junplugged
Taking the slow road
but I see it's about $350 each, so it ain't gonna happen too soon. Unless I win in A/C.
Since I heard that the Shure SM81 was used for the Eagles Acoustic Guitar, I want 2
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chessrock
Banned
Too bad, dude. I bet if you used SM-81s, your recorded guitar tracks would sound exactly like the Eagles.
scrubs
Not of sound mind
chessrock said:
Good one.
Check e-bay. I see them going for around $200-250 a piece pretty regularly.
junplugged
Taking the slow road
and I think Howard Stern uses a tlm103, so if I crack jokes into it I could go to satellite radio.chessrock said:
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Henri Devill
New member
I got a extra 81 sitting around..I'll let it go cheap or trade..I forgot I even had it untill this thead..PM me if you want it 
mshilarious
Banned
It does pretty much give you that '70s acoustic guitar tone, even though I don't think it came out until 1978 
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sloop
Active member
Just used a pair of them
They are nice mics. Flat, nice sound. You can hear what the sound like on this URL. The 12 string was mic'ed with a pair of them. the other guitar was mic'ed with a pair of MXL 603's.
http://www.recordingproject.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=13939
They are nice mics. Flat, nice sound. You can hear what the sound like on this URL. The 12 string was mic'ed with a pair of them. the other guitar was mic'ed with a pair of MXL 603's.
http://www.recordingproject.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=13939
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chessrock
Banned
mshilarious said:It does pretty much give you that '70s acoustic guitar tone, even though I don't think it came out until 1978
I didn't realize the 70's had an accoustic guitar tone.
I'm not knockin' ya on this or trying to stir anything up. I am curious, though, what this " 70's accoustic guitar sound" is. I was around and listening to plenty of music back then, but it's been a while. Why are we talking about one of the prominent bands of the 70's and somehow attributing their sound to a microphone? Am I missing something?Again, I'm not trying to be an ass. I'd just like to hear people's thoughts on this and discuss in greater detail. I think it's an interesting topic. Love the Eagles.
mshilarious
Banned
chessrock said:I didn't realize the 70's had an accoustic guitar tone.
Yes, there was a '70s acoustic guitar sound. "Peaceful Easy Feeling" is a good example. Or maybe PPL's "Amie". Smooth, crisp, shimmery, suddenly hi-fi; quite different from the '60s folkish tone. Obviously not everybody liked that sound, but it was pretty common.
No, I'm not attributing that sound to the SM81, I'm sure they probably used different mics (most of the recordings I'm thinking of predate the SM81), but the SM81 is pretty good at it.
Everybody knows what the '80s drum sound is, don't they?
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chessrock
Banned
mshilarious said:
Hmm. Crisp. Smooth. Shimmery. Hi-fi.
Interesting, but how does that compare to today's accoustic sound? Like, oh, how 'bout John Mayer? Dave Matthews, etc. Is today's accoustic sound less shimmery ... less crsp? Less smooth?
I could be wrong with this, but when I think of 80's accoustic guitar, I somehow think of a more harmonic sound with unnatural high end. Sort of like Lita Ford 12-string on her duet with Ozzy.
What the heck was that one? Anyway, I think that general sound was best achieved using a 12-string and some sort of harmonic exciter / maximizer (possibly a hint of chorus). I don't even give much of a thought to the kind of mic used. Thoughts?
scrubs
Not of sound mind
chessrock said:I could be wrong with this, but when I think of 80's accoustic guitar, I somehow think of a more harmonic sound with unnatural high end. Sort of like Lita Ford 12-string on her duet with Ozzy.
I call that one the "Ovation Zing." Melissa Etheridge did it, too. Nasty nasty. Probably more direct than mic sound.
mshilarious
Banned
chessrock said:
Yeah, definitely. Obviously it's mostly technique, I don't think the Eagles were banging away like Matthews likes to--more string buzz, more fret noise. But at the same time I wouldn't whip out the SM81, I'd think they'd want something more colored.
I could be wrong with this, but when I think of 80's accoustic guitar, I somehow think of a more harmonic sound with unnatural high end. Sort of like Lita Ford 12-string on her duet with Ozzy.
Thoughts?
Yes! You are Wanted (WANTED!) Dead or Alive!!
I dunno, but an AT3060 would work
The sound I want is Son House in the '40s. That is the shizzite! I am correct, sir!
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chessrock
Banned
mshilarious said:
That's exactly what I'm talkin' about, right there.
In what way? Do you honestly think the engineers had a discussion amongst themselves before selection of Mayer's mic, and decided "we need a colored mic for this" ? or "Get that sm-81 outta' here. That's too 70's."
There's a point I'm trying to make with all of this ... and what I'm trying to say is that, realistically speaking, it's easy to overestimate the role of the mic's tone in a given sound. In a real world recording session, you listen to what's coming out over the monitors, and you make adjustments based on how that particular guitar / player are interacting with the rest of the mix.
"Can we swap that mic out? It's getting a little lost in the mix, and we might need something a little brighter" might be something muttered for a given track. But on the next track, who knows? You might hear: "I liked the brighter mic for that last song, but it's all wrong for this. I'm getting too much fret scraping. Could you put the 81 back up and see if that makes a difference?"
Many times, it will come down to how something is being tracked. Maybe a mic with a tighter pattern is used in an effort to get a deader sound with less room ... or vice-versa, so in this instance the room (and polar pattern) plays a large role in mic selection. Maybe you try the tighter pattern, and as it turns out, the proximity effect drives you crazy, so you instead go with the mic that has the bass rolloff switch on it. Then again, maybe you just happen to be tracking a guitar that doesn't sound good close-up no matter where you position the mic. So now, you have to go back to the drawing board and adjust accordingly. Back the mic up, go for one with a wider pattern, and try and deaden the room a bit with gobos, blankets, etc.
Sometimes, the amount of time you have to work on a track will play a significant role. Let's pretend you're on a deadline and you have to crank these accoustic tracks by the end of the evening for whatever reason. So maybe you just grab the mics you're most familiar with, and put them in the position that you know will at least get you an acceptable sound ... simply in an attempt to avoid futzing around and experimenting.
What I'm saying is that there are likely far greater factors to consider when selecting a mic in a real-life recording situation. And so much of it is circumstance-driven and needs to be put in context to understand the reasoning.
thane1200
Medicated Member
Does this mean that everyone here with an SM57 is fit for the presidency?
cavedog101
Well-known member
This is GREAT! Finally a real discussion.
Here's my take.The 40's and 50's were primarily recordings done with one mic,one track...two mics two tracks...three mics three tracks(into the early 60's) and these almost ALWAYS ribbon mics.Then,condensers became the choice, though you can still hear that ribbon sound on Memphis recordings,Mussel Shoals,some of the early Capricorn stuff...of course its come full circle....
That 70's acoustic sound...uhhh...hmmm.I'm that old and I dont remember anything that led me to directly believe that there was some sort of industry standard during that time that delineated this or that mic for acoustic guitar.A lot of the big houses did have CONSOLES which sort of lent a particular edge or tonality to things,as well as the beginnings of many many tracks being layered with the aspect of 24 and more becoming available.I can say that the proliferation of the late 60's microphones(Neumann,Coles,Gefell,Telefunkens) during this time when the electronics in the consoles were getting really good,sort of lent itself to a 'sound'...though it was nothing like the 80's with those damned Ovation plastic crap thingys already mentioned.NOW THERE was a definate sound that went with a decade.Other than that, I agree with Chess, its all dependant on the situations that were at hand at that particular time and wasnt dependant on one mic or another to achieve a particular signature sound.
Here's my take.The 40's and 50's were primarily recordings done with one mic,one track...two mics two tracks...three mics three tracks(into the early 60's) and these almost ALWAYS ribbon mics.Then,condensers became the choice, though you can still hear that ribbon sound on Memphis recordings,Mussel Shoals,some of the early Capricorn stuff...of course its come full circle....
That 70's acoustic sound...uhhh...hmmm.I'm that old and I dont remember anything that led me to directly believe that there was some sort of industry standard during that time that delineated this or that mic for acoustic guitar.A lot of the big houses did have CONSOLES which sort of lent a particular edge or tonality to things,as well as the beginnings of many many tracks being layered with the aspect of 24 and more becoming available.I can say that the proliferation of the late 60's microphones(Neumann,Coles,Gefell,Telefunkens) during this time when the electronics in the consoles were getting really good,sort of lent itself to a 'sound'...though it was nothing like the 80's with those damned Ovation plastic crap thingys already mentioned.NOW THERE was a definate sound that went with a decade.Other than that, I agree with Chess, its all dependant on the situations that were at hand at that particular time and wasnt dependant on one mic or another to achieve a particular signature sound.
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chessrock
Banned
cavedog101 said:
That's a great point I hadn't even thought of.
Just the simple availability of track count allowed for previously unheard-of layering. I'm thinking, in particular, of the intro guitar to "Take it Easy." I could be totally wrong here, but going from memory, doesn't that kind of have that "20 layers of rythm guitar" sound to it?
Nowadays, I think there may be a push towards simpler arrangements / productions; particularly when you're talking about Indie Rock and the like. This I consider to be more of a trend than anything else.
Warhead
Jai guru deva om
So if I'm riding down the road trying to loosen my load will any of this matter? I'm trying to take it easy, you know we haven't had this spirit here since...well I can't remember but it seems like about 36 years ago. Surely you will lose your mind, if you worry too much about this. I'm too tired to fight about it.
This is the end of our innocence.
War
This is the end of our innocence.
War
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Henri Devill
New member
Warhead said:
Prob. not but it depends on whats on your mind really!Now if its a woman or say seven or so..Well then just go have lunch by yourself to chill!Its cool,its about forgiveness
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chessrock
Banned
I know where you guys are coming from on this ...
but It's a losing proposition, and one you can't refuse. It's the politics of contraband.
but It's a losing proposition, and one you can't refuse. It's the politics of contraband.
mshilarious
Banned
chessrock said:
Whatever. All she wants to do is dance !
