TaoManna Don said:
My advice is terrible? Surely you can offer a conflicting opinion without condeming mine.
There is no standard format for what a song should be? AABA, ABAB (and variations of those "standard" formats define much of the music with lyrics we all enjoy, no matter with genre. But, you already know about that because you posted a song to this forum with a variation of ABAB.
There is plenty of room in the world for free-form music but I don't usually listen to it or buy it. If I can't hear some memorable and repeating structure within a new song, I lose interest. So naturally, when I offer advice, it's based on what I have learned listening to music over the past fifty-plus years. Almost all of that music followed a "standard" format.
Keep writing,
Don
I didn't say all of your advice is terrible. I will stand behind what I said and meant-in my opinion you gave bad advice on this occasion. It is actually impossible to tell for sure without hearing the song, but it appears as though the structure that was originally written for this song is a little off the beaten path. There are a few patterns in the song, but overall it seems to have a very loose structure. To me it seems intentional, and that the reason for this song's creation was probably leaning more towards artistic satisfaction than commercial success. (In my mind, THESE two things are not mutually exclusive, Aaron Cheney. The best selling music of all time was written by artists who felt free to be themselves, and who took it upon themselves to break a lot of rules. By saying this I am definately not implying that simply writing in unusual formats will secure an artist a permanent place in rock history, but I do think that the post that was made is just one example of the type of rigid thinking that has squashed the life out of a lot of the new music heard these days. You have to do this, be that. When you base EVERYTHING you do solely upon what a record company typically wants and needs to make their quick buck, you reinforce that same mode of thinking, encouraging it to continue, which sucks for the state of music in general. You also miss out on using the one wild card that everyone has, [but very very few use to its utmost potential] that can allow you to make genuinely good music that stands out from everyone else's-your originality. If it is someone's goal to make it financially in the music business no matter what-if they even write their songs thinking only about what a record company typically wants to hear, then fine, thats their goal-they can make some more music that is much more similar than different to the vast amount of crap out there, and I personally think that philosophy sucks, but I usually won't make a big scene about it because its not worth my time. This post touched a nerve because it seemed to so vividly illustrate an example where someone wrote something unique [the looseness of the structure was unique], and someone else came along implied that they could make the song so much better by turning it into something that is drastically more similar to everything else.)
What record companies want, and what people like is NOT always the same thing, at least not always at first, anyway.
Most of the songs that have ever been written and most that I like have fairly standard formats [well, I guess that depends on how loosely you define the structures within a format, which is a whole nother issue], and most of the stuff I write does. That doesn't mean it can't "flow" if it doesn't. This leads me to a kind of related statement I think needs to be made:
This person didn't have a recording of their song. I personally don't know how you can judge a lot of the things that people on this board judge without actually hearing the music. I myself posted lyrics on here to hear what people thought of the content and ideas of my lyrics, since that is about all you can really evaluate without hearing a sample of the music. Things such as rhyming, meter, the number of syllables in a phrase, the format etc., are all things that can appear to be extremely "wrong" or off on paper, but work out great in the actual song. (And I have heard all of these things being critiqued without an audio sample) Take a look at some of the lyrics from artists you admire-I bet this is the case. Most songs aren't free form, but I would also say most songs have at least a few quirks in them, and don't always follow the same rules you use to write poetry in elementary school. But this song was instantly transformed into something that does, and that definately makes it better?
I guess I just broadened the topic quite a bit...
All right-let the flames rise... its cold up here in Minnesota.
