Success with a 4 tracker!

[Muckelroy]

OK, here it is, at long last, the debut album to the MBC Quintet, a blues/funk/jazz/fusion jam-band I'm in, (there's only 3 of us, but what the hell.) Used that old Teac A-3340S.

The drums were recorded with 5 mics, ran into a Tascam M-308, and sent to buss 1, which was sent to just one track of tape, and MAN, it mixed itself. I just set everything to unity, eq'ed the kick, ran the low-tom through a tube-pre, and tweaked a couple of levels, and viola. Crunchy, yummy, thick drums. It was a whole lotta fun, and it sure was a learning experience.

Ran the Bass direct to track 4, did Hammond live to track 3, and then bounced stuff around to get the Rhodes, Piano, and trumpet tracks in.

Here's the recordings.

http://www.bdedesigns.com/MBC/

It's case sensitive, so BE SURE to capitalize MBC.

Thank you guys for helping me to understand what the hell I was doing.

-callie-

 

[FALKEN]

sounds good man.

 

[Dr ZEE]

i'm on groove in C - - super COOOOOOOOOOOOOL! Loved chicken shack ... these tracks sound great!
also drives me mad, cos that's sort of sound and kind of stuff I'm after nowdays. I've got a-3340s, I've got pretty ugly and mad drums setup and more than five mics ...I am struglin' around drums at the moment, experimenting around micing and recording plus playing drums itself the whole another story.
I was just experimenting recording all mics from drums / mixing to stereo and recording on TEAC, another TEAC , also on AKAIs HDs ...have not done much on eq-ing and vary mic-position... this will take some long time before I get into actually recording...

So, man.... thanks for posting... this stuff IS very encouraging to me personally
NOW! I do not have organ and I do not have Rhodes. And it SUCKs .... I have JV-1080 with vintage synth card and bunch of other sh*t in my "sample-library"...hah hah hah ... lol, which sucks even more than having nothing at all, but at least I can play around and dream on ...sorta'speak. I may get lucky to pick some old organ locally not so expansive (people have them in their guest-rooms sometimes and, when moving, - selling them for cheap ... but no luck so far). Getting Fender Rhodes - that's another story.... real tough one, auctions going over the top...grrrrrrrrr
oh well,

again, man, good going!!!!!

/respects

 

[Herm]

I am diggin this shit. It sounds just like it should.
Great job. Long live the teac and tascam 4 track Reel machines.

 

[Dr ZEE]

callie, I must ask you: what the drum kit/cymbals? Just gotta know
Also what's the deal on piano recording (Attack of the...track)(Mic? how?) .... really cool stuff!
Also the performance is great.... a little thing, right?

/respects

 

[Herm]

Dont be posting this stuff on the mp3 forum cause the price of 4 tracks will go up on ebay

 

[Beck]

Rightious!

 

[Muckelroy]

callie, I must ask you: what the drum kit/cymbals? Just gotta know
Also what's the deal on piano recording (Attack of the...track)(Mic? how?) .... really cool stuff!
Also the performance is great.... a little thing, right?

/respects

The drums are Pearl Export brand. Cymbals, uh, mixture of Sabian and Zildian, (sorry, that's all I can tell ya. I'm not the drummer, but that's all i know about my brother's stuff.) The snare is a Ludwig aluminum shell. As far as micing went, I used an SM 57 for kick and snare, SM 58 for bottoms snare and hi-tom, and a Realistic Radio-shack something-er-ruther for the low tom (which was ran through a Presonus Tube-Pre for a rather surprising crunchy sound The mic itself had a crappy, but nice mid-range bump, suitable for just about nothing besides low-tom.) There were no overhead mics, just bleed-through of the cymbals through the 5 mics that were there. I made SURE to drive the drum track so that it would hit the red and give me tape distortion whenever he let loose. Indeed, it worked out niceley. The tape distortion shows up better when you listen to it through a pair of good headphones.

For all the piano tracks, I played a Steinway B, which hasn't been tuned in nearly a year, in a medium-sized room. I used a Rode NT1A, micing about 4 feet from the soundboard with the lid up. Ran the mic through a Presonus Tube-Pre. It picked up quite a bit of the extra room noise, (AC, etc.) The original track was pretty mid-rangy and muddy, so I eq'ed it while mixing down to compensate. I think there was some piano tape distortion at the very beginning of "Sweet Home Chicago." accidental, but I kept it anyway. Punching in can be a bitch when you have to do it yourself

For the trumpet tracks, I used a Blue-Ball Microphone (a phantom-powered dynamic mic, spherical, weird little gadget.) Has a nice 2K bump. Also ran that mic through a Presonus Tube-Pre. In Cissy Strut, I ran it through a delay with a Behringer VIrtualizer Pro, Pre-tape, and then added another delay post-tape while mixing down to thicken up the sound. Also used the "ambiance" reverb setting for trumpet and EP tracks, pre-tape.

I accidentally deleted the first like, 30 seconds of the Hammond track on Attack of the Marfrawg, while trying to record piano. So that would explain the funky hammond bleedthrough in the drum tracks.

I must say, without the mixer, (tascam M-308), this sound would never have been achieved. That thing just lets EVERYTHING through, and blends tracks together as purely as the air. Like they always say, there's no better mixer than air. Though I didn't exactly do a room recording, the M-308 did a pretty damn good job of helping to attain that sound.

I used Quantegy 407 tape, el cheapo 7 inch reels. Two of them for like, 15 bucks. Can't beat that. Mixed it down to Sound Forge on my computer, for lack of a master recorder, but hey, what can you do

Thank you guys for the kudos. Hope this helps pple w/ 4 trackers out there.

-callie-

 

[cjacek]

Funky ... Totally 70's, man! I totally dig all the cuts, love the piano, albeit very brief, on Sweet Home Chicago and Song For My Father.

Listen to Herm .. don't be postin' that stuff on the mp3 forum. The prices on 4 trackers are already going UP.

Really nice to have an example of a 3340S in action.

~Daniel

 

[cjacek]

Thank you guys for the kudos. Hope this helps pple w/ 4 trackers out there.

Thanks for giving us a glimpse into your recording ways, gear used, technique etc .... Very, very interesting ..

~Daniel

 

[Dr ZEE]

The drums are Pearl Export brand. Cymbals, uh, mixture of Sabian and Zildian, (sorry, that's all I can tell ya. I'm not the drummer, but that's all i know about my brother's stuff.) The snare is a Ludwig aluminum shell. As far as micing went, I used an SM 57 for kick and snare, SM 58 for bottoms snare and hi-tom, and a Realistic Radio-shack something-er-ruther for the low tom (which was ran through a Presonus Tube-Pre for a rather surprising crunchy sound The mic itself had a crappy, but nice mid-range bump, suitable for just about nothing besides low-tom.) There were no overhead mics, just bleed-through of the cymbals through the 5 mics that were there. I made SURE to drive the drum track so that it would hit the red and give me tape distortion whenever he let loose. Indeed, it worked out niceley. The tape distortion shows up better when you listen to it through a pair of good headphones.

For all the piano tracks, I played a Steinway B, which hasn't been tuned in nearly a year, in a medium-sized room. I used a Rode NT1A, micing about 4 feet from the soundboard with the lid up. Ran the mic through a Presonus Tube-Pre. It picked up quite a bit of the extra room noise, (AC, etc.) The original track was pretty mid-rangy and muddy, so I eq'ed it while mixing down to compensate. I think there was some piano tape distortion at the very beginning of "Sweet Home Chicago." accidental, but I kept it anyway. Punching in can be a bitch when you have to do it yourself

For the trumpet tracks, I used a Blue-Ball Microphone (a phantom-powered dynamic mic, spherical, weird little gadget.) Has a nice 2K bump. Also ran that mic through a Presonus Tube-Pre. In Cissy Strut, I ran it through a delay with a Behringer VIrtualizer Pro, Pre-tape, and then added another delay post-tape while mixing down to thicken up the sound. Also used the "ambiance" reverb setting for trumpet and EP tracks, pre-tape.

I accidentally deleted the first like, 30 seconds of the Hammond track on Attack of the Marfrawg, while trying to record piano. So that would explain the funky hammond bleedthrough in the drum tracks.

I must say, without the mixer, (tascam M-308), this sound would never have been achieved. That thing just lets EVERYTHING through, and blends tracks together as purely as the air. Like they always say, there's no better mixer than air. Though I didn't exactly do a room recording, the M-308 did a pretty damn good job of helping to attain that sound.

I used Quantegy 407 tape, el cheapo 7 inch reels. Two of them for like, 15 bucks. Can't beat that. Mixed it down to Sound Forge on my computer, for lack of a master recorder, but hey, what can you do

Thank you guys for the kudos. Hope this helps pple w/ 4 trackers out there.

-callie-

AHHHHH! cool! thanks a bunch for takin' time typing all this. It is indeed very interesting to know. Geeeeeeeee! Realistic on LoTom! ...this is pretty violent heh heh I've got one...gotta get it out and try it in action... mine is 1/4"plug so-called Realistic HIGHBALL-7 ...what a name ! I actually have also Optimus 'unidirectional condenser' mic... which I actually did try for an effect... it's kinda strange... but does pick sound in its own way, especially if you place it very close to drum head or cymbal... not "by the book way" .

anyway,
thanks again for the post and stuff...
/respects

 

[Dr ZEE]

...I used Quantegy 407 tape, el cheapo 7 inch reels. Two of them for like, 15 bucks. ...

ahh, btw, I "use exclusively 7" reels for recording. so you are not alone .10" are for display only heh heh, they ain't practical as I see it -

 

[Muckelroy]

ahh, btw, I "use exclusively 7" reels for recording. so you are not alone .10" are for display only heh heh, they ain't practical as I see it -

It was either, pay 30 bucks for a 10" reel of 407 (which woulda given me 48 minutes), or pay 15 bucks total for 2 7" reels of 407 (each give 24 minutes, hey guess what? 24 + 24 = 48!!)

Why pay twice as much for the same amount of tape? You're just paying for the stinkin reel flange and the fancy box!!

.........if only 1/2" came in a 7" format

 

[jpmorris]

ahh, btw, I "use exclusively 7" reels for recording. so you are not alone .10" are for display only heh heh, they ain't practical as I see it -

Some of us like to mix an album down onto two 'sides', not four..

 

[Muckelroy]

Some of us like to mix an album down onto two 'sides', not four..

And by two sides, are you saying that you mix down to a quarter-track deck?

 

[jpmorris]

And by two sides, are you saying that you mix down to a quarter-track deck?

Gah.. I knew someone would say that. 10.5" spool with 2 tracks at 15ips gives you about 30 minutes (once you've got a safety gap and some test tones), or half an album.

So, for a 50-60 minute album you'll have two tapes, an 'A side' tape and a 'B side' tape. This corresponds naturally to two sides of a record, even though the thing is actually going onto CD. With 7" spools, you're going to have four 'sides' and a lot more shelf space per album.

And that is why I want my 10.5" spools ;-)

 

[Muckelroy]

I gotcha.

Except that 1 mil tape is thinner, therefore there is more tape on the spool, therefore more recording time. With 1 mil tape like 407, a 10-inch reel at 15 ips gives you 48 minutes. (half that on 7-inch reels of 407)

4-track decks like the A-3340S tend to perform more reliable with 1 mil tape, as opposed to 1.5 mil tape. I remember having speed issues with that deck when I used 456 on it. After a few hours, it recorded a bit too slowly. It was probably just due to age, but I was in no mood to refurbish the thing -- just use 1mil tape and make the deck happy, and live w/ it.

That was my logic behind the 7 inch reels. (plus, value.............cmon now)

 

[Dr ZEE]

when you make 'longer' recording (album/half-album, mega-mix, long song what have Ya) - you use longer tape, which may mean that you will have to use large reels.
Recording singles (i e recording common song/track which is somewhat 2.5-5mins) and using "MEGA-reels" is simply silly... but some of us do silly things, and why not?! 10"(s) looks way cooller.... they also look more "professional" ... so, again, why not
Some of us also have and are driven by natural preference for a pair of rather larger circular objects than pair of smaller ones ...unconsciously, yet naturally. Long life Dr. Freud!

 

[Muckelroy]

Sometimes, one must make judgements based on functionality and budget, as opposed to looks.

Pay my phone bill.................or have 10" spools?



Let those MP3's do the arguing.

 

[Dr ZEE]

Pay my phone bill.................or have 10" spools?
.

heh heh, that's easy: shorter phone-blah - longer tape-record/play time