Ribbon mic's

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perceive

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Hi everyone.
Just a quick discussion - hopefully something that will kick off a bunch of replies.. I know there are many talks here about a bunch of mics but I want to concentrate on ribbon's.
Personally I am likely mainly to record guitars (electric and acoustic) using both a sennheiser e906 and a ribbon.
My question/discussion point is: which ribbon mic do you use, which mic pre do you match with it, and what are you recording with this setup? I am very interested in all the setups people have in regards to ribbons and the more information the more i will be assured that I will have a good selection to choose from!
 
Just my personal opinion, tube pres really open up ribbon mics. The two ribbons that I've had the greatest success with are the beyerdynamic m-160 and the Shure 330. The beyer seems to do the overdrive thing a bit better but both give the guitar the depth it deserves. I often pair them with Bogen tube pres (the MX series, even a PA from this series works well as a pre) from the 60s. They put out tons of gain and really add something to any signal.
 
I use an sE R1 Ribbon through either an ART MPA GOLD or through a Focusrite.
The sE R1 has been getting a lot of good guitar amp comments as, from what I have read, it comes across a bit brighter ie cutting through the mix.
However there are a ton of ribbons out there nowadays to choose from.
Good Luck!
 
I have heard the results of the AEA, how would you say that compares to the beyer? Tonally etc..... A difficult comparison I am sure but ... I might as well ask! :D:eek:
 
perceive said:
I have heard the results of the AEA, how would you say that compares to the beyer? Tonally etc..... A difficult comparison I am sure but ... I might as well ask! :D:eek:
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The R84 is a bigger, fuller mic. Slightly darker and with substantial proximity effect. It is not really intended for close micing (AEA makes the R92 for that purpose). Things often sound better with the mic at some distance from the source (put a 57 on the grill of the cab and your R84 a couple feet back). The M160 is drier and flatter with much less proximity effect. It is a hypercardioid so it works pretty well as a spot mic. I have a pair and sometimes use them for overheads. I understand that you can do MS recording with the R84 (figure of 8) and the M160 together, although I've never tried.

They both have their uses.
 
pohaku said:
The R84 is a bigger, fuller mic. Slightly darker and with substantial proximity effect. It is not really intended for close micing (AEA makes the R92 for that purpose). Things often sound better with the mic at some distance from the source (put a 57 on the grill of the cab and your R84 a couple feet back). The M160 is drier and flatter with much less proximity effect. It is a hypercardioid so it works pretty well as a spot mic. I have a pair and sometimes use them for overheads. I understand that you can do MS recording with the R84 (figure of 8) and the M160 together, although I've never tried.

They both have their uses.
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Good points. The R84 is often used on movie sets and broadcast sets on a boom. I use the Beyer M160 as a room mic and blend it in the mix. You will need a pre with 70+ db of gain to really work well. With out that you will have to boost the gain in your software. I recently acquired the AEA TRP, a quiet, clean high gain pre. Works well. Tube pres will work well too, but will be a little noisy due to the higher gain required.
 
Soundmind?? said:
Good points. The R84 is often used on movie sets and broadcast sets on a boom. I use the Beyer M160 as a room mic and blend it in the mix. You will need a pre with 70+ db of gain to really work well. With out that you will have to boost the gain in your software. I recently acquired the AEA TRP, a quiet, clean high gain pre. Works well. Tube pres will work well too, but will be a little noisy due to the higher gain required.
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That could be a bit of a concern my current pre isa vt737 but I am looking at options..
The Rack forum has made a few suggestions of which I am investigating a couple, such as the sebatron tube pre and also the chameleon labs and safe sounds pre's..
70dB does seem a bit though I am not surprised...seems that a good pre that matches that gain requirement would need to be budgeted to?
 
leadfootdriver said:
I bought the CAD trion 7000. It has a huge proximity effect. It seems to accell at being a room mic. I don't have a good room to use it in.

Wanna buy it? :D
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Problem with these things is postage is normally a killer :eek::p
 
perceive said:
That could be a bit of a concern my current pre isa vt737 but I am looking at options..
The Rack forum has made a few suggestions of which I am investigating a couple, such as the sebatron tube pre and also the chameleon labs and safe sounds pre's..
70dB does seem a bit though I am not surprised...seems that a good pre that matches that gain requirement would need to be budgeted to?
Click to expand...

The VT737 has about 58db of gain? Yeah, I think you might want more than that if you plan on using ribbons. That could work on loud sources (I assume the Avalon is a very quiet pre - I've never used one), but you will want more than that if you do anything else.

The Chameleon Labs pre puts out about 80 db of gain which should be more than enough. I've not used one but it seems well regarded. I mostly use my APIs, A-Designs P1 and Purple Buzz which generate between 65 and 75db of gain. I'm thinking of picking up one of the AEA TRPs as well since I have about a dozen ribbon mics of varying parentage.
 
pohaku said:
The VT737 has about 58db of gain? Yeah, I think you might want more than that if you plan on using ribbons. That could work on loud sources (I assume the Avalon is a very quiet pre - I've never used one), but you will want more than that if you do anything else.

The Chameleon Labs pre puts out about 80 db of gain which should be more than enough. I've not used one but it seems well regarded. I mostly use my APIs, A-Designs P1 and Purple Buzz which generate between 65 and 75db of gain. I'm thinking of picking up one of the AEA TRPs as well since I have about a dozen ribbon mics of varying parentage.
Click to expand...

58 dB is about right - after what you have said I will definitely add +70 dB as a requirement.
The avalon is pretty quiet but I always figured it was best paired with a good condensor..
Thanks for all the advice.
 
pohaku said:
The VT737 has about 58db of gain? Yeah, I think you might want more than that if you plan on using ribbons. That could work on loud sources (I assume the Avalon is a very quiet pre - I've never used one), but you will want more than that if you do anything else.

The Chameleon Labs pre puts out about 80 db of gain which should be more than enough. I've not used one but it seems well regarded. I mostly use my APIs, A-Designs P1 and Purple Buzz which generate between 65 and 75db of gain. I'm thinking of picking up one of the AEA TRPs as well since I have about a dozen ribbon mics of varying parentage.
Click to expand...

Okay I now have a sebatron cygnus x2 on the way - solid state but two channel with with 70dB clean gain.
Hopefully this will do what I need, it will hopefully turn up the end of this week at the latest...
 
dickiefunk said:
Hi. I'm also interested in ribbon mics and am wondering if I should go for one to compliment my Rode NT1a and Studio Projects B1? I will be mainly recording vocals and will be using a DMP3 and VTB1 pres.
I've seen the T.Bone RM700 over at Thomann and am wondering if anyone has had any experience with these?

http://www.thomann.de/index.html?partner_id=97926&page=gb/the_tbone_rm700.htm
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Not sure about that particular mic but may I ask what you don't like about your current mic's? A ribbon will, generally, capture good clarity but tend to sound "darker" than a condensor. If you find the NT1a bright for instance a ribbon may suit (I found the nt1a personally to be bright for my tastes - but again that is my tastes there...)
This is general rule of thumb stuff, not applicable to that mic exactly but there as a general rule for ribbon's...
 
dickiefunk said:
Hi. I'm also interested in ribbon mics and am wondering if I should go for one to compliment my Rode NT1a and Studio Projects B1? I will be mainly recording vocals and will be using a DMP3 and VTB1 pres.
I've seen the T.Bone RM700 over at Thomann and am wondering if anyone has had any experience with these?

http://www.thomann.de/index.html?partner_id=97926&page=gb/the_tbone_rm700.htm
Click to expand...

I believe that's the Nady RSM-4. One of the standard Chinese designs. The only difference, AFAIK, is that, unlike Nady, Thomann doesn't build in a six or seven hundred percent profit margin....
 
hungovermorning said:
Just my personal opinion, tube pres really open up ribbon mics. The two ribbons that I've had the greatest success with are the beyerdynamic m-160 and the Shure 330. The beyer seems to do the overdrive thing a bit better but both give the guitar the depth it deserves. I often pair them with Bogen tube pres (the MX series, even a PA from this series works well as a pre) from the 60s. They put out tons of gain and really add something to any signal.
Click to expand...

OK, the other guy from Columbia has to chime in.... don't overlook the old Altec tube gear, too. I use my Altec 1567a all the time. It's a 4-in, 1-out mike mixer. Four transformered mike preamp channels, a recording output and one transformered main output. It has input level controls, a recording output right after the first summing stage, then on through bass and treble EQ stages and to the main output with a master gain control, so it can be relatively clean or get pretty dirty. It also has, oh, about 97 dB of gain, though of course that setting would be pretty darn noisy.

Cheers,

Otto
 
i just bought an aea r92. i am about to go out to the studio to give it a run through. will let you all know how it goes.
 
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