Shoot, here we go again...

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dlt123

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Hi all, like most who innocently start out surfing through threads looking for a reasonable priced 'Pro' sounding reverb, we usually decide to buy used since we can usually pick them up for about 1/2 of their new price. Well, at least that's what I've decided to do...

But as usual, after much research it seems we find a lot of good units and end up getting to a point where we become totally wishy washy on what we want to buy.

That pretty much describes me at this point. I've gleaned a lot of information from here and at this point I am totally lost or maybe I should say I at least refined my search to the list below.

I am looking for an EXCELLENT reverb and effects unit that will give my Electronic Dark Space Ambient music that professional refined touch and give me that warm, lush, rich and deep spacey sound that I am looking for in a Verb.

I know that one of the units listed below will give me what I am looking for but cannot make up my mind.

I should also mention that the PCM 80 is probably out of my price range at this time since I just bought a new synth and will be low on funds for quite some time...

Even though, I still have placed the PCM 80 on my list because I know it is a lush sounding module and if none of the units will give me what the 80 does, I may just have to save up.

I've also read that the LXP-15II modded sounds almost as good as the PCM90, but I can't say since I haven't heard either, but it does prick my curiosity.

So... If you were looking to add that professional refined touch to your Spacey music, which unit would you consider buying?

Lexicon MPX-1 = $300 -$400
Lexicon PCM 80 - $600 -$800
Lexicon LXP-15II (Modded) - $350
Kurzweil Rumour = $500

I value the opinions of members of this site and your recommendations are greatly appreciated.

Dennis
 
Well Supercreep summed it all up for you in the post above.:cool:

For the type of music and reverbs you describe, I'd say go for the Rumour. The Lexicon is great for a ton of things, but the Rumour has a depth and space to it that really lends itself well to electronic music.
 
RezN8 said:
Well Supercreep summed it all up for you in the post above.:cool:

For the type of music and reverbs you describe, I'd say go for the Rumour. The Lexicon is great for a ton of things, but the Rumour has a depth and space to it that really lends itself well to electronic music.
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Thank you Rez for piping in. I've read a lot about the Rumour but this is the first time I've heard references to its depth and space. I will definitely check out this verb. Thanks for the input.

Dennis
 
dlt123 said:
Do you have a preference of the ones I listed?
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Why would you purchase something because somebody here recommended it?:confused:


How do you know my preference isn't for shitty-sounding reverb?


Why don't you listen to a few of the models you ask about and decide which you like the best?


Why aren't 114 search results with "reverb" in the title enough to give you an idea of what people here think?

Frankly, I think that looking for a "warm, lush, rich and deep spacey sound" that gives you a "professional and refined touch" is a serious fucking stretch for 500 bucks or less.

What is your current recording chain?
 
Supercreep said:
Why would you purchase something because somebody here recommended it?:confused:


How do you know my preference isn't for shitty-sounding reverb?


Why don't you listen to a few of the models you ask about and decide which you like the best?


Why aren't 114 search results with "reverb" in the title enough to give you an idea of what people here think?

Frankly, I think that looking for a "warm, lush, rich and deep spacey sound" that gives you a "professional and refined touch" is a serious fucking stretch for 500 bucks or less.

What is your current recording chain?
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Sorry I topple your world of comfort, you're right about taking some peoples opinions. Your first post told me that you have a chip on your shoulder and that you have nothing of value to add to my query, so keep your opinions to yourself, I don't want yours.

I tried to be respectful in my response to you, but I see that your immature tantrums show you have nothing of value to add to the conversation.

Settle down and grow up. Your attitude makes me wonder if others who value good feedback have already ditched your opinions.

One last thing... You may think that being rude and bratty is a good quality to have to make others feel you know something, but in reality it only shows that you're selfish, spoiled and use your attitude to hide your insecurity... so in other words F--k Off.


Condescendingly yours,
Dennis
 
Actually, although you don't like the way he said it- Supercreep is indeed giving you invaluable info. So try to look passed how people say things and try to understand what they are really saying.

I totally agree with his point. Seriously, dig in and read all you can. That's the beauty of the Internet. I bought the Rumour b/c I did tons of research - I'm very familiar with the K2600's effects and I learned all I could about it before I even tried it out.

Supercreep asked a VITAL question:

"What is your current recording chain?"

My Rumour is hooked up digitally using SPDIF and I use it as a send effect. I run it at 48K/24 bit. Your path might give you much different results.
 
I'm with Supercreep as well.

Best advice you could have gotten. The very point he was trying to make to you was "not" to listen to him ... or me, or anyone else. Try before you buy. Make sure what you buy does what you need it to do, and in a way that you're comfortable using it.

Listen to that advice and you'll be much happier.
.
 
dlt123 said:
Sorry I topple your world of comfort, you're right about taking some peoples opinions. Your first post told me that you have a chip on your shoulder and that you have nothing of value to add to my query, so keep your opinions to yourself, I don't want yours.

I tried to be respectful in my response to you, but I see that your immature tantrums show you have nothing of value to add to the conversation.

Settle down and grow up. Your attitude makes me wonder if others who value good feedback have already ditched your opinions.

One last thing... You may think that being rude and bratty is a good quality to have to make others feel you know something, but in reality it only shows that you're selfish, spoiled and use your attitude to hide your insecurity... so in other words F--k Off.


Condescendingly yours,
Dennis
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Instead of just blasting you into red-chicklet land, I will explain why I told you what I did.


1) You're asking advice from people with a broad range of experience. You're just as likely to get bad advice as good advice. Stick around and learn who knows what the fuck they're talking about. Hint: Chessrock is one of them.

2) I don't think you're going to see much broad variation in performance in budget gear. $500 is budget. That's okay, this is a home recording forum. I mostly use budget gear myself. Nothing in my inventory does the things you want this box to do. Sorry.

3) I haven't been immature, I haven't had a tantrum, and I haven't even been rude. It's not the gladhanding you were clearly expecting, but join us in the Cave for a taste of me being rude. Your head is still attached to your shoulders. :D

4) I am trying to save you money.

5) I am trying to help you find exactly the box you're looking for.

6) As you become more familiar with HR, you may begin to feel that sometimes people ask questions without doing any real analysis of what they ought to be asking. You could have posted a link to a sound and asked how to get it. You didn't - you asked for a magic bullet.

There are people here who have worked for a long time in this industry making next to nothing, but gaining a lot of experience and wisdom for people who will stfu and listen. I am not one of them. :)

Joking aside, those that are in this industry may not appreciate the notion that $500 and zero experience can land you something they've worked at for years.

I am a hobbyist and a dilettante. And I read and searched posts here for two years before I ever said a fucking word. Now I won't shut up, so I'm reaching some sort of equilibrium.

That may not be a plan that works for you, but please do take your time and learn more about the stuff you want to use - up to and including what it is you want to do with it and whether or not you can reasonably expect it to perform to your expectations - or your client's.

Welcome to HR. Nobody gets out alive.


-Casey
 
Having owned both the PCM-81 and PCM-91, in my opinion the 91 is *far* better sounding for reverb. The 81 is no slouch, but reverb is really what the 90/91 is about. If that's what you are going for, I'd highly suggest you replace the 80/81 with the 90/91 on your list.

The MPX-1 isn't in the same ballpark at all. Nice box, but when you put it side by side with the 81 or 91 you can hear the cheapness. I've owned two MPX-1's as well, and did the side by side comparisons. However, on a budget it's a very good box for the used prices it goes for these days.

The Rumour is an excellent box, I've owned one of those as well. I've got the KSP8 now, so I am familiar with the Kurzweil sound. But for pure lushness I don't find it quite as pleasant as the Lexicon 91.

I've not heard the LXP-15II with the Jim Williams mod, so I can't comment on that. The LXP series had a nice dark kind of sound to it. It's been a while since I've heard one though, so I don't want to comment too much on that box.

But looking at your list, I'd say the Lexicon PCM-90/91 might be the one for you. Used prices are coming down on them, but I think $500 might be an unrealistic expectation.
 
Well, thanks for all your civil responses, including SuperCreep's final post. Sorry if this turns out to be too long a post... :eek:

I realize it may look like I am searching for the magic bullet, but that really isn't the case. I really should have phrased my first post differently.

I am really looking at an inexpensive good verb to add POLISH to my work. Phasing it at a Professional level really didn't make sense since the big guys are using multi dollar outfits and I'm just a bedroom warrior.

I need something in the interim that will add more sparkle to my sounds. I realize that I need to go for better verbs, but I feel that the ones I listed would get me by till I can afford better and they would have a decent resale value to help move forward when ready to make the 'Pro' plunge.

I agree with SonicAlbert concerning the 80/81 vs. 90/91. If I am going to spend in the $$ arena, it would be better to get the PCM 91, which is what I will eventually do.

As for my current recording chain... I am using...

Mackie LM3204 rack mount line mixer which I like very much. I am also using the mic pres in this unit since they are really pretty good.

RME Multiface sound card

DAW is Live 5 soon to be Live 6.

Edirol UM880 USB 8x8 MIDI controller interface.

I'm very pleased with my current setup since I haven't plopped down too much $$ and feel I've got a decent setup for what I want to do. I'm just a bedroom musician who does this just for fun and not profit.

Now, back to the Verbs, I am also looking at LXP-1 and LXP-5 since they can be gotten for pretty reasonable prices.

All I was looking for in my opening post is just opinions on the verbs I had listed, knowing that better could had with more $$, but not at my current place in time.

I always do tons of research before buying something and usually find that I can get a better sound or equipment after putting all my ducks in a row from the information I've found. That is why I'm not afraid to ask opinions to see if they line up with what I feel I've uncovered.

As with all recommendations or posts on any forum, you have to decide who you wish to listen to, read between the lines, and see who sets in the same camp as you do.

I'm not trying to insult anyone who has been in the industry forever, but like mentioned in another post, I too have thrown money on foolish equipment and software only to find that it didn't suit my needs... That is why we ask so we don't continue making bad mistakes in our future music purchases.

Also, we sometimes have to make compromises on what we want because of what we can afford at the time. If you have to compromise, it's nice to know that you're making the best choice for what you’re able to afford for now.

... And on a final note... I've always used VST synths and effects. It's only been in the last couple of years that I've decided to go hardware also. It sometimes isn't easy to try out USED equipment since you usually have to buy off the net, so trustworthy comments and opinions are all I have to lean on before buying.

Anyway, thanks everyone for voicing your opinions good, bad, polite, respectful or angry. After I cool down, I usually am able to glean what I need from a post... Usually.

Take care,
Dennis :)
 
Honestly and with all due respect this is such a curious thread.

At the very core of this forum is posters asking questions about gear in the sincere hope that someone else with perhaps more knowledge and patience is willing to share. I'm positive that in that hope was not a scolding.

The admonition that one shouldn't be silly and listen to posters opinions here, rather go out and listen for oneself is not mutually exclusive. He or she could do both and I didn't see anything in the post to contradict that. I suspect the poster already was aware of his option to trot down to Guitar Center. That to me (in and of itself) doesn't sound like all that powerful advice.

If your suggesting a level of competence is required in regard to one's question this is the wrong forum.

I get the go out and listen argument but if we apply that to every post here....this place would be empty.
 
Joseph Hanna said:
The admonition that one shouldn't be silly and listen to posters opinions here, rather go out and listen for oneself is not mutually exclusive. He or she could do both and I didn't see anything in the post to contradict that. I suspect the poster already was aware of his option to trot down to Guitar Center. That to me (in and of itself) doesn't sound like all that powerful advice.
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But that wasn't the substance of the advice he was given. I asked him to stick around and learn who is who; alternatively he could always use the search function - there's no shortage of advice available on this very subject.

Joseph Hanna said:
If your suggesting a level of competence is required in regard to one's question this is the wrong forum.
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Competence helps. Are you suggesting it doesn't?
 
Joseph Hanna said:
Honestly and with all due respect this is such a curious thread.

At the very core of this forum is posters asking questions about gear in the sincere hope that someone else with perhaps more knowledge and patience is willing to share. I'm positive that in that hope was not a scolding.

The admonition that one shouldn't be silly and listen to posters opinions here, rather go out and listen for oneself is not mutually exclusive. He or she could do both and I didn't see anything in the post to contradict that. I suspect the poster already was aware of his option to trot down to Guitar Center. That to me (in and of itself) doesn't sound like all that powerful advice.

If your suggesting a level of competence is required in regard to one's question this is the wrong forum.

I get the go out and listen argument but if we apply that to every post here....this place would be empty.
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Thank for your observations... I think you nailed it. We need to ask questions and feedback from others, that's the nature of forums...

I know it can be frustrating to continually see the same, 'What's best' threads, but if you look at my original post, I am asking for personal preferences on specific units. But moving on...

NOW, before anyone jumps on Joseph Hanna, he's right, and it's nice to see a concern about posting questions... He's also right, I could go down to my local GC to audition these, but some of the verbs I'm interested in are no longer available in stores.

My only outlet is from 'Used For Sale' forums or eBay... and this is why all your knowledge and experience is priceless and valuable.


Thanks everyone,
Dennis
 
Supercreep said:
Competence helps. Are you suggesting it doesn't?
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Again with great respect..

I'm suggesting that this is a "Home Recording" forum. It is by nature for those who either can't or don't want to elevate this to a profession. I'm suggesting that all of us have started somewhere and none of us were hatched experts and mostly I'm suggesting that this is a place that should embrace those who haven't yet figured out everything "we" have. If testing talent/experience level is a component there are FAR more appropriate sites. Perhaps Gearslutz.

The deck chairs of the Titanic have been rearranged here thousands of times and in the end the questions and discussion are all very similar in nature. I just like to see everyone get a fair chance to what after all was an effort in posting in the first place.



If you were trying to help ( and I believe you were) I missed it........my bad.
 
Putting the fire out...

Well, I thought I would update this post to let you all know my decision on the verb I got. After some thought and with the fact that my funds at this point is limited, I decided to get a Lexicon LXP-15. I just won one off eBay that is in excellent condition and comes with the User Manual rather then a PDF file.

I will add the V2 upgrade which is about $55 and have it modded. I feel at that point it will help POLISH my tunes and make them sound better than they are now.

Thanks to everyone for voicing their opinions.

Take care,
Dennis
 
Well, supercreep never tried a Sony V-77 because for around $500 you can pick one up on ebay and it is NOT and never was a budget processor by any means. Even though it's old it kicks many current reverbs behind. I'd take it over any of the models you were considering.
 
EDAN said:
Well, supercreep never tried a Sony V-77 because for around $500 you can pick one up on ebay and it is NOT and never was a budget processor by any means. Even though it's old it kicks many current reverbs behind. I'd take it over any of the models you were considering.
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Yes, I would like to get the V-77 and will in the near future. I only spent $150 with shipping on the LXP-15 I got off eBay. It turned out to have V2 installed so I got a pretty good deal. I will have it modded and will use it for now.

Thanks for posting.
Dennis
 
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