Referencing a Mix on a Sh*tty Speaker

[DM60]

I think it has been discussed, either directly or indirectly. Using a bad speaker to check a mix on just to check how the mix will sound on a system most people will be listening on (except when you are the only listener) . It seems like a logical idea, if it sounds good on this ....

Just curious if anyone has tried or is doing this and do you feel it has helped your mixes for general consumption. I am going to try this in my next sessions, but wanted to know of others have tried this.

 

[bouldersoundguy]

I'd say it's more specifically about checking on bandwidth limited speakers, lacking in lows and/or highs. There are things you can do to give sources like kick drum or bass guitar some presence on smaller speakers.

Using speakers with more serious deficiencies (bad resonances, crossover response holes etc.) probably won't help. You'd have to handicap your mix too much to account for those.

 

[spantini]

I haven't actually done this yet, but . .

My immediate thoughts went straight to The Beatles' single "sh*tty" monitor speaker (I forget which speaker that was, may not have been "sh*itty, just a "sh*itty listening experience). So I've been planning on getting some 5-inch monitors (not a cube) to sit atop my big 10-in... no, wait.. scratch that... - to sit atop my 8-inch monitors and use something like a Mackie Big Knob to go 8's or 5's or just a single 5 in mono.

 

[JimmyS1969]

I think it has been discussed, either directly or indirectly. Using a bad speaker to check a mix on just to check how the mix will sound on a system most people will be listening on (except when you are the only listener) . It seems like a logical idea, if it sounds good on this ....

Just curious if anyone has tried or is doing this and do you feel it has helped your mixes for general consumption. I am going to try this in my next sessions, but wanted to know of others have tried this.

I used to do that early on. Had a wall of multiple speakers from boom box ones, to high fidelity speakers. I'm sure the old school members recall seeing my 'wall of speakers'. In hindsight, it was in the end ridiculous...

Problem was, they were all in the same room. The same room issues basically made the idea worthless.

Once I treated my room better and got decent monitors, things just got way easier.

Now I still have an issue with my room modes, so 70 to 100 hz or so is not accurate in my room no matter what the treatment. So I still do check mixes in other places like my SUV. The more I 'learn' my monitors in my room, the better I am able to compensate for the impossibilities of hearing those frequencies accurately because of my room modes. The shit just isn't there. It's physics...

So just check on other playback systems, and learn how to address issues in your studio. It takes time. Or a shit ton of money and treatment/monitors to get past it. It can be done well without that expense tho... Just takes time.

 

[RFR]

Lots of people check on a laptop. Because of it’s portable nature you can check your mix in a multitude of environments out of your mixing space

 

[mbsmike]

I have often wondered how people handle this. I just went from a good mix in the studio then listening on Bluetooth speakers, headphones & my SUV (great speakers) then tweaking until those sound great. Then I send it to my brother for him to listen on a couple of devices and listen to his feedback to facilitate any further tweaks. I will say that the more mixing I've done the less tweaks are necessary. But still my iPhone has no bass no matter what I do hehe.

 

[rob aylestone]

I tried using 12/1” pa boxes when I was mixing for theatres to replicate the sound of a big PA. In truth, it didn’t work that well. Plus some music just sounds bizarre when your left and right are fifty feet apart! Like the extended mix of donna summer’s I feel love, I included in walking in music yesterday. This has loads of panning and eq changes and appeared to be moving around the room in a really interesting way. The music I mixed on the pa speakers was pretty horrible on most other devices. Bass heavy or bass light randomly.

 

[Papanate]

That’s only worthwhile if you think you have a large audience with crappy speakers - most kids and a medium amount of adults listen to music on EarBuds - and you can mix with EarBuds - but it’s very difficult to judge a mix - Generally you will mix to your NearFields - Then do streaming mixes, CD mix, LP Mix and a EarBud mix - and really you only need a EQ on the Master Buss to immatate the EQ Curves of the different mediums.

 

[drtechno]

I think it has been discussed, either directly or indirectly. Using a bad speaker to check a mix on just to check how the mix will sound on a system most people will be listening on (except when you are the only listener) . It seems like a logical idea, if it sounds good on this ....

Just curious if anyone has tried or is doing this and do you feel it has helped your mixes for general consumption. I am going to try this in my next sessions, but wanted to know of others have tried this.

Its the reason why I still have my NS10s from my old crappy yamaha stereo.

 

[markmann]

Don't forget about sh*tty headphones.

I have definitely done it but I do it less now because I've learned how I generally correct for other devices and do it up front.

 

[grimtraveller]

I think it has been discussed, either directly or indirectly. Using a bad speaker to check a mix on just to check how the mix will sound on a system most people will be listening on (except when you are the only listener) . It seems like a logical idea, if it sounds good on this ....

I guess the only shitty speaker I might use to check a mix are the ones on my laptop but even then, I never take any notice in terms of changing things because of that sound because the sound is by its very nature shitty.
I'm still in that zone of testing a mix on a variety of mediums {boom box, computer speakers, laptop, car, TV, headphones, mono headphones, iPod, front room stereo, bedroom stereo}. There's a nice variety of speakers there but a mix will have to sound utterly terrible {unless I have a change of mind about something} for me to do a remix.

 

[DM60]

I guess the only shitty speaker I might use to check a mix are the ones on my laptop but even then, I never take any notice in terms of changing things because of that sound because the sound is by its very nature shitty.
I'm still in that zone of testing a mix on a variety of mediums {boom box, computer speakers, laptop, car, TV, headphones, mono headphones, iPod, front room stereo, bedroom stereo}. There's a nice variety of speakers there but a mix will have to sound utterly terrible {unless I have a change of mind about something} for me to do a remix.

I think this is still the norm. But the sh*tty speaker might shorten the time for the feel like the mix translates well across variety of listening environments. But something I will look at int eh future. Like how will it sound on an old AM radio

 

[TimOD]

I check on earbuds. Bose Sport in my case, but I always check mixes on studio phones too. I run the studio phones through a Little Labs headphone amp. The vast majority of people listen on earbuds, but also those JBL type all in one speaker, like the Flip 6 too, and then there's the car, with wildly different-sounding systems in them from make to make and even car to car. Why would I want to check a mix on a shitty speaker? I don't really care if it "translates" at all on some shite speaker that virtually no one would listen to music on, and if the mix sounds good on the phones, in the room, and in the earbuds, well then.

 

[DM60]

I check on earbuds. Bose Sport in my case, but I always check mixes on studio phones too. I run the studio phones through a Little Labs headphone amp. The vast majority of people listen on earbuds, but also those JBL type all in one speaker, like the Flip 6 too, and then there's the car, with wildly different-sounding systems in them from make to make and even car to car. Why would I want to check a mix on a shitty speaker? I don't really care if it "translates" at all on some shite speaker that virtually no one would listen to music on, and if the mix sounds good on the phones, in the room, and in the earbuds, well then.

I think in the end, if you don't want to, then don't. It is not a matter of what you should or shouldn't do, it is mainly for a discussion of "how best to check your mix for optimal translation". Therefore, you not checking "on a shitty speaker" is fine if you don't think your mixes require it. I would say that is true in general. YOUR mix translation is what you want it to be.

 

[Farview]

It's all about translation. I had a set of big speakers and near fields that I found is I could go back and forth between them without the mix changing, it would translate well.

By "the mix changing" I mean that that nothing jumps out or disappears on one speaker or the other. All the instruments stay in the same place in the mix.

 

[JimmyS1969]

I kind of do that too. I have a pair of I loud little guys for that.

 

[DM60]

I do think as you get to know your rig, that sort of thing goes by the way side. You just start to "know". But I still think there are new people that come on here and they should read how to get there.

Sometime many on here just forget that there is a starting point, tips on how to grow into it. We should keep that in mind when we post. When I read something that I think, hey that might be a good tip for the beginner, I usually do it to see what the validity of the trick is with people I know who know. You know you know, when you know that you know, then you know. Word salad served fresh.

 

[Farview]

It is good to point out that the goal is to make the mix work on a variety of systems, not to make it sound the same on a variety of systems.

 

[JimmyS1969]

I do think as you get to know your rig, that sort of thing goes by the way side. You just start to "know". But I still think there are new people that come on here and they should read how to get there.

Sometime many on here just forget that there is a starting point, tips on how to grow into it. We should keep that in mind when we post. When I read something that I think, hey that might be a good tip for the beginner, I usually do it to see what the validity of the trick is with people I know who know. You know you know, when you know that you know, then you know. Word salad served fresh.

It is a hard thing for those that are new to recording and mixing to take advice like 'give it time - it will make more sense later'.

I was there once, and just wanted to know how to get it right now! We'll, that is not possible without experience.

For years I looked for the perfect plugin, the best advice to get high end commercial product from no experience and limited gear.

It just doesn't happen. It does just take time. And for some, they never get it. Not everyone is a great player. Not everyone is a great producer. He'll, some of us can't even hear right!

But we do what we can until we get where we get more comfortable and it gets easier. For some, longer than others.


There are no secrets. Only advice. Some wrong. Some right.

Best one can do is do it until you figure out what works for you.


It's a hard lesson, but nonetheless, it's true.

 

[grimtraveller]

I do think as you get to know your rig, that sort of thing goes by the way side. You just start to "know". But I still think there are new people that come on here and they should read how to get there.

Sometime many on here just forget that there is a starting point, tips on how to grow into it. We should keep that in mind when we post

I think this is very true. And not only here. My observation and experience has been for decades that many of those that 'know' often have not had what it takes to teach or communicate simplicity in a way that can be simply picked up.

It is a hard thing for those that are new to recording and mixing to take advice like 'give it time - it will make more sense later'

This is equally true. Many people want to be perfect yesterday and the words 'wait' and 'patience' are like calling someone a pervert, racist or thief.
I have long felt that instead of communicating that one's way of getting somewhere is the only way, one should communicate that it is their way and they find it the best way. There's a subtle difference. And if someone doesn't choose to listen and consider, allow them to go on their own merry way.

It is good to point out that the goal is to make the mix work on a variety of systems, not to make it sound the same on a variety of systems.

This should really be the tagline in the mixing section. The former is eminently sensible and takes into account the possible variables, the latter is sonically impossible given the variables that present themselves.