured you were just using the phrase "necessary evil" as a shorter way to say what you just said. I just wanted to give you a reason to say it.

I know exactly how you feel. Sounds like we're definitely on the same page.

 

[Monkey Allen]

I've been published and had songs placed in a few major studio films, a TV show (source music) and recorded by a couple of unknown artists. I do see some BMI checks each year for the film/TV work, but have seen nothing yet on the artist recordings. I also have created music for radio jingles, industrial training videos, music on hold and for a couple on local, independant films. I've done over 4,000 gigs and have logged many hours in the studio on both sides of the glass. Over the years I've accepted almost any writing/performing opportunity - often for little or no money - simply to gain experiance and build a resume.

There is no real "story" - like any dedicated writer, I've written for a long time and have studied songwriting and music theory. I've tirelessly tried to establish a network of "industry contacts" and have mailed out countless recordings to publishers, artists. producers, etc. - and I have a file drawer full of rejection letters to prove it

I read countless books on songwriting and publishing, have subscribed to everything from Billboard to various songwriter "tip sheets". Each year I purchase the Songwriter Market and am currently a member of BMI and NASI. I was previously a member of Taxi.

I own a collection of well over 3,000 records, tapes and CDs and I spend hours disecting songs.....always trying to improve as a writer (candidly, I'm a rather one dimentional type of person). I have taught myselff to play several instruments well enough to demo my songs and have worked on my vocals enough to cover most melody and harmony parts. I have invested more money in music related things than many people invest in a home.

Like most dedicated writers - I write not in hopes of making money................but simply because I could not live if I did not write. If I am not sleeping, eating or working a day job, I'm writing.

What major studio movies? What TV show? What jingles?

 

[Xdrummer]

What major studio movies? What TV show? What jingles?

The films were were I Saw Mommy Kissing Santa Clause, Consequence and Church Of the Holy Ghost -I don't think any of them ended up in theatrical releases, but went direct to video (the first one still shows up on various cable channels from time to time. I had some music picked up as an option for a film that was going to come out on Tri Mark....but the project died in pre-production. The TV show was an episode of My Name Is Earl (I think it was 2 years ago). The jingles were local businesses - a car dealer, a chain of conveniance stores, a cleaning service, a heating contractor and a couple of other things.

 

[nzausrec]

If you don't mind me asking, as I don't know, what were the royalty cuts/payments for the jingles?

Walter: I was thinking Walter that if you gig regularly you obviously earn well doing what you love and what you are good at. In that way I can see why there's no immediate need for a recording contract.
But, if you were not earning much it wouldn't be good to let the offer of a contract slide ..

 

[Walter Tore]

Walter: I was thinking Walter that if you gig regularly you obviously earn well doing what you love and what you are good at. In that way I can see why there's no immediate need for a recording contract.
But, if you were not earning much it wouldn't be good to let the offer of a contract slide ..

When all this was happening, I was living in Austin, playing full time, and barely surviving finacially. Life for me is about living from the heart. I would rather starve than do music that wasn't demanding to come out. To do a conventional approach to music sounds as exciting as being a ditch digger. I would would rather dig the ditch. At least I would be out in the fresh air. I have nothing against the conventional approach. It works for most every musician, but is of no interest to me. So, why waste my precious days on this earth doing things like this?

Currently I am a special education teacher and love it. I am allowed to be as creative as I want, and find it as satifying as any music I have done. I went to college while living in Austin, and have since (15 years) been able to buy a house, and build my own recording studio. I no longer need the music business. If it accepts me on my terms that would be great. Otherwise, I will stick to where I am at and die a happy man. You use to have to need them for- a good studio, record pressing facility, distribution. Now all this can all be done at home. Money comes and money goes. It can buy you things, but it can never buy happiness in your soul. Walter