Recording off the FOH board?

[EddieRay]

Can you take direct outs from a FOH mixer, run them through another mixer, then record to (--your media of choice here--)?

Just last weekend I recorded a "mini concert" at a local venue. I brought mics and cables in case I needed them but ended up taking feeds of the board (Carvin 24 channel) for the FOH mix. I had not done that before.

I had the sound guy send all 3 vocal channels to EFX2, and 5 drum channels to EFX3. I recorded to ADAT from the 2 EFX sends and from the inserts for the guitars and bass. The signals were a bit hot for guitars and bass so I slipped in an RNC between the board and the ADAT. Having only 2 channels of compression I was unable to treat one of the guitars. Fortunately the end result did not have any bad clipping despite the ADAT meter showing lots of red for that track.

The bottom line is that I could have done some better planning for this. I'm thinking I could have run the inserts and EFX sends from the main mixer to my own board, giving me better control over the recorded levels. But can this be done? I don't know how often I'll be doing this and I'm not in a position to go experiment beforehand. Thanks for comments...

 

[guitarfreak12]

if you come out of the inserts, you're at the mercy of his gain settings, but they might be too hot, then again, I think it might bypass his faders by doing that. Not sure, interesting though

 

[timboZ]

I do it all the time.
Plug into the insert, only push it in part way (the first click) then into your recorder.
Most insert will be post gain and pre EQ. If it is to hot on the board you may have to hot of a level for your recorder.

If you go direct out the levels will change along with the faders on the FOH board and be post EQ.

 

[boingoman]

Sounds like you did a good job thinking through the situation at hand.
The short answer to your question is yes. You can take the outputs from another board and run them through yours.

Whether you have the sends available or not, is another question. That depends on the FOH equipment and the guy running it.

 

[EddieRay]

I do it all the time.
Plug into the insert, only push it in part way (the first click) then into your recorder.
Most insert will be post gain and pre EQ. If it is to hot on the board you may have to hot of a level for your recorder.

If you go direct out the levels will change along with the faders on the FOH board and be post EQ.

I think they were labelled DIR/INS on this Carvin board. I pushed the TS cables partially intop them and it worked gooder than I expected. They were indeed post-fader and one of the tracks was too hot. But when I listened back there was no digital distortion.

I did not enjoy being at someone else's mercy. So what I want to know is, can I run from inserts of the FOH board to my own board and THEN to the recorder?

 

[boingoman]

I think they were labelled DIR/INS on this Carvin board. I pushed the TS cables partially intop them and it worked gooder than I expected. They were indeed post-fader and one of the tracks was too hot. But when I listened back there was no digital distortion.

I did not enjoy being at someone else's mercy. So what I want to know is, can I run from inserts of the FOH board to my own board and THEN to the recorder?

Yes, but relying on this is asking for trouble, as many times the FOH person is going to be using the inserts for gates and comps. I know I do. If you really want to do multi-tracking from FOH, get a splitter. A split need not be anything more than y-cables and an XLR snake, if you use the same AC as FOH. That will kill 99% of ground loop problems.

 

[johnsuitcase]

I just picked up some ART Splitcom transformer isolated splitter boxes. I haven't received them yet, so I can't say whether they sound great, but using Iso-splitters will give you the feed directly from the mic, isolated from FOH. The problem with using the ysplitters (non-isolated) is that if the soundman changes his gain settings, it can change the impedance of the circuit, and your levels can be effected (I'm no electrical engineer, so if that's wrong feel free to jump in.) Or if you or he were to switch off your board, etc.

Anyway, your best bet for quality and safety is some form of transformer isolated splitter.

 

[bigtoe]

i did a job a couple weeks ago where we took feeds from the FOH into a hd24. it didn't turn out as well as expected in spots. the FOH guy has his job to do... you have yours...sometimes they don't work well together. i'd say 90% worked out well on that particular job...but you kind of want 100%!

i agree a splitter is the way to go, though they can be pricey. one place in town here has one by the stage for a (non-existent) monitor board, i believe... call ahead - they may have one at the location already.

later-
Mike

 

[EddieRay]

Splitters eh? Well, I'm always on the lookout for new equipment I can't live without. Thanks mucho!