recording "live"

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ducktape

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Hello everyone,
My sons band is playing in a Battle of the Bands contest at a local school. I would like to record it "live"so they can use it on their CD in the future. I am going to have a tape deck running out of the board so naturally the vocals will be picked up on tape, but I'm not sure the instruments & crowd will be heard on the tape. Where is the best places to place the mics to pick up the music and the crowd?
I would greatly appreciate any input anyone can give me on this little problem.

Thanks,
Ducktape
 
If you are hooking into the main mixing board, you sould be just fine.

I would hope that the entire band will be running through the board.

You would also be suprised at how well the stage mics will pick up the crowd.

I have done some live recording before and the crowd was picked up quite well.
 
The best thing I have used for live miking in a crowded room is called PZM or pressure zone mike.It looks like a flat plate with a little condensor capsule tucked away in a recess so that sound can only arrive from a single point source.This eliminates all the funky echoes and room resonances you normally get.
Tracking live off the board will sound weird because the relative levels will be off (vocals too hot,not enough bass etc.).Because live guys depend on the ambient sound of their amps and only add enough PA to make up the difference.
Radio Shack no longer makes their PZM,but scads are available on the used market.Crown Itl. holds the patent and they sell a number of models.Some are specifically for voice only (used in a business conference scenario)so check the frequency specs if you decide to go that route.
An alternative would be various stereo miking techniques like coincident pair.In that case get the mikes way up in the air (10-12 feet)but beware the echoes and bring a graphic eq to tame the room.Good luck!

Tom
 
Like Tom said recording the board mix might give you an unbalanced final product, the instruments that are loudest without the aid of the PA - Cymbals, Guitars etc - will tend to be softer on the tape, whereas the quieter stuff - Vocals and probably bass - might be way too loud.

Having said that , it all depends on the venue. In a large outdoor venue where the volume of the stage becomes less significant, your chances of getting a balanced mix on tape are better. It's possible in a smaller indoor venue too, if the stage acoustics are such that the band can comfortably set their monitor/amp levels so that they sound mixed without the PA on from the mix position. If possible try to get them to set a balanced stage sound and you might have a decent shot of getting it right on tape.

It is probably a good idea to talk to the live engineer who is doing the show to let him know that you want to record, he might not appreciate you showing up unannounced and hassling him to connect your tape deck, give you an AC outlet, get an XLR to RCA cable, send you a test signal, etc. Also he might just have a tape or MD or DAT recorder already wired into his rack, in which case you might just need to supply the blank media.
 
Thanks everyone,
For all the great info, I'm trying to get his band there early so we have some time to set things up. The last time he played at this school they had some students running everything, I used to work in a band here in Upstate New York so I probably know more about the gear there using then they do. I let everyone know how it turned out.

see ya,
Ducktape
 
a real problem, you'll never get a decent balance straight out of the console, unless everything is miked and the stage sound is neglectable.
Perhaps you should invest something like 500 bucks in a small 4 track recorder, which would allow you to take L & R our of the board, and use the other 2 channels for a stereo room mix.
 
This is going to be a battle of the bands contest. The last time his band was in it there was not enough mics to go around. They had mics for the vocals and nothing for the drum kit or the guitars. Also if you want to send me the $500.00 I'll go out and buy that 4-track for the show- ha,ha.

thanks for the info,
Ducktape
 
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