soundcard latency... please help!

  • Thread starter Thread starter PAUL'C
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PAUL'C

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Hi all

I am new here and I hope you can help me solve my dilema.
I got only 55 USD (or 40 EUR) to spend on a soundcard (please don't laugh - in my country some people earn this money in 2 weeks) and I can't decide what to buy.
Here is what i want from the soundcard.
- midi in / game port (standard 15 pin)
- low latency (15 ms would be ok, 10 ms would be wonderfull)
- inputs: analog line and mic
- outputs: analog line out
I had a nice ISA ESS1869 "who" served me well-enough 5 years and I "betraied" her by giving her away as a gift to my father-in-law.
With this old card I could play my cheap midi-controller-keyboard (cheapest Terratec available) with a latency of "as little as" 30 ms on my Duron 650 / 320 MB RAM computer.
Now - with my sound chip in my VIAKT133 mobo i cant even configure the latency lower than 100 ms without freezing my PC.
Just to make things clear - I got only 1 cheap pair of computer speakers so I dont need things like 5.1 or more.
If latency is lower when using hardware wavetable, then I might need a sound card with hardware wavetable (?).

Now, here are the alternatives available in my town:
terratec 128 - ESS1938S = 19,50 € = 23,90 $
philips Seismic Edge psc604 = 22,10 € = 27,00 $
creative Live 5.1 Digital = 26,00 € = 31,80 $
creative Audigy LS = 26,00 € = 31,80 $
creative Audigy ES = 27,30 € = 33,40 $
terratec 512i Digital = 31,20 € = 38,10 $
philips Sonic Edge psc605 = 33,80 € = 41,30 $
abit theater 5.1. UA10 = 33,80 € = 41,30 $
terratec DMX Xfire 1024 = 39,00 € = 47,70 $
philips Ultimate Edge psc724 = 44,20 € = 54,00 $
hercules Muse USB = 44,20 € = 54,00 $
herculles Fortissimo III 7.1 = 49,40 € = 60,40 $
terratec Aureon 5.1 Sky = 78,00 € = 95,30 $
creative Audigy 2 bulk = 78,00 € = 95,30 $
creative Audigy 2 ZS = 91,00 € = 111,20 $
m-audio revolution 5.1 = 103,90 € = 127,00 $

These prices are very aproximative but I hope you get the ideea; if i look around i might find a shop a little bit cheaper. The hercules Fortissimo III 7.1 is about the most expensive i could buy right now. For the others, I would have to wait a few weeks.
The problem is i can't test all these cards and usually the computer sellers are not very well informed. They got no damn ideea what lantency means (one of them started to look on the hardchips of a Philips card, trying to find the latency written somewhere ).

I hope some of you had the occasion to work with (at least) some of these cards. Please share your advice!
 
Thanks Bull Hit...

Unfortunatellly EMU doens't seem to be available in my country.
Intead, M-Audio is available. I think Revolution 7.1 and 5.1 dont have a midi connector, but it seems that Audiophile 2496 has. In USA Audiohpile 2496 seems to have about the same price as EMU 0404 24/96.
Unfurtunatelly it is quite expensive - it offers a lot much than I need.

I still hope to find a less proffesional alternative.
Home recording is a hobby for me, not my proffesion
 
...Sorry...

Sorry to keep this going, but ... please... has any of you played with at least some of these sund cards? I just want to know the latency experienced with any of these.
Or ... is there any collection / list of user-submitted latencies (with soundcard and system description)? I rember I've seen such a long list a year or two ago. But now, I've tried googl-ing all possible words and boolean syntax (rofl) and found nothing. IT was a LOOONG list of soundcards and latencies... Even the ESS1868 or other ESS ISA cards were mentioned there...

Thanks in advance for any advice or help....
 
nonones responding because youve had the best advice from bh.
get a recording card......
 
Always

Of course a card with hardware wavetable has unnoticable latency. I think that at that moment A soundblaster live will do.

BUT: for the hardware wavetable (soundfonts you can make yourself, yes the sblive and audigy are samplers, do a search). you will have no latency.

For all other softsynths you will have latency!!!!!!!!

The directXdrivers work quite well on the SBlive. If you put the buffers at 512 you will get 11 msec latency. Not bad.

BUT!!! Always work at 48 khz with SBlive/ Audigy. Only way to have ok sync between tracks.

Other solution, use asio4all generic asio drivers:

http://www.asio4all.com

they are free, but did not work well on my sblive. For my crystal chip in my laptop I have 1.4 msec however!! Do a search, make your homework.



Hugo


www.pego.be
 
PAUL'C said:
Unfortunatellly EMU doens't seem to be available in my country.
Click to expand...

Well that's the beauty of internet commerce. You pay a bit extra for P&P but you get exactly what you want. All you need is a credit card
 
Credit card?

Bulls Hit said:
Well that's the beauty of internet commerce. You pay a bit extra for P&P but you get exactly what you want. All you need is a credit card
Click to expand...

Bulls Hit

If it is true he lives in a country where you earn about 50$ in 2 weeks and he is one of them ,I DO NOT SEE HIM HAVING A CREDIT CARD.

Welcome to the real world.

And yes I shouted, if you have a minimum of education and decency you should know why.

Hugo

www.pego.be
 
Thanks all. You've been real nice :)

Thanks all. :) You guys have been really really nice to spend your time with your comments and answers in this thread.
I've decided to buy an Audigy LS bulk, for about 30 bucks. This should be enough to satisfy my hobby. Just bught it 1 hour ago. I'll see how it works. Got KX project and ASIO4ALL and latest creative update.
I know this is awful for a pro, but i've tested yesterday ASIO 4 ALL with my onboard sound (on Via KT133) and in FLoops i get 30 ms latency wich for me seems quite bearable considering this is an onboard chip. I expect lower latency with Audigy LS. Too bad Cakewalk doesn't support ASIO. The WDM Vinyl driver sucks. Cakewalk can't work with it unless i check "Always use MME" lol - so it is not using it.

To reply some of your comments...
hogojacket::
Thanks for your advices. By the way, you were right - I don't have a credit card, but i could get one if really needed. I live in Romania and earn about 100$ per week... (please don't laugh, we have lower prices... :p rofl)
Regarding the 48KHz sampling rate - all this seems so strange to me. I've read about this but did not understand completely. So the Creative cards make an internal resampling from 44 to 48 and the reacording cannot be actually performed at 48 - right? So when i should use 48? In playback?... I know this is off-topic so maybe i should read more in this forum or maybe start a new thread... Anyways, feel free to comment on this here :)

Bulls Hit::
Thanks for your suggestion. However, this is just a hobby for me - BUT, if i would've REALLY wanted a more "PRO" card I would have gone for M-AUDIO Audiophile 2496, for the same price (here it's about $150 or about 125 EUR). I would't have bought EMU, because if they are not present here on the market, warranty and support problems could appear. The strange thing is I saw that in USA both EMU 0404 and Audiophile 2496 are priced around $99 :confused: . Is this including VAT (taxes)? In Romanian IT shops usually we can see the list (catalog) price in USD or EUR but to this price the VAT 19% must be added, so the final price in our local currency is actually 19% higher.

Thanks all again.
 
48 khz

The creative cards work natively at 48 kz. Anything else is resampled on the fly. This makes for dreadful synchronisation between audio tracks themselves and audio versus midi tracks. Unworkable.

The audigy card is no different. It is even so that while you have normally a "real" asio driver for the audigy, it only works at 48khz.

That's partly my experience (Sblive) partly info from the web / magazines (audigy).

This is no problem if you don't import wave files (loops?), as these should then be resampled at 48K, otherwise, they will play back too fast and too high pitched. And of course you should sample down at mixdown.

All this is not unworkable, but should be known and taken in account. Also, I heard the audigy is not FULL DUPLEX 24/96.

Hugo

www.pego.be
 
hugojacquet said:
Bulls Hit

If it is true he lives in a country where you earn about 50$ in 2 weeks and he is one of them ,I DO NOT SEE HIM HAVING A CREDIT CARD.

Welcome to the real world.

And yes I shouted, if you have a minimum of education and decency you should know why.

Hugo

www.pego.be
Click to expand...

Steady on there Mr Feed The World. I suggested a credit card as a means of completing a financial transaction across the internet. Maybe just climb down from that high horse of yours for a few seconds. This is the real world
 
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