software and outboard

  • Thread starter Thread starter Adam P
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Adam P

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Hey all, just a quick, kind of random question. Does anyone know of any software that would allow the use of VST and/or DirectX plugins with "out of the box" mixing, via computer interfaces? For example, I could run an Aux send out of my mixer into Input 1 on my Layla interface, set up my computer to apply a delay plugin to Input 1, and route it back out through Output 1 on the Layla and back to the mixer's Aux return? Would this be possible to achieve given the latency between the hardware and the computer? I got the idea after watching my friend plug a guitar into an input on his Quattro and play into Garageband, applying a delay effect without actually recording that he routed out through the Quattro's output and into the PA. Any thoughts? Its kind of a shot in the dark, but having access to a wide variety of "outboard" plugins would be a great alternative to some costly output hardware. Thanks!
 
Any audio editing software with zero latency would allow this, I would imagine. I use logic platinum to record, but if I was going to use it as you described I could just 'record enable' the track and apply the affect.
 
I've read that Cubase SX 3 does what you're talking about. It even auto-compensates for it too!
 
hehe, Kristal is awesome!

to say its free, it has a lot of the basic features that i found we're common on other programs.

i'm using Cubase now. its obviously a massive upgrade, but there's nothing wrong with Kristal :D

Andy
 
Cubase does not specifically do what is asked. Cubase SX3 was designed to do it the other way around. The original post seems to be about sending a signal into the DAW and then back out to the console again. There will be a latency when you do that. That latency cannot be compensated since all the original tracks are "out of the box". Delay compensation works by delaying all of the tracks in a project so that they stay in time with each other based on the different delays forced by plugins on the different tracks. As of yet if you want to delay compensate tracks that are not in the DAW, you would have to have a lot of tight delay units so you could put one on every outboard track. Then you would have to manual calculate every track on the outboard system. Sounds like a real pain in the ass to me. Zero latency systems won't do it either. Zero latency in a software application is achieved by taking the incoming signal and looping right back out to your mixer BEFORE entering the windows and software based environment. There is a delay that takes place no matter what when you input s ignal through an Operating system and then again through a sfotware application, and then again when it is porcessed in that software, and then again on the way out of the system. When all of your tracks are on your DAW, latency compensation kicks in for you to keep them all tight. That only truly works though when ALL tracks are on the DAW since your DAW is not capable of compensating for tracks that it can't "see" (i.e. tracks on an outboard recorder).

However, if you were using an aux send from a console to feed into a DAW, the system headroom would be quite good which should allow you to lower your buffers and dramatically reduce your latency. Programs like Cubase will actually tell you what your SYSTEM latency is through your OS, DAW app and soundcard. You should be able to get this latency to 6ms or less with no problem. When you add an effect to a track though, it could increase that latency (by very small amounts). You would definately here a phasing if your DAW (in this situation) was running a compressor, or EQ, or any relatime effect. If you were running a reverb or a delay though this shouldn't be much of a problem. If you want to run a tap delay, only the first delay would com in slightly off tempo (whatever the system input + output latency is) but all other feddback are consequent echos would still be at the right tempo. Typically, this is pretty unnoticable to all but the most discerning of ears. With a reverb, if your inherent latency is 6ms, you could just subtract 6ms of the predelay and it should work just fine.

There are also hardware units out now that allow you to load VST plugins into them and run them just like you would a standard outboard FX unit. The delay in these systems is much less than a conventional DAW system. At this point though, those outboard boxes are still very expensive.
 
Hey, thanks a lot for your responses. I kind of suspected that latency would make it not worth dealing with, but for a reverb or delay it might not be too big a deal. I guess its just something I'll have to experiment with and see if the results are satisfactory or not. Thanks a lot!

By the way, Xstatic, did you ever get the PM I sent you regarding the custom snake with Pin 3 hot for my console?
 
I am not sure, I may have to check. When did you send it and can you send it again?
 
The PM I thought I sent about three weeks ago apparently was lost somewhere along the way, so I sent a new one. Thanks!
 
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