Recording Vocals. Multi-mics for room sound?

[elenore19]

Hey everybody, long time since I've been on here. I'll try to keep this brief and to the point. If I should look elsewhere please let me know asap and thank you in advance!

Looking for advice on getting room sound with vocals using multiple mics. My place sounds great and I want to utilize that as much as possible but I have no idea where to start. Just mic'ing normally with my vocal isolation thing (like this LyxPro VRI-20 Portable Sound Absorbing Vocal Recording Panel - Stand Mount: Amazon.ca: Musical Instruments, Stage & Studio) and putting some c1000's in the room at a distance? Is there a set distance to put them to help with phase?
Just spit balling. Any help is greatly appreciated, thanks for taking your time to help.

-Elliot




STUFF
Gear:
Running through two P2 analog preamps..
My main mic (my baby) is a neumann tlm-102. I have plenty of other mics though--the only other condenser i have(not too sure on the validity of that statement) is a sennheiser ME66 short shotgun. Oh and I have two akg's C1000s.Otherwise I have plenty of dynamics.. Sm57, plenty of audix i5's (57 "equivalents"), some super generic dynamics, a behringer "equivalent" to a 58. etc.

Room: (not sure if this info helps, but figured I'd post it)
Wooden walled tongue and groove cabin (small space...15x15?) with vaulted ceiling.

 

[bouldersoundguy]

Is there a set distance to put them to help with phase?

Yes, 0 is the best distance for preventing phase problems. Otherwise, put them where they pick up the least direct sound from the singer.

If I used room mics I might place them behind the singer, or as far from the singer as possible without getting too close to boundaries (walls, floor ceiling). Given your selection perhaps the pair of C1000Ss. Try coincident (X-Y) and spaced pairs. For capturing the room it's probably okay to try an abnormally wide spacing. Be sure whatever mic array you use puts the singer right in the center of the image since you're going to get bleed.

How about just singing farther from the mic?

 

[Jake_JW]

I'd try a spaced pair of mics near the corners on one wall, with the singer and a close-mic in the middle. I've had good results (sometimes) by putting the singer at one point of an equilateral triangle made of mics. I've gradually stopped adding room sound to vocals I record though, I find it isn't too useful in my mixes when I'm adding reverb to other things I ended up not using it 9 times out of 10.

I know it's not going to be doable with your mics, but M/S pair's on vocals can work well, and I've had some luck with using a close mic (condenser) and a ribbon mic further back (3-4ft). Got to be careful with auditioning the mic placement though to avoid phase problems. Worth a try with a condenser perhaps.

 

[mjbphotos]

Dynamics definitely won't help you capture the room sound well. A square room may not record all that well, either - things that sound good to your ears won't necessarily translate well to a recording.
Using one of those reflection trap panels would defeat the purpose, no? You want the reflections to be getting out into the room - what those panels do is absorb (maybe?) the initial soundwaves so they don't bounce around off the walls and end up back in the mic from the back/side walls.

 

[RawDepth]

Yeah, if you want the room, remove that vocal panel thingy and use an omni condenser. That's the only way to avoid phase issues.

Personally, I can't stand room mics on anything. I've tracked my rooms on several occasions, but have always curled up my nose at it during playback. I'll just keep on tweaking my old reverb until the knobs fall off, thank you. (But then, I don't happen to have a wooden cathedral to record in either.)