Seeking information about building a drum room

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J Man

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Hello!

I'm looking for some help on building a drum room in the basement of my house. Feel free to be as general or detailed as you want, I'm looking for all the info I can get.

Here's the situation: I am looking at an area of about 320 square feet of basement space. Two concrete walls, one block-type basement window. I will need to build two new walls and put a door in. I have three recessed flourescent light boxes located above the floor joists. The room does not need to be 100% soundproof, but I want obviously to get as much reduction as possible.

My thoughts are that I will need to frame the outside walls with standard 2x4's and 5/8 drywall, anchored to the ceiling and floor about a 1/2 inch from the concrete walls. The interior walls will probably need to be a double wall of 2x4's and drywall with similar space between them. The ceiling will probably need to be resilient channels and drywall, and the floor will be rubber gym-style floor tiles.

I'm not 100% sure on any of this though. I don't what to do about the lights, if I should move them down below the drywall ceiling (which would be very low, if not too low) or put some type of lens over them. I don't know what kind of sound leak that would create. I don't know exactly how to construct the double interior walls or if that is necessary. I also have questions about the door, if it should be a double door, a door with perhaps a cover of somekind... And finally there would be no ventiliation to the area then, which is good for keeping it sound-tight, but not so good for those inside.

If any of you experience fellows can offer some input on any of this it will be GREATLY appreciated! Thanks!
 
Hey J,

I think you would be best served by contacting John H. Brandt. He seems to post most in GS. He has gone out of his way through forum posts as well as PM's to point me in the right direction with a similar situation. He designs studios for money but is always willing to give advice without charge. If I my budget were a few hundred more, I would have gladly paid him to oversee my build. He offered the advice anyway.

jhbrandt@yahoo.com is his email. Post this thread on GS and see what you get first.

Do it right the first time man. I have learned many lessons by going the cheap route.

Jimmy

BTW, get rid of the fluorescent lights!!!
 
Thank you for your input. Which section is GS? And what's wrong with my lights?
 
Ah. True, but I'm not doing any pro quality recording, and if I do...its recording drums, not soft vocals or anything. Anyway, I should have mentioned that the sole focus of this acoustic enviornment is to keep noise from escaping the room. I'm not overly concerned about the sound inside the room.
 
Naw, I mean flourescent lights can introduce hum into your signal chain. Not that they make audible noise in the room.
 
jimmys69 said:
Naw, I mean flourescent lights can introduce hum into your signal chain. Not that they make audible noise in the room.
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:laughings: Man, those would have to be some LOUD lights!!!! :eek:

Also, you preferable want a hard floor and an absorbant ceiling, not the other way around. So, if you have a cement floor, I'd leave that as is and put fibreglass panels on the ceiling, not drywall.
 
If you have a problem with low height use wall mounted lights

Alan.
 
Thanks all! The manual link is a goldmine.

I think every answer raises another question though! Why is a hard floor and a more absorbant ceiling preferable to the reverse?

Again I don't require absolute sound isolation...are the lights a critical leak point that will render the rest of the ceiling a useless barrier if not fixed? If so, what is the best alternative?
 
Track lighting. 120v without transformers/ballasts.

Actually air ducts are usually a bigger problem than lighting boxes. You can wrap boxes with ductseal.
 
J Man said:
Thanks all! The manual link is a goldmine.

I think every answer raises another question though! Why is a hard floor and a more absorbant ceiling preferable to the reverse?

Again I don't require absolute sound isolation...are the lights a critical leak point that will render the rest of the ceiling a useless barrier if not fixed? If so, what is the best alternative?
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Well for one, The drums placed on a reflective floor, add to the brightness of the close mics as well as the overheads. A carpeted floor is only going to reduce some of the high end reflection. Having a reflective ceiling and floor will cause many problems. You cant place broadband absorbers on the floor to attenuate the rooms boomy and reflective qualities, so you treat the ceiling.

You say you don't require absolute sound isolation, yet you mention leakage from the fixtures. I think you are missing the point. Fluorescent lighting can introduce unwanted interference and noise. Just hook up a guitar to an amp under one of these and see how horrible it can be. Dimmers cause noise in an electrical circuit as well, so lighting needs to be planned out while building as the only choice you will have after placement, is wattage of the bulbs. Track lighting with multiple fixtures will allow you to create different moods without using a dimmer that will cause problems. The last type of fixture you would want to use is a fluorescent.
 
I'm sorry but I don't think I understand. My only objective is to keep noise outside of this room to a minimum for the sake of my neighbors and family upstairs. Its not a big deal to remove and replace the fluorsecents; I'm sure my guitarists would all appreciate it if thats what's always giving the amps fits...but my questions are all solely focused on how I must build this room to keep sound from getting out, given my budget and the parameters of the room itself. If these fixtures are going to be problematic as far as sound escaping upstairs, then I will address them immediately. If they will be problematic as far as recording within the room they are of secondary concern. I appreciate the help and patience, I'm obviously a bit new to the studio building game...
 
Sound isolation can be a very expensive endeavor. You have stated that you are not looking for complete isolation. Mass is the only way to stop sound from escaping. The concrete walls you have are already helping you. The ceiling is your weak point. There is much info to be found on this subject. Have you had any luck posting in GearShitz or tried to contact John B?

What others like RAMI are trying to make sure you understand, is that absorption is very necessary to make the room worth playing or recording in. Combining absorption with your isolation plans is an absolute necessity if you want to build this ONCE. Trust me, it costs way more than twice as much to do it twice.

Your lighting is just a piece of doing it all correctly the first time. You are asking the right questions so far. Just ask more and get answers from the 'pros' before settling for an uneducated guess as to what you think will work.

Jimmy
 
So far no luck at the other forum. I've been studying this like I've got a test coming up or something...its a daunting amount of information to digest and I am running into a few bits of conflicting information. For example, some sources say that typical batt insulation helps to improve a wall's STC (albeit minimally). Others say, that while great for thermal insulation, it has no effect whatsoever on acoustic noise control. Still others say that it actually makes it worse and that the dead airspace would be better than filling it with insulation.

As far as the ceiling though, while acoustic tiling might be best for the rooms recording properties, it seems that the rigidity of a drywall ceiling would be better as soundproofing. Certainly it is much, much cheaper. I wonder if the ceiling could be made of drywall and then treated later to help improve the rooms acoustics (say with maybe all the acoustic foam I have lying around, now that I realize how little it does as a soundproofing material!)

And then the lights. Maybe I could just use lamps of some kind. Then I can get those fluorescent fixtures out of there and building a completely sealed ceiling. The only openings in the room would be for the electrical boxes and the door.
 
J Man said:
some sources say that typical batt insulation helps to improve a wall's STC (albeit minimally). Others say, that while great for thermal insulation, it has no effect whatsoever on acoustic noise control. Still others say that it actually makes it worse and that the dead airspace would be better than filling it with insulation.
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Well, look at it this way. Out of the 3 conflicting bits of information that you stated, even if the best of the 3 is true, then the best you can hope for is "MINIMALLY". That should tell you something right there.

As far as the ceiling though, while acoustic tiling might be best for the rooms recording properties, it seems that the rigidity of a drywall ceiling would be better as soundproofing. Certainly it is much, much cheaper.
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Drywall will not do much "sound-proofing". Even if it did, there's more to stopping sound from getting in/out than just the walls. Sound travels through ducts, gets passed from walls to joists, etc....Sound-proofing is a very somplicated, involved, and expensive endeavor.
improve the rooms acoustics (say with maybe all the acoustic foam I have lying around, now that I realize how little it does as a soundproofing material!)
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It does just about as little for sound-treatment, too. Forget foam for sound-treatment or sound-proofing.
 
leaningpine said:
What about Egg Crates?.....:p
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Sorry, the standard replay for egg crates has appeared.

doublefacepalm.webp

I was told by the insulation place that I bought the insulation for my studio from that they treat sound like water. If there is a gap and water will get through, and so will sound, it's a good comparison. I actually change this thought to air, if air can get through so can sound.

1,To reduce the sound getting out / in, no gaps in the structure, no gaps in the closed door(s).

2,Structure needs mass, thick solid material for walls ceiling. High density insulation.

3, De-couple from existing structure, or if it's not possible de-couple as much as possible.

Alan.
 
Aww fuck! I just had one of those times where I pressed a wrong button after a perfect response. I hate that!!!

J Man, summarizing my own shit. Mass and decoupling best for isolation. Drywall better than fiberglass or foam for this. Foam may have some use, like looking cool, maybe. Treat ceiling after rock. At very least add intake and exhaust ventilation for drum room. RAMI and I both know chicks dig sweaty drummers. But not stinky ones in a stagnant room. The exhaust should be vented into the green room where the groupies wait for some good drummer lovin. :)
 
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